What makes a man survive and another die out there in the wilderness?

golok

golok

Joined
Oct 20, 2000
Messages
4,453

One occasionally read or hear of a news report where several backpackers or trekkers getting lost for days, maybe even weeks out there in the wild somewhere.

By the time, they are found, there could be several who have succumbed to the cold, hunger, or victims of circumstances in the wild.

My question is what makes one man a survivor and another a tragic victim? Sometimes, one reads that the survivor and the dead are evenly matched physically. They may be of the same age group. By any standards, both are about the same in almost everyway.

Therefore, why does one perish in the same circumstances when the other comes out alive?

I do not subscribe to the explanation of fate because I believe there are definitely other factors involved that make one the survivor and the other the victim.

Who thinks he knows the answers?

------------------
Make Love your strongest weapon. Compassion your shield and forgiveness your armour.
 
I don't know THE answer but I can think of a few factors:
When did they eat last and what did they consume before they got into their situation?
I have seen guys get so drunk on an airline flight, that if the plane made an emergency landing they would have to take 8 hours to sober up before they would be of any use to anyone (including themselves).

I have also read stories about healthy smart folks (with plenty of gear) who panic and make stupid decisions (usually making the situation even worse).

Some people never plan what they would do if things go wrong. I think most of us are on this forum to learn and prepare and plan for worse-case-senarios, but some people never consider "what if?" situations.
As my Platoon Sgt said "Always have a plan".

People are different. Two men who are both in equal physical condition and who even exercise the same are still different. Some men are less tolerant to pain or cold or heat than others. Some men sweat more and urinate more frequently than others (and so they dehydrate quicker). Some men have a faster metabolic rate and a faster digestive system (and so they burn calories quicker). Some men have more calcium in their bones and are less likely to fracture. Some men tan, others burn (like me).
And there is at least a thousand more differences between people. Most are small differences but when combined they make a BIG difference.

Experience can be a major factor in any survival situation too. People generally get better at something the more times they do it.

But most importantly, I believe you can never under-estimate the WILL TO SURVIVE.
Some people simply refuse to surrender and give up.

Well, that's what I think, now what's the right answer?




[This message has been edited by allenC (edited 04-29-2001).]
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
But most importantly, I believe you can never under-estimate the WILL TO SURVIVE.
Some people simply refuse to surrender and give up.</font>
Click to expand...

I think that sums up the question completely. The pyschology of surviving has always been the thing that sticks out in my mind when survivors of disasters or tragic events are interviewed. I personally believe that all the skills in the world are completely useless if the mind is not able to cope with the tragic situation at hand.

Another thought along this line of thinking: I believe that anyone in a situation strange to them should always make a decision, regardless if it's right or wrong. Indecision is a killer.

Jeff

 
allenC, I think you about covered it. I have been in everyday inconvenient situations with different people and its amazing how varied physical responses can be. In situations relevant to those found in a survival scenario, I've seen what appear to be equivalent men differ in the following ways:

In an outdoor event in extreme heat, some wilt noticeably while others are indifferent.

On a cold, blustery day, some can sit outside at a picnick table in shirt sleeves, while others are bundled up and shivering.

On a long road trip, some can go without food for longer stretches and are more flexible, while others blood sugar hits rock bottom and they get spacey and weak.

Three people eat the same catered buffet lunch, and two suffer extreme nausea from the food poisoning while the third just has bad gas.


golok, you mentioned fate was not a good answer, but I'd have to wiggle it in as the fraction of dumb luck that strikes now and again. Imagine you were coming down with a fever and you end up in a cold weather situation with no blankets and no food. Yikes!
 
My dad told me this true story of what happened to a friend of his during the Second World War.

This unfortunate friend was imprisoned by the Japanese in wartime Malaya. Thrown into a small cell built for 10 people, were about 40 people.

Food was naturally horrible. Often there was nothing to eat. So inmates resorted to eating anything that ran, sneaked or crawled across the prison floor. These included lizards, cockroaches, rats and all kinds of bugs.

My dad's friend was a hefty looking chap when he was caught was finally released with the end of the war.

Physically, he was reduced to about one third his original size. He told my dad that he saw people slowly going mad, either from hunger or desperation. They would run and smash their heads against the wall and promptly ended their lives.

My dad's friend said he refused to entertain any thoughts of death, he turned his eyes away from the suicidal people and willed himself to live.

The man just refused to die. That I reckon is the biggest factor. A man must refuse to give up.

NEVER, NEVER, NEVER GIVE UP!

------------------
Make Love your strongest weapon. Compassion your shield and forgiveness your armour.
 
Jeff Randall, as usual, hit it on the head with the "Will to survive". In my opinion there are two things that will do you in during bad situations; lack of will, and the inability to live with mistakes.

Personally I don't like raw fish, but if I had no fire and was hungry I would probably eat it. Some would not. This is a lack of will. Can you make yourself do things that you would rather not?

Okay, so you broke the blade on your knife. Is it now time to give up because your survival tool is broken? No, you now have two knives! Shorter to be sure, but you can work with both. If you give up because of a broken tool (broken through your own bad actions) you have an inability to live with mistakes. Build a fire under a snow laden tree; fire doesn't last long. Give up? No! Build another further out.

I liked the last post which said "Never give up!" I've lost two friends recently who gave up because of their medical conditions. Can't say what I would do in their place, but I hope I never give up. I came into this world kicking and screaming (according to Mom) and I will go out the same way.
 
interestingly,
even on the show survivor you see some of these folks just give up. and they say so, they surrender even though the others with them are going through the exact same scenario, some folks dont know what the limit of their endurance is, so they themselves put an artificial limit on it, there by sealing their fate.

i think that is what everyone is saying, i know that i am capable of dealing with much more than i think i can, so i guess the lesson is " dont ever set a limit to your endurance because there is no way for you to know what your limit is."

i guess it is like when they test navy seals/ special forces/rangers/sas/sbs type of people in the military, they keep giving them impossible tasks to see if they will give up or just continue to go on until their last molecule of energy is expended.

NEVER EVER GIVE UP.

alex
 
"even on the show survivor you see some of these folks just give up. and they say so, they surrender even though the others with them are going through the exact same scenario"

you are exactly right.everyone is going through the same ordeal,but some cope better than others.i was in a relatively minor wreck last october,and was kicked in the head by the airbag.(if you havent been in a wreck with an airbag,it will surprise you how hard they hit.) and i was shaken badly.no one was hurt,aside from a slight concussion,injured hand(panel on the steering wheel slapped my brother on the hand pretty hard.)
some people cope.some dont.those that dont,they're the people that die.

cant forget to mention the safety net on survivor either.you know,doctors,a way out if you want to leave,food if you run out,etc.
 
The funny thing is that you never can tell where the strength is ahead of time. It depends on the situation. A plane goes down with two guys in it, one is a middle age desk jocky who has never roughed it further than his neighborhood Mcdonalds, the other in his early 30s has just returned from a successful summit climb on Everest, who is more likely to survive? Its hard to say.

First, we have to consider the environmentals.

1) The mountain climber has strong lean build with an active healthy metabolism. The businessman, is overweight and has a less efficient metabolism becuase of his age and inactivity. Given any form of food scarcity the climber's body will most likely begin to burn muscle and organ tissue long before the business man.

2) If exposure to cold is an issue, the larger man will have less surface area per relative mass and hence may be able to tolerate the cold for a longer period.

Then there are the mental factors.

Which man is more likely to accept and adapt to the current situation. This one is very unpredictable.

Anyone interested in the subject should read some of the following:

1) K2 the 1939 trajedy (ISBN 0898863732)...keep an eye on Dudley Francis Wolfe. Here a rich, inexperienced, overweight climber, with poor eyesight and other limitations, manages to outlast most of the younger, more experienced and apparently stronger team members.

2) Wreck of the Medusa (ISBN 0451200446) - The famous sea disaster from 1816... 150 sailors, soldiers, and engineers are abandoned on a makeshift raft... only a handful survive and the ships middle age doctor proves the strongest by far.

3) In the heart of the sea (ISBN 0670891576) - so you thought Moby Dick was just a novel... this is the true story of the incident that inspired the novel. A whale ship sinks thousands of miles from help and the crew must travel over 100 days in skiffs to reach rescue.

N2S


[This message has been edited by not2sharp (edited 04-30-2001).]
 
Three things: Knowledge (get as much as you can); Tools (carry as much as you can); and the willingness to get in there and blow snot bubbles and get the job done (mental fortitude for the squeamish out there
smile.gif
).
 
I think too much is made of will to survive, especially in group situations where people are hunkered down. There are times that the mind is willing, and the body just isn't able. That's when you keel over and wake up wondering why you're lying on the floor.

There are situations, such as long trecks where giving up is a death sentance. And in a solo survival situation, one's resolve has to be iron.

But all the will in the world doesn't do a bit of good to dispell hypothermia or heat stroke should your luck take a few turns sour.
 
Generally speaking, if your mother-in-law is due to visit within a month, your chances of making it are slim.
smile.gif
 
LOL!!! I'd post a reply, but as we speak I'm grabbing my bug out bag. If you see my mother in law coming, tell her I headed south.

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top