Why a SPEAR POINT?

schmittie

schmittie

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I can't help but notice how many bushcraft knives have spear points. In fact all three of my own personal bushcrafters (a cheapie, Koster, Fiddleback) all are spear pointed, regardless of grind. I understand that with drilling, having a centered point helps a great deal. But is that the biggest reason? What do you think? What other things make a spear point useful in your bushcrafting?
 
It just generally gives you a greater degree of tip control, and lends itself well to points that are fine enough for detail work but with enough reinforcement to be fairly stout.
 
spear points can also help with blind indexing, which under normal circumstances isn't that big of a concern. But when your tired, hands are shakey, and it's past dusk but you still don't have a fire started it's important to know exactly where your edge and tip are even though you can't see them clearly or at all.

By blind indexing I mean close your eyes and place the tip of your blade on the tip of your finger without cutting yourself. With a knife that's slightly blade heavy, ergonomic, and with an edge and tip that aren't too far off center you can do that with a fair degree of certainty. Get enough of a trailing point, or an edge that's too low, or a knife that's so handle heavy and it's easy to lose the sense of where your tip is when you can't see it.
 
Neeman is the reason I like them - if I am using one to - say - put a divot in a hearth for a bow drill - I don't want a fine point that can snap.


I don't use it for fine work like boning fish - but can in a pinch.

TF
 
And here I was half way expecting that it had something to do with 'bushcrafting' and a few particular tasks and not as simple as the obvious, a stronger design.

Interesting.
 
neeman said:
A spear point is stronger than a clip
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Talfuchre said:
Neeman is the reason I like them - if I am using one to - say - put a divot in a hearth for a bow drill - I don't want a fine point that can snap.


I don't use it for fine work like boning fish - but can in a pinch.

TF
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I have to disagree with this. You look at the tip on the Koster Bushcrafter(spearpoint) and you look at the tip on an Izula(drop point) and you'll notice more metal on the Izula even with it's distal taper. It's all in the particular design of each knife. I've had a few swamp rats with clip points and they are crazy strong on there tips.
 
Shotgun said:
I have to disagree with this. You look at the tip on the Koster Bushcrafter(spearpoint) and you look at the tip on an Izula(drop point) and you'll notice more metal on the Izula even with it's distal taper. It's all in the particular design of each knife. I've had a few swamp rats with clip points and they are crazy strong on there tips.
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^Yup! Exactly why I specifically noted that the spear point design allows for a strong point with a moderately good degree of precision and control. It also allows for super-fine needle-like points depending on how they're designed. As far as bushcraft stuff goes, though, there seems to be a preference for the "robust" variants.

The biggest advantage is the control afforded by the centered point.
 
I believe the proper phrasing is "given the same thickness at the edge and spine, a spear point has more backing metal than a trailing/clip point".

If both distal tapers start at one inch from the tip and taper from 1/8" thickness to .015" right before the edge, and the edge is brought down to 18 degree's per side, the spear point will be slightly stronger because the tip because it becomes taller at a faster rate and thus obtains slightly more back metal even though the thickness profiles are the same.
 
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schmittie said:
I can't help but notice how many bushcraft knives have spear points. In fact all three of my own personal bushcrafters (a cheapie, Koster, Fiddleback) all are spear pointed, regardless of grind. I understand that with drilling, having a centered point helps a great deal. But is that the biggest reason? What do you think? What other things make a spear point useful in your bushcrafting?
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I see it as nothing more than a matter of personal preference. Suggesting the strength advantages of one or the other profile are not much more than justifying one's personal preferences. Spear point blades and clip point blades both have long histories. I have examples of each that date to the early 1900's. My personal preference, the knife I have used the longest (more than 35 years) is a clip point in 1095hc. I've never found the tip to be weak and prone to breakage. It drills as well as a spear point and is much better at piercing, IMHO. I have used it as a spear to kill animals and to clean, skin and butcher them. I have used it to bore holes in wood and other materials. I collect this pattern now and view dozens of examples every year. Only a few that I have seen have shown evidence of tip damage. If the design were prone to damage, it seems that examples of damaged knives of a 45 year old pattern made with a very basic carbon steel would show up more often.
 
Distal taper is when something diminishes in thickness along its length. In the case of knives, it means that the spine will be thicker at the base of the blade than at the tip.
 
neeman said:
What is a distal taper?
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This picture illustrates distal taper. Take note of how much thicker the spine is near the bolster compared to the tip.

kallioniemibladedistalt.jpg
 
Codger_64 said:
I see it as nothing more than a matter of personal preference. Suggesting the strength advantages of one or the other profile are not much more than justifying one's personal preferences. Spear point blades and clip point blades both have long histories. I have examples of each that date to the early 1900's. My personal preference, the knife I have used the longest (more than 35 years) is a clip point in 1095hc. I've never found the tip to be weak and prone to breakage. It drills as well as a spear point and is much better at piercing, IMHO. I have used it as a spear to kill animals and to clean, skin and butcher them. I have used it to bore holes in wood and other materials. I collect this pattern now and view dozens of examples every year. Only a few that I have seen have shown evidence of tip damage. If the design were prone to damage, it seems that examples of damaged knives of a 45 year old pattern made with a very basic carbon steel would show up more often.
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Yep I agree it's personal preference. If I want good tip control I'd pick a modifed warncliff like Gossman's UNK over a spear point anyday. If I want to drill a lot of holes I'll take the awl on my SAK. Of course neither of these aspects have any bearing on the woodwork I do. I haven't noticed any blade shape, or type of grind for that matter, to be so much better then another that it made a lick of difference in real world use. Of course YMMV.
 
Certain blade profiles ARE inappropriate for certain tasks, but as long as you pick a general pattern type that works for what you do, that's what matters most.
 
Shotgun said:
I have to disagree with this. You look at the tip on the Koster Bushcrafter(spearpoint) and you look at the tip on an Izula(drop point) and you'll notice more metal on the Izula even with it's distal taper. It's all in the particular design of each knife. I've had a few swamp rats with clip points and they are crazy strong on there tips.
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This is true. Any point can be made stronger depending on how the grind is done. I tailor the point thickness according to the design and purpose of the knife being made.
The spearpoint IMO, is the most versitile of blade shapes with the point running down the center line of the blade. However blade width makes a big difference in how well it will do different tasks. My favorite of all blade shapes for smaller 4" or less is the modified sheepsfoot style. There hasn't been anything I couldn't do with this shape. Drilling is the only thing it doesn't excell at.
Scott
 
Ah, now there is an interesting argument. Some here say that having the point in the center of the blade is best. Others, including some who make big "fighting" bowies, say they having the point in line with the centerline of the HANDLE is ideal. I tend to go by the latter theory. But then again, if I made a Michael Price style knife, the point WOULD be in the center of the blade AND the handle, so who knows what is right?;)
 
jdm61 said:
Ah, now there is an interesting argument. Some here say that having the point in the center of the blade is best. Others, including some who make big "fighting" bowies, say they having the point in line with the centerline of the HANDLE is ideal. I tend to go by the latter theory. But then again, if I made a Michael Price style knife, the point WOULD be in the center of the blade AND the handle, so who knows what is right?;)
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I generally subscribe to the latter theory as well. Centered directly behind where force is being applied. This can vary depending on the point orientation with regards to the angle of the handle. :)
 
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Likewise. On a bowie with a curved stag handle, I will drop the point a bit.
FortyTwoBlades said:
I generally subscribe to the latter theory as well. Centered directly behind where force is being applied. This can vary depending on the point orientation with regards to the angle of the handle. :)
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