What kind of edge is best for a carving knife?

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matto6

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Jan 30, 2017
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I got a new TSPROF so just for fun I put a mirror edge on my Henkel carving knife. It's a paper-slider's dream.

I made a reverse sear roast beef today (holy crap it was good - pics below) and trying to cut it with this knife was laughable. I was sliding the knife back and forth on the crispy outside edge of the meat and it just wouldn't cut. I had to use ridiculous force to break through.

It's obviously the same phenomenon that it's easier to cust a raw tomato with a serrated knife than a smooth edge. The question is, how do I fix it? Do I just stop when I get to the medium-grit stones? Or should I throw out this knife and buy a serrated one? :rolleyes:
 

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No more than medium, then strop.
I don't know what kinds of stones come with the rig, so I can't give numbers.
 
Ourorboros said:
No more than medium, then strop.
I don't know what kinds of stones come with the rig, so I can't give numbers.
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Thanks.

I'm using venev centaur diamond stones.
www.gritomatic.com

Venev Centaur Series Dual Side Diamond (3)Stone Set [6" x 1"]

Venev Centaur Series Dual Side Diamonds are used for sharpening knives on Hapstone and TSProf guided knife sharpeners, as well as freehand sharpening. Diamond sharpening stones offer excellent performance in sharpening knives of any steel.Centaur Series is dual side diamond with two 1 mm-thick...
www.gritomatic.com www.gritomatic.com
 
I have the TSProf Kadet and I am using the TSProf diamond plate set that goes up to 1000 grit along with the 400/800/1200 Venev Orion Series diamond stones. This set up seems to be working for me. I do take my kitchen knives through a progression up through the Venev 1200 however I do not over work/polish the cutting edge using the Venev stones since I want my knives to still have a bite. I find that a jewelry loop helps me in the sharpening process.

I have a mix of German and Japanese kitchen knives and I have sharpened all of my kitchen knives to a 15 degree bevel angle and I have been real happy with how the knives perform. As far a slicing tomatoes, my sharp laser type Japanese knives glide through tomatoes with ease and I am able to make paper thin slices, with my serrated knives the knife wants to steer due to the serrations and I can't get a even paper thin cut. A serrated knife might get you through the outer bark/crust but depending on the cutting edge of the knife you may notice that the knife wants to steer when slicing thicker cuts of meat.
 
fl_pugs said:
I do take my kitchen knives through a progression up through the Venev 1200 however I do not over work/polish the cutting edge using the Venev stones
Click to expand...
Thanks. Could you expand on what you mean by that? You use all the stones, but just briefly? Not taking out all the scratches from the previous stone? Is this better than simply stopping at say 400 grit?
 
I have only had my TSProf Kadet a couple months so I am still learning the sharpening system, what works best for the different knife steels that I have, edge retention and knife performance. That's part of the fun with this hobby and what I prefer might not be what works best for you or others. When I first ordered the Kadet I wasn't sure which sharpening stones to get so I started out with the TSProf diamond plate set since it was $50 for the set and it had a range of grits that I wanted. The diamond plates do sharpen my knives well so that they cut paper nicely but not to the edge sharpness or performance that I was trying to achieve. I find that diamond plates tend to leave a harsh edge so after reading various posts on this site and recommendations by other members I ordered the 400/800/1200 Venev Orion stones.

I find that the diamond plate set works good for repairs, changing bevel angles, establishing my first uniform burr along the entire cutting edge and taking the edge up an acceptable sharpness. Once the first burr is set, it doesn't take too many passes to progress through the rest of the diamond plates and into the Venev stones. Depending on the blade steel it goes fairly quickly. I am not trying to remove all of the scratches from the previous stone, I am taking it just to where I can feel a slight burr along the entire edge than I move up to the next higher grit. The higher grit stone is removing and softening scratches from the prior stone but I am not working it long enough to remove all of the scratches. With my Japanese carbon knives and the German knives I will go up & back the cutting edge around 5 times then check the burr and touch up where needed so that a burr has formed along the entire edge. With hard stainless steel, some of the very hard carbon steels and longer knives in the 240mm + length I am finding it typically take more passes to establish a burr.

Keep in mind that the diamond plates and the Venev stones use different grit classifications. The Venev 400 is considered a medium stone so I may be backtracking a little going from the 1000 grit diamond plate to the 400 Venev but it seems to be working for me. Once I get a final burr using the 1200 Venev, I strop both sides of the knife using the 1200 Venev starting off with around 10 passes per side, then reducing the number of passes each time I flip the knife over until I no longer feel a burr or rolled edge. Then I do a couple passes on a bench strop to help clean up the edge. The end result is a cutting edge that will pop hair and still have enough bite to perform extremely well in the kitchen.

You could try using just the 400 Venev to see how it performs then move up to the next higher if needed.
 
matto6 said:
I got a new TSPROF so just for fun I put a mirror edge on my Henkel carving knife. It's a paper-slider's dream.

I made a reverse sear roast beef today (holy crap it was good - pics below) and trying to cut it with this knife was laughable. I was sliding the knife back and forth on the crispy outside edge of the meat and it just wouldn't cut. I had to use ridiculous force to break through.

It's obviously the same phenomenon that it's easier to cust a raw tomato with a serrated knife than a smooth edge. The question is, how do I fix it? Do I just stop when I get to the medium-grit stones? Or should I throw out this knife and buy a serrated one? :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

If you like the mirror polish, you could also just put a microbevel on the apex with a medium grit stone or ceramic rod. That should get you enough "tooth" to slice more effectively. Or, just don't polish away everything that makes a good slicing edge in the first place. 😁
 
I got a few of these 10" knives a couple years back from a "fell off the truck salvage" place when they were on sale. Victorinox call it a "pastry" knife, perhaps because it's ever so slightly curved. Designed to go through hard crust and not damage the soft inside I guess. Wickedly sharp, cuts like a chainsaw. The rosewood handle model goes for about $60. I think I got mine for half that. They have a plastic handle version.

1639606871237.png
 
USMCPOP said:
I got a few of these 10" knives a couple years back from a "fell off the truck salvage" place when they were on sale. Victorinox call it a "pastry" knife, perhaps because it's ever so slightly curved. Designed to go through hard crust and not damage the soft inside I guess. Wickedly sharp, cuts like a chainsaw. The rosewood handle model goes for about $60. I think I got mine for half that. They have a plastic handle version.

View attachment 1702719
Click to expand...
So it's ever so slightly serrated?
 
matto6 said:
So it's ever so slightly serrated?
Click to expand...
Looks are deceiving. The serrations are right at about 5mm peak to peak and close to 1mm deep. All the pics show the left side. The right side is where the serrations are ground.

This is not the same knife, but looks like same size serrations:

1639611273896.png
 
IMO you want a fairly think double bevel. I generally do up to a 3000 or 4000gr stone. Having a good length is also important imo a 250-300mm knife.
 
matto6 said:
I assume you mean thick. But what exactly do you mean by thick double bevel? What makes it thick?
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2-3mm thin and I normally hand sharpen at a 12-14 degree angle

For double bevel I mean is ground on both sides of the knife over a single bevel being one side and flat on the other
 
matto6 said:
I got a new TSPROF so just for fun I put a mirror edge on my Henkel carving knife. It's a paper-slider's dream.

I made a reverse sear roast beef today (holy crap it was good - pics below) and trying to cut it with this knife was laughable. I was sliding the knife back and forth on the crispy outside edge of the meat and it just wouldn't cut. I had to use ridiculous force to break through.

It's obviously the same phenomenon that it's easier to cust a raw tomato with a serrated knife than a smooth edge. The question is, how do I fix it? Do I just stop when I get to the medium-grit stones? Or should I throw out this knife and buy a serrated one? :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

JMO but I would only go up to 400 grit splash......should have some teeth, but on another front......man that looks cooked to perfection.
 
Meat?

15 degrees hollow grind. I would go up to maybe 1500-2000. I feel like anything higher is overkill...no wait, I dont own anything over that :D

Good luck!
 
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