What do you guys think? Have I been copied?

RDT

RDT

Joined
Dec 17, 1999
Messages
4,117
So I get some contact from some loyal customers and potential customers that there's a fella making a design way too close to one of my own One I'm kinda known for.

To my onw knowledge about 6 or more years ago I started making this specific design and about 5 years ago started making the larger version.

Now I don't own anything but, it is something I am recognized for.

Anyway, so I am given the designers name and makers name. Turns out the designer is a fella who contacted me about a year ago and wanted order this very design! Well that shocked me.

he then backed out last minuted but ordered a much less expensive knife which he said he really liked.

So I recieve pics osaid knife and guess what.... it s the same fella and to my eyes essentially the same design but for the handle style and slightly less curvature in the blade.

I have attached the small and large examples of my knife and the same of his.

I just wanna get some un prejudiced feedback as to whether my customers and I am just seeing things where they don't exist.

Any input is greatly appreciated.
R
 

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Now these are pics of his knife.
 

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Yep, you have been ripped, but unless you copyrighted the design, he can get away with it. Sorry, it is sad that some folks have no original thoughts of their own and have to copy. On the other hand, you can be proud that of all the designs out there, he chose yours to knock off. If I were you, probably would take the high road, forget it, or call him and tell him you appreciated he chose you. It is true, the sincerest form of flattery is imitation.
Just my two cents, no change required.
James
 
Hopefully he isn't trying to take full credit for the design. As a new knife maker, I think I would be humbled that someone was trying to make a knife like mine. Just imagine how many Loveless copies are out there. If it is something that you are wanting to be known for, you do need some type of copyright, which is a good thing. Just hope that, if he is like most of you guys on here, when he talks about the knife he mentions that it was inspired by you.
Sweet knife, by the way. I only dream of making something that nice one day.

Dave
 
You may have been copied, but the quality is nowhere near as good as yours. You're still on top.
 
I'm with bjalongi on this one. No argument thats a copy but fit and finish aren't nearly as well done. Overall yours is just much better. Not sure what I'd do if I were in your shoes. Tough call on what to do though.

SDS
 
Much obliged fellas! Yeah I thought most would agree, it's pretty obvious and the fact that the guy who designed this was questioning me on the very same knife a year earlier tells me the same thing. It doesn't take Sherlock Holmes to put those two together.

As for the knifemaker, I'd wager he has no knowledge of my work so I can't fault him at all.

Like most makers I've met over the years, he's probably a nice fella just trying to make some good knives and occasionally being commissioned to make a customer's design, as in this case.

Gonna speak with the Maker later today hopefully.

Thanks as well for the comments on my knife!

Sincerely
R
 
If you still are stamping your knifes with the logo or your makers stamp there is no way he can get ANY credits. And if he is making the same or similar stamp - he is a criminal and probably can be brought to justice.
IMHO...
 
IMO, you should be flattered. The silhouettes look the same but fit, quality and finish are miles apart.
 
No he's not copying the logo at all. If that were the case we'd be in court...LOL

No, as I stated he's probably a nice fella who was just commissioned by my would be customer to make this knife as a copy of my own for less money.

I just emailed the maker and we will see how it goes. I don't want to give his name because I don't feel he's done anything wrong and wouldn't want to stamp him with a negative label.

It's more the customer/designer who paid this maker to make it I think that is at fault.

I couldn't believe it when I checked back in my email and found this customer from a year ago, inquiring on this very same model and then backing our for lack of funds. This knife however costs less than half of my version, wham! Putting 2 and 2 together and we have a copy out there.

What bothers me most is that this Knifemaker is relatively unknown as far as I know and well, he could make a name among Karambit fans with my design.
 
I don't think that the guy did a very good job of making a copy, but the back of the blade, in general outline, and does look similar to yours. This is a problem that Charlie and I have run into on several occasions. We have had people walk up to our table at the Blade Show, point to a knife and say "that one" and a photographer pops a picture and they both turn and walk away with out a word spoken to either of us. We had a person (with no name tag) at the Blade Show walk up to our table with a maker (name tag) and pick up one of our knives and discuss making one standing in front of our table. We recently had a customer send us a picture of a Loveless knife that he wanted us to copy. Charlie told him that we do not intentionally copy other makers knives and that we had a similar sized knife that was of our design that we would be glad to make for him. He wanted a copy of that particular knife. We gave him the name of a person that deals in Loveless knives and suggested that if he wanted a Loveless that he would never be satisfied with a copy.

One thing that all makers need to realize is that knives have been around a long time. There isn't very much that is new or hasn't been done before. If we think it is new, the design was likely done before and just wasn't popular enough for the maker to keep producing it. The design was eventually lost until the next maker "discovers it".

I have a drop point trench knife made by Puma in the early1900's. Makes you wonder who all saw that design and thought it would be a good hunter. Charlie has a picture of an ancient integral clip point blade that is made of flint. Bowie Knife??

All this being said, there are makers out there that will always be looking to other makers for inspiration. Isn't it wonderful to be an inspiration to others?
 
WOW, they actually stood at your table and discussed having the same knife made? INSANE! Did you tell them to get lost?...LOL

We all know making a living doing this isn't easy, so why in the world would anyone blatantly attempt to take food off your table in your face that way?

Amazing!

Well, the Maker and I exchanged email comm and he was very pleasant and understanding. It was just as I had thought and the maker admitted that the designer also sent this maker my website as a reference I guess. He made 10 of them and I am supposed to call him later to discuss altering it somewhat.

Granted, I didn't invent the wheel and cetainly a design like mine exists someplace just not to my knowledge before me. At least not with the same angles and serrations nor on a Karambit.

BUT, I can't really do much except talk about it...LOL Oh well.

Thanks guys!
 
I just have to compliment you on having such a good attitude and keeping your cool about this. First off, life's too short, and secondly, I'm sure your generosity with the maker will find it's way back to you. Good on ya!
 
Copied? I don't know.

Inspired? For sure.

I personally see his knife as a mix of your knife and a reversed WSK.

Like this one:
2142073492_b44a1dd843.jpg


It's a model by Cousin Jack, member here. It looks like Perrin's griffe. But, as I asled him and as he said. It's inspired, but not copied. I really like Cousin Jack's work, don't get me wrong.
3_griffes.jpg


Do you guys listen to classical music? Some composer just took main melodies from another's composer, and developped around it. They call these "Variation on a theme by XX". In the same way, some knifemakers might take lines from knives they like, mix them, and develop around it.

It's not a bad thing to get inspired by other's work, but it's not bad either to admit it.

(and yes your model looks better, way better if you ask me)
 
I see your point but for the actual knife you posted. Looks nothing like it, not in my eyes? Am I missing something? Seriously, point out the similarities but for the finger ring.

It is more the La Griffe. BTW, as an example the La Griffe is perfect! Emerson used Freds design and he included his name on the knife and probably a gratuity. Neither of which I was looking for on this, just admission and if possible the proper alteration.

Thanks!
 
Although a newbie, and weighing in on a different aspect..but I do agree that imitation is the sincerist form of flattery (for the most part). The maker was up front about it and it seems you have stuff going on to work things out.

I know I personally like some other knife makers designs and am inspired by them, but dont plan on selling them. For example--I like the Tops ALRT, however it is quite a unique style in taht even if you alter a few things (which I have in my design) its still very similar. I plan on making two of my spin on the ALRT design, but not for any profit and I readily admit it was inspired by the Tops knife. However (and especially at my point in the game--idiot newbie) I dont feel I am being unfair to Tops. If I am correct me
 
Yup - he ripped your design for sure, but as mentioned before, if you haven't copyrighted the design, there's not much you can do now. One of my family members learned that lesson the hard way years ago.

For what it's worth, yours are better in fit & finish anyway. I hope the guy has enough integrity to be honest about where his his inspiration came from.

Just as importantly, it sounds like you've got loyal folks out there lookin' out for you. :thumbup: :thumbup: That's even more flattering, IMHO.

thx - cpr
 
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