When is a Buck not a Buck? ( humor)

DeSotoSky

DeSotoSky

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I copied and pasted this from someones sales description...
Hope I didn't break any rules here but it's curious reading....: :rolleyes:

Buck Knife? Made By Camillus In The USA. MINT Cond.! When is a Buck not a Buck? Well, there is a story here! This knife measures 5" closed, with a long (1-3/4") bolster that has the "W and Arrow" of Westmark (Western Cutlery) on it. The 4" flat-ground blade has a 90 degree stop, and is deep-struck on the left tang: "Westmark/ Hand Made/ New York/ USA". BUT on the side of the blade is etched: "Ole Buck"! Of course, this knife was made at Camillus Cutlery in Camillus, New York; as you know, Camillus owned the Western and Westmark trademarks. AND Camillus had done subcontract work for many years for Buck (you know--the California Buck guys). Now, this story comes from some of the old Camillus workmen, who worked at Camillus for 20 plus years: After making folding knives Buck for lots of years, Camillus messed up and sold somebody a trunkful of Buck seconds.... And Buck (in California) heard about it! Buck then quit having Camillus make knives for them, and picked up all their seconds. I believe Buck gave the seconds to some African missionaries, and the missionaries gave them or traded them to the African natives. The rest of the story (still according to the old Camillus guys): The management at Camillus had the tooling for Bucks, and thought perhaps calling something "Ole Buck" or "Young Buck" might be enough of a difference to avoid a trademark fight with Buck. It wasn't. Camillus quit making "Ole Buck" knives REAL quick! So, this is one of the few that were made; it has a Delrin handle that looks like bone, with a shield with an eagle on it (looks like an NRA eagle to me!) Factory unused condition--we got it at the Camillus auction in 2007. No Reserve
 
Is the thrust of the story true?

IIRC, Buck moved production of some of their slip joints from Ulster/Schrade to Camillus because Ulster used the Swindon key construction, which made it harder to replace blades under warranty. So that much is true. Camillus did make knives for Buck.

But, if the knife in question started as a Buck reject, I wonder if we could identify the original Buck model is supposed to be?

In any event, if the story is true in full, it's a good reminder of who is THE authority on what is or is not a Buck.

Buck!
 
As a collector of Western knives, also, one part is not correct. Western knives were made in Colorado even when they were owned by Coleman prior to the buy by Camillus. The Westmark series was only three knives 701, 702 and 703. The mark of a W with a line through it was a German company that also used Westmark (have one).
 
pinnah said:
Is the thrust of the story true?

IIRC, Buck moved production of some of their slip joints from Ulster/Schrade to Camillus because Ulster used the Swindon key construction, which made it harder to replace blades under warranty. So that much is true. Camillus did make knives for Buck.

But, if the knife in question started as a Buck reject, I wonder if we could identify the original Buck model is supposed to be?



In any event, if the story is true in full, it's a good reminder of who is THE authority on what is or is not a Buck.

Buck!
Click to expand...

The move from Schrade to Camillus was in part because of the Swindon key construction, but I don't think it was because to made changing the blades difficult. The Swindon key construction it self would fail with any side to side pressure, which would result in the key hole getting reamed out. This would be a costly repair that would end in sending out new knives as apposed fixing the old one. The pattern wasn't cost effective...

Hear are a few pics of the knife we are talking about...



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Matt is correct. Somewhere, maybe a BCCI newsletter Chuck Buck talks about those bad knives from Camillus( several thousand) and how they took a loss on them. Also seconds both old and new are sent to missionary's. The first three folders (301s) were contracted by Schrade.

The rest of that tale, I have no idea true or false.

300Bucks
 
Most of my knowledge is just regurgitated from 300Bucks, but sometimes he flatters me and lets me answer a question.
 
I saw that "tale" too. The pics posted look like a 301. Were there any other models with the groove in the bolsters? My collection told me it needs those.

Thanks to all for the enlightenment.
Bob
 
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