Why Are We Using D-2 Tool Steel In Our New Line Of Hunter/Utility Knives?

Joined
Oct 21, 2002
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14
Why D-2?

Hi guys! Eric is on the road right now and I wanted to take this opportunity to address some of the questions that have been raised concerning our use of D-2 tool steel in our upcoming series of hunter and utility blades. D-2 has recently gained a lot of popularity in the knifemaking community. Not surprisingly, Jerry (my husband) had used D-2 for many years when he was a custom maker. Recently while clearing out his original shop he decided to inventory his stores of bar stock. As it turns out, he had amassed quite a bit of his favorite tool steels including many tons of A-2 and D-2 tool steel. He put over 41,000 pounds of D-2 tools steel on the “For Sale” boards at over 90% off of the regular selling price! One of the deterring factors to using D-2 is its high price. Normally a 1/8” thick x 1 ½” wide x 18” long bar of precision ground D-2 Tool Steel costs $40.34 per bar. You can only get two 9” OAL knives out of a single bar. That means your raw steel cost per blade is over $20.00! That is over 3 times more expensive than using some of the other grades of cutlery steel!

Eric, called and asked about using the D-2 Tool Steel stock for Swamp Rat. Don’t you just hate when a great idea is sitting under your nose and you don’t see it yourself? Keeping in mind that Swamp Rat is all about saving Rat lovers money on high performance bladeware, I just couldn’t say “no” to the idea. After consulting with our production team on advantages and disadvantages of D-2 tool steel, we moved in and purchased over 30,000 pounds of the stock from Busse Combat.

Jerry is a big fan of D-2 blades when everything is done right on the knife. We have taken his advice on design, heat-treat, edge geometry, etc… and, in concert, with our superior Resiprene C handles will bring the finest, highest performance D-2 Tool Steel blades to the market. I asked Jerry to answer some questions about D-2 and here are his responses.

Why not stick with SR-101? And how does D-2 compare to SR-101?




Jerry:

“In the performance arena, it is nearly impossible to match what Swamp Rat is getting out of SR-101 in certain areas. The combination of incredible edge holding and toughness are unparalleled in the industry (except for INFI . . Sorry, I had to throw that in ;) ) . D-2 has a much better resistance to the elements in an uncoated or satin finished format than does SR-101. D-2 rivals ATS-34 for stain resistance and in fact proves to be nearly identical in this area in our accelerated salt spray corrosion tests. Surprisingly, or maybe not so surprisingly, the heat treatment and finish of D-2 can have a major impact on its corrosion resistance. When done properly, a D-2 blade requires minimal maintenance. Cleaning and oiling are a good idea but simply wiping the blade off and keeping it fairly dry will usually be all that is required for proper care.

In edge holding D-2 is an excellent steel and easily surpasses SR-101 when cutting harder materials such as steel banding, bone, etc. . . In soft to medium materials they are very similar in edge holding. In chopping and high impact applications, SR-101 easily surpasses D-2. Because of this, I do not recommend that any D-2 blades be longer than 5”.

In extremely thin edges, such as are planned for the Hunter/Utility line, D-2 will prove to be a superior choice. The same qualities that make SR-101 a great steel for abuse, play against the house when it comes to extremely thin cross sections. Under contact (cutting not chopping) with harder materials such as metal banding, bone, rock, etc. . . SR-101 will roll whereas D-2 will prove to be the clear winner in these applications. However, if you do any heavy lateral stressing on a thin cross sectioned D-2 blade, you may be glad that your Swamp Rat D-2 blade is backed by the best no BS warranty in the industry! ;)

D-2 also has a much greater resistance to high heat applications. What does that mean to you? Well, for us, as manufacturers that means that very fine edges can be satin finished with little worry of affecting the temper along the edge. This is not the case with SR-101, or any other simple “high carbon” steels, where extremely thin sections along the edge can be greatly affected by the heat generated from polishing.

So, in summary, for an uncoated blade with extremely thin cross sections, where cutting is the only intended application and hard materials such as bone, metal banding, etc…will be in contact with the edge, D-2 will prove to be a superior steel in edge holding and resistance to the elements.

In more abusive applications where cutting is to be coupled with prying, lateral stressing, high impact, and overall toughness, SR-101 will prove to be far superior to D-2.” --- Jerry Busse





So, when looking at the properties of these 2 steels you can see why we chose D-2 for our thin edged, bare metal, slicers.

Swamp Rat D-2 Tool Steel blades will prove to some of your favorite Rats. They will also stand as the only D-2 blades on the market that are covered against any and all major damage. . . :cool:

Thanks! :D

Jennifer
 
Pardon me of this has been answered elsewhere, but is Swamp Rat going to continue to offer the standard models in SR-101?
 
Actually, flatground.com, the online sales site for Bohler-Uddeholm in North America sells a 36"x1 1/2"x1/8" bar of precision ground D2 for $31.22 which is just $15.61 for an 18" bar. There are several other sites that are comparable in price. It is just the knife supply sites that charge the exorbitant rates.
 
SHEGO

good to know. I will not give much on the rest of the description above.

I would be more interessted in the heat treatment SR is going to do.

So, Jennifer, at wich temp. you gonna harden it, temper it, how often? Are you going for secondary hardness? That would be interesting. D2 is famous and wellknown among knifeknuts.

Don´t feel offended, but the last days i ordered a custom in D2 and had thought much about the ht i want. So i´m curious, what you had dcided.
 
Very interesting....these knives should cut like a laser :D

I'm also curious about the HT; will it take full advantage of Busse/SwampRat's heat treat processes (extended time of HT and cryo tempering)?

Also, what will the approximate price range be?

Lastly, how thin will these edges be?
 
shgeo,

Thanks for the link. Just as everything else made in America costs more, so goes tool steel. I was simply posting the price as listed on Koval Knives to give a perspective as to its relative cost in regards to other grades of cutlery steel and to demonstrate what a great deal we had gotten. My understanding is that Koval sells D-2 that is manufactured by the same American mill as is the stock we are using. I don't doubt that you can find a lower price on the american made stock as well, but if you re-read my post you'll note that I said we were able to purchase it at over 90% off. Jerry, had it listed on the Exchange board at $4.00 per pound! That calculates to our cost being $3.78 per 18" bar which is still over 75% less than the lowest price you were able to find on your posted website. :eek::cool::D I'm not sure what the exact analysis or smelting differences might be between the American version and the imported one, but they both obviously fall within the specs given for D-2. I'm sure that it's more a matter of pedigree rather than analysis. So, if I wasn't clear in my original post let me just say, WE GOT A GREAT DEAL ON D-2 TOOL STEEL THAT WILL UTIMATELY SAVE OUR CUSTOMERS A LOT OF MONEY!!! Oh, and welcome to the Swamp Rat forum.

Coonskinner,

Yes we will continue to make our current models out of SR-101.

Blop,

I'm not sure why what Shgeo said caused you to say, "good to know. I will not give much on the rest of the description above." but perhaps you were confused by what I had posted. If you'll read my response to Shgeo I think I was able to clarify my original point.

In regards to your other inquiry, I am not at liberty to disclose our specific heat treating protocol, but I can tell you that we are able to maintain a continuous quench that takes our D-2 tool steel down to -300 degrees below zero. This is done in a dry atmosphere over the course of nearly 70 hours, which includes the slow trip back up. We will perform a minimum of three oven tempers and our very specialized heat treating protocol takes over 80 hours to complete. In studies performed by one of the pioneers of dry, slow cycle, deep cryogenics, D-2 experienced in excess of a 1,000% increase in tool life.!!! We agree that the secondary curve offers greater toughness. That's all I can say for right now. ;) Thanks for your interest. :)

Jennifer
 
should i replace my old rat sword with the newer d-2 sword or stay with the sr-101?

i would guess beings that it is a long blade (15") that i should stay with the sr-101.



RATSWORD.jpg
 
Considering how "rare" your Swamp Rat sword is, I would stick with the SR-101.

I have to ask. Were you constantly in trouble when you were growing up? I don't know why I think that is the case. ;)

Jennifer:D
 
well... no more mmmm maybe a little more than most kids but i wouldn't change what happened.

i am glad i didn't have the swamp sword back then as things might have been worse:rolleyes:

i do hear most people finally grow up at around 45 though... guess i'm a late bloomer:confused:

now, back to the soon to be announced silver rat sword... will there be enough to go around at blade and have you set the intro pricing yet? man i'll tell you the one i was privledged to see was very well done.

well thanks jennifer and don't kill anymore brain cell till we can do so together at blade!:D :D

big drinking contest i hear!!
 
"damn, now I'm really looking forward to Blade"

Yeah, as if you weren't already! :)


Personally, I'm so excited about the Blade show, I'm hopping around like a Spider Monkey on crack! :D
 
Originally posted by Danbo
a Spider Monkey on a crack! :D
well if you want to buy a knife you had better be on 1whoporks crack, he hogs them, then carries them around in his back pocket till he decides what he likes:eek:
you might get some of his droppings if you stick close enough:D
 
The more I think about it, the more I realize that I would pay good money to see a spider monkey on crack.
 
Necro thread warning, this is from 2003 folks. I dont know why it was brought back up?
 
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