Why do BOBs resemble an apocolypse trading bin instead of a backpacking pack?

[Macchina]

I try to backpack several times a year, anywhere from a weekend to 2 weeks in duration. For a 1-2 week trip, My Gregory Palisade backpack (extremely comfortable and not a spec of camo on it) weighs in at 30-35 pounds with gear, food, and water. For a trip like this, all my gear is usually around 20 pounds (pack, clothing, sleeping bag, pad, stove, pot, tent or hammock, misc gear, etc), food and water is 10-15 pounds.

I see people post Bug Out Bags that are supposed to be designed to help a person ride out an emergency. The idea of a B.O.B. spans a wide gauntlet of kits from a small schoolbag kept in a vehicle with simple tools, food, and water (these make sense to me and I keep one in every car) to huge duffel bags or 8,000 cubic inch backpacks filled with everything from breaching tools to heirloom seeds...

The weird thing is these 120 pound packs seem to favor old-fashioned and outdated gear and leave out many critical items. I understand it's durable but durability does not superseded usefulness. It is a very strange mentality that a B.O.B. should contain old surplus gear and materials perfected in 1920 (Except the $2,000 AR-15). MANY OF THESE BAGS DON'T EVEN TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION A PLACE TO SLEEP AT NIGHT, and the ones that do are usually packed with wool blankets instead of sleeping pads, wool blankets instead of sleeping bags, tarps instead of tents, shotguns instead of food, and chlorine pills instead of water filters or bottled water. I almost never see tents packed, and the large surplus GoreTex bivys are seen far more often than tents. I have one of these and it packs as big as my 3-man tents and weighs more than half as much. Do you know how much ammo weighs? How many BOBs do see packed with hundreds of rounds of ammo and zero water?

How many of these B.O.B.s are made by the man of a family with a wife and 4 kids yet they pack more guns than shelters or sleeping bags. Good luck keeping your kid warm with an AR-15...

I'd like to see somebody live comfortably in the woods with only wool blankets and a tarp for shelter. I've tried it once (bivy instead of tarp) and it's miserable if there are any bugs or rain. Maybe their plan is to "acquire" shelter with the shotgun and 30 pounds of breaching tools... I've done the "eat only what you can hunt/gather" thing for a couple of weekends. It's fun but garter snake was the tastiest food we had and I'd get sick of it after more than 3 days.

I don't understand why these people don't pack a B.O.B. like they're going hiking for a week. It would work great for staying put or traveling. The gear has been has been tested and there is a reason you see sleeping bags, inflatable pads, and modern-material tents on the trail instead of wool blankets and tarps. I recently returned from a 4-day backpacking trip of 30 people, 12 of which were in 5th grade. We traversed around an island with nary a hitch in our gear and not a single shot fired . I'd like to see any of the people who's kit I posted below to do that same trip with their packs. If I were to pack a bag to "Bug Out" it would have a lot less Stanley Fubars and a lot more Thermarest pads.

These are the first few examples of Bug Out Bags pulled from Google:

 

[Mastalerz]

My opinion? Most of these people don't really backpack, camp, hike, etc. So they have no idea what its like to carry a lot of gear for long distances. Also they have never really even had to test any of those things so they don't know how multipurpose some of the items are or how useless other ones are. Every time I go on another trip I try and cut something else out of my gear, my goal is to bring the limited number of items and try and use other things to replace it. For instance I just got a BK2, thickest knife I have ever had (even thicker than my cheap Bowie) so I am going to ditch the hatchet next time and just baton with my BK2.

Those gear bags are more like something I would leave grouped in my house in case of emergency, or at a shelter that I was "bugging out" to. Not something I would want to have grab and carry on foot to a safe location. Just looking at some of those B.O.B. pics I can think of multiple items you can easily get rid or of or items that can be replaced by something already in the bag.

 

[Fanglekai]

Because It's the newest advertising fantasy to sell products to people who dont even go into the wilderness.

 

[Hammer67]

My opinion? Most of these people don't really backpack, camp, hike, etc. So they have no idea what its like to carry a lot of gear for long distances. Also they have never really even had to test any of those things so they don't know how multipurpose some of the items are or how useless other ones are.

Because It's the newest advertising fantasy to sell products to people who dont even go into the wilderness.

Bingo.

Can anyone recommend a good toothpaste for the Apockalips?

 

[Shotgun]

This is a pet peeve of mine as well. I think what you're seeing is BOB's made by people who have never backpacked before in their life. They don't think that much about weight because they don't carry a backpack for any extended period. It's blatantly obvious in your photos. There's a lot of stuff there that they're packing that they haven't even taken out of the packaging. Another indicator is the size of what they're carrying. A liter of alcohol? I don't see any stove and it looks like 70% so it's not even good for that. (Too sooty)

The other side is the survival fantasy. It's a lot sexier to think that you'll save the day killing a bunch of bad guys with your shotgun then it is to save the day by pulling out your rain jacket. Even though one is vastly more likely than the other.

 

[HSC ///]

Bingo.

Can anyone recommend a good toothpaste for the Apockalips?

outdoor toothpaste = baking soda

 

[jimh0220]

Because they fancy that they'll be fighting a war and not have time for sleep, they'll steal water and food, and really only need to get to the small stream 1 mile down the road. Plus, you have to buy surplus gear, because it's always in OD green, which far surpasses high tech gear. You buy 'survival' supplies on the cheap, so you can drop $3k on guns and ammo, because when the local mountain erupts, the power outage hits, or a earthquake occurs, you must FIGHT and KILL. Mankind has no ability to work together, you see. Regardless of the repeated occurrences where communities band together to help each other, charities show up to provide aid, and pleas go out for food, water, first aid supplies, blood, and warm blankets and shelter, that will not occur the next time. We are all doomed, so better to carry a 10 lb shovel that you can beat a skull with than 50 Clif bars and water.

 

[Mastalerz]

Because they fancy that they'll be fighting a war and not have time for sleep, they'll steal water and food, and really only need to get to the small stream 1 mile down the road. Plus, you have to buy surplus gear, because it's always in OD green, which far surpasses high tech gear. You buy 'survival' supplies on the cheap, so you can drop $3k on guns and ammo, because when the local mountain erupts, the power outage hits, or a earthquake occurs, you must FIGHT and KILL. Mankind has no ability to work together, you see. Regardless of the repeated occurrences where communities band together to help each other, charities show up to provide aid, and pleas go out for food, water, first aid supplies, blood, and warm blankets and shelter, that will not occur the next time. We are all doomed, so better to carry a 10 lb shovel that you can beat a skull with than 50 Clif bars and water.

:thumbup:

 

[tiogatires]

I remember seeing climbers in Denali national park cutting the handles off their toothbrushes in an effort to reduce weight. Cutting down zipper pulls etc... I asked them why and they aske me if I wanted to carry that stuff o the top if the mountain, to which I replied nope. Every time I pack or update my kit I do it with that logic in mind. Although nobody will ever pry the kifaru off me back, I can save weight everywhere else. If it doesn't add value, it doesn't go.

 

[Shotgun]

Because they fancy that they'll be fighting a war and not have time for sleep, they'll steal water and food, and really only need to get to the small stream 1 mile down the road. Plus, you have to buy surplus gear, because it's always in OD green, which far surpasses high tech gear. You buy 'survival' supplies on the cheap, so you can drop $3k on guns and ammo, because when the local mountain erupts, the power outage hits, or a earthquake occurs, you must FIGHT and KILL. Mankind has no ability to work together, you see. Regardless of the repeated occurrences where communities band together to help each other, charities show up to provide aid, and pleas go out for food, water, first aid supplies, blood, and warm blankets and shelter, that will not occur the next time. We are all doomed, so better to carry a 10 lb shovel that you can beat a skull with than 50 Clif bars and water.

One of the reasons bugging out is not much of an option for me. I can see getting to a bug out location only to have to deal with a half a dozen guys who actually think like that. I'd rather work with hippies in town. Who, around here at least, actually have some off the grid skills.

 

[lmalterna]

I think each person needs a different BOB per the MANY variables that will exist if the time ever comes. How can you know what to pack for that vacation to Spain that you always wanted to take? Even though you do not have a plane ticket or itenerary yet?

Point is, to prepare a bag that you will ABSOLUTELY need every item in it for an event that you cannot predict the details of is kind of impossible. My own approach it to have as many items as I can responsibly budget that "could" be needed given my locations and what I determine are most likely to happen. I have get home gear in thecar but the car does not mind if that weight is 20lbs or 50lbs.

When the time comes to hit the dirt, THAT is when selection/deletion of gear would happen.

An example I will give.... when a soldier is sent into a combat zone, he/she is alotted all the gear that Uncle feels they may need during their deployment. Likely exceeding 200lbs for most. When a combat mission is planned, the Sgt. is likely the one assigning essential gear "based on the details of that mission" and the soldier will have a small allottment for personal gear.

At home I have two large shipping containers roughly 36" cubed. Inside I keep the "possibles" in the top of each is a good quality pack that I have used for hiking to test out. If the time should ever come that I would bug out(unlikely). I will choose the items that I feel I will need and leave the ones that do not fit the situation.

I DO have a very small bag in the closet by the front door. That is more the true "bug out in the middle of the night with no warning" bag. 2 changes of casual cloths with shoes, basic medicines, cash, American Express checks, no contract phone,list of phone and policy numbers, flash drive with video of contents of house- CD copy of same, photocopy of critical documents, flashdrive with photos of family. My unassembled .45 and 50 rounds of ammo.... Hey, I am a guy after all

Bill

 

[stabman]

People pretty much summed it up already it seems.
Fantasy packs made in the living room by city-folks who have never seen more wilderness than a city park.

And an excuse to buy more gear.

 

[Mastalerz]

I always think when I watch the show mountain men or something of that nature, these guys are all self sufficient. They all have the skills that they need to survive and do anything by themselves. They have a small community of people whom they know and trust, they may not be close by but they come by and check on each other and help each other out. Then you watch doomsday preppers... Who would you rather be in the end of the world scenario with? And who do you think would be better prepared to survive?

I don't care how many shotgun shells or canned food you have. I'll take my hiking/camping gear as well as any knowledge I have over an m4 carbine fully tactical, a bullet proof vest, and 50 cans of crisco any day. Not to mention the community is much more friendly and helpful than a group of wanna be Rick Grimes/Navy Seals.

 

[Hammer67]

Not to mention the community is much more friendly and helpful than a group of wanna be Rick Grimes/Navy Seals.

Agreed, and I've brought this up before. For all the survival banter out there, and all the focus on things like those pics above, you see very little talk about the important survival skills of collaboration and community. Largely, I think, because too many people are caught up in this "lone wolf" fantasy of slinging their BOB over their back and "bugging out." It doesn't take much study of history to figure out that back when people truly had to survive off the land, "lone wolfs" didn't tend to last for very long, no matter how much gear they were dragging around with them.

 

[Displaced Buckeye]

If someone uses their gear, carries their gear and is fine with their gear, I'm fine with it too. I really don't care if they have a loaded mini refrigerator strapped to their back, as long as they don't complain to me about it. I pack what I need, and what my wife thinks she'll need. I carry nearly all of the weight, and I'm fine with that. I also carry two pistols with me, my EDC and a backup. Same caliber, and what I think I should carry in ammo. I'd rather not head out into the middle of nowhere and hope my Thermarest makes a decent weapon.

I also have three different bags loaded, and one for my wife. One of mine is pretty heavy, and not something I'd usually ever carry. There's no reason to think I might not be "bugging out" in my truck though, and it carries a lot more than I do.

 

[Codger_64]

Don't be dissin' the Crisco man!

 

[Hammer67]

Don't be dissin' the Crisco man!

Crisco is like a multi-tool in a can.

 

[lmalterna]

I think the most prevalent "bug out" in most folks minds is the need to leave the cities and feed/shelter ourselves. For most, the scenario involves heading in to the mountains. For my extended family, it means migrating to the old family farm. 60 acres of woods/farm, large farmhouse. It has stayed in the family, though unoccupied. The house is maintained by us, the pastures are leased out for grazing. My uncles grew up there on a largely self sufficient farm, I grew up there as a kid into my early teens. There are undelevoled "big woods" nearby for hunting and foraging until game gets scared. Streams for fishing for a time. During the depression, seeing a deer in those counties was rare. Only the best hunters collected "game". Many ate raised meat or groundhogs.

When I was a teen, I was often on loan to other families for whatever work was being done. Hay, tobacco, working calves, building a shed, etc.. There was no free love or incense but it was community living. I usually went home after a days work, well fed and carrying a bag of eggs, fresh honey or baked goods. For the most part, the same families are still there and we still wave when we drive down the road. I will not be sleeping in a debris hut on the side of a mountain, unless roads are impassable and I am in transit. I will share a large farmhouse with 10-20 or so of my relatives and be amongst family.

Bill

 

[Hammer67]

I think the most prevalent "bug out" in most folks minds is the need to leave the cities and feed/shelter ourselves. For most, the scenario involves heading in to the mountains.

I'm beginning to think more and more that the best thing to do in a bug out scenario is let all the clueless hordes "head to the mountains." Lay low somewhere else for a couple weeks, and then go to the mountains. It will be like a shopping spree...

 

[Mastalerz]

It doesn't take much study of history to figure out that back when people truly had to survive off the land, "lone wolfs" didn't tend to last for very long, no matter how much gear they were dragging around with them.

EXACTLY! Humans by nature are pack animals, you look back to prehistoric history the earliest men were nomadic tribes! One of the problems today is that there are too many of us and not enough resources to sustain us because we have turned into huge civilizations covering the planet.

Any survival situation no matter how much gear or tools you have the goal is to get back to civilization or other people. Even in the fictional zombie stuff people band together in groups. Primitive skills are by far the most important when it comes to survival because they take very little tools and resources, basically all the tools and necessities you make yourself - from medicine, tools, glue, shelter, fire, etc.

The idea that these guys can go out and survive with no primitive skills and a bunch of gear by themselves for extended periods of time baffles me. What is funny is they practice "bugging out" but how long do they stay there with just there gear before they decide they need to go home? It is one thing to live off the land, it is another thing to live alone by yourself without help from other people. Humans are stronger in numbers, which is why our technology has advanced so far and we can buy incredible knives and gear when we go hiking/backpacking/camping etc. In an end of the world scenario it would be more like the end of civilization as we know it, there would still be plenty of groups and communities that band together and reform. I'll tell you what though, I'll be backpacking out west with all you guys and gals in California/Colorado/Washington/Montana/etc. where you people actually know how to do things yourself!