Why does the U.S. Military allow their logos on so many junk knives?

U

Uncle Buckmaster

Joined
Oct 21, 2021
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A guilty pleasure of mine is browsing through the BUDK Catalog/Website, looking at all the goofy, cheap stuff that they sell, and occasionally coming across a few good deals on MilSurp items.
However, one thing that never ceases to disappoint me is seeing the logos of various branches of the U.S. Military on what are essentially Gas Stations/Shopping Mall Specials, just cheapo Chinese knives made of some mystery metal, typically with serrations/sawteeth which are purely decorative because they're dull or irregularly spaced.

The question is; WHY?! Why does the U.S. Military allow their logos to be used under license of such low quality products? Doesn't it sort of reflect poorly on the Military to allow their logos on products of such low quality? Shouldn't they have some sort of certification process which requires officially licensed products to adhere to Military Specifications? What's more, shouldn't they be more proactive against companies who make unauthorized used of their logos?
 
Probably also a matter of cost/benefit. Even the Fed has to ask if it's worth trying to prosecute somebody. Their ability to pay lawyers may be essentially unlimited, but for every one they get to cease and desist, five others show up.
 
shane45-1911 said:
Ever tried to sue someone in China? Good luck.....
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Shorttime said:
Probably also a matter of cost/benefit. Even the Fed has to ask if it's worth trying to prosecute somebody. Their ability to pay lawyers may be essentially unlimited, but for every one they get to cease and desist, five others show up.
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No sir, BudK is a USA based company that has garbage made in China and brought here. The Marines have officially licensed their name and logo to a number of BudK products. The danger in this is that many people would assume the USMC logo does not have a price, and that anything officially branded or partnered with them must be used, commissioned, or at the very least authorized to be of some usable quality instead of junk that can and will from experience (we were all kids new to this game once) break on you in potentially very dangerous ways. This is irresponsible. Just put "ARMY KNIFE" on it to satiate young children getting these as stocking stuffers, take the official logo off...

"Are you looking for officially licensed USMC knives? Good, you've come to the right spot! BUDK is proud to offer dozens of USMC fixed blade knives and pocket knives. We strive to give the USMC name the honor and dignity that it deserves. We've developed durable performance knives that will get the job done. The USMC knives are the most enduring, affordable knives on the market today!" https://www.budk.com/USMC-Knives-4064

A17-UC3506.jpg

This is what our grandfathers stormed Normandy with, right?
 
Hashishiin said:
No sir, BudK is a USA based company that has garbage made in China and brought here. The Marines have officially licensed their name and logo to a number of BudK products. The danger in this is that many people would assume the USMC logo does not have a price, and that anything officially branded or partnered with them must be used, commissioned, or at the very least authorized to be of some usable quality instead of junk that can and will from experience (we were all kids new to this game once) break on you in potentially very dangerous ways. This is irresponsible. Just put "ARMY KNIFE" on it to satiate young children getting these as stocking stuffers, take the official logo off...

"Are you looking for officially licensed USMC knives? Good, you've come to the right spot! BUDK is proud to offer dozens of USMC fixed blade knives and pocket knives. We strive to give the USMC name the honor and dignity that it deserves. We've developed durable performance knives that will get the job done. The USMC knives are the most enduring, affordable knives on the market today!" https://www.budk.com/USMC-Knives-4064
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Sorry, I trust BudK's word about as much as I trust the knives they sell. They can say what they want, but I highly question that anything that BudK carries or sells has any level of approval or authorization from anyone in the DoD - or at least from someone that is qualified to give said authorization or licensing approval.

As long as it is made in China, they can put whatever logo or stamp on it with little fear of any repercussion. And that is BudK's out - "it is made in China, we didn't put the logo on it."
 
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shane45-1911 said:
Sorry, I trust BudK's word about as much as I trust the knives they sell. They can say what they want, but I highly question that anything that BudK carries or sells has any level of approval or authorization from anyone in the DoD - or at least someone that is qualified to give said authorization.
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I hope that's the case! The idea of being able to buy the logo and pump these sorts of items out is just depressing.
 
Uncle Buckmaster said:
A guilty pleasure of mine is browsing through the BUDK Catalog/Website, looking at all the goofy, cheap stuff that they sell, and occasionally coming across a few good deals on MilSurp items.
However, one thing that never ceases to disappoint me is seeing the logos of various branches of the U.S. Military on what are essentially Gas Stations/Shopping Mall Specials, just cheapo Chinese knives made of some mystery metal, typically with serrations/sawteeth which are purely decorative because they're dull or irregularly spaced.

The question is; WHY?! Why does the U.S. Military allow their logos to be used under license of such low quality products? Doesn't it sort of reflect poorly on the Military to allow their logos on products of such low quality? Shouldn't they have some sort of certification process which requires officially licensed products to adhere to Military Specifications? What's more, shouldn't they be more proactive against companies who make unauthorized used of their logos?
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This is what the DoD has to say about this -

Licensing of Goods and Products​

The manufacture or distribution of products that contain Military Service marks requires written license permission from the appropriate Military Service Trademark Licensing Program Office. For the purpose of this guidance, distribution methods include, but are not limited to, online, mail orders, and/or direct sales. If you are a retailer, please ensure you only sell merchandise that has been licensed by the relevant Military Service Trademark Licensing Program Office(s).
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I doubt that BudK has the proper licensing to distribute (thats the key word here, its not just manufacture) merchandise with military logos. Its just not worth the effort to stop them......
 
I mean, have you ever noticed how companies use "mil spec" to mean something special?
Military things are used as marketing ploys even on our home turf, just perhaps not as egregiously.
 
EngrSorenson said:
I mean, have you ever noticed how companies use "mil spec" to mean something special?
Military things are used as marketing ploys even on our home turf, just perhaps not as egregiously.
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It makes sense to people who know how the military chooses an item, based on cost, or to people into this stuff, but the average Joe is confused. "Military" translates to "tough enough to be the choice of expert fighters who fight wars, and the US Military probably has all kinds of advanced testing". They see "the military" as this big, unknowable, tough monolith that MUST be the best, even if it isn't.

"Put it in a flick, and everyone will want one, after those Hong Kong flicks came out, everyone in the world had to have a .45, and they ain't want one, they want two, cause they wanna be the killa. You can't tell these jokers nothing, the killa had a .45, THEY want a .45
 
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Hashishiin said:
It makes sense to people who know how the military chooses an item, or to people into this stuff. "Military" translates to "tough enough to be the choice of expert fighters who fight wars, and the US Military probably has all kinds of advanced testing". They see "the military" as this big, unknowable, tough monolith that MUST be the best, even if it isn't.
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… I gotta say, I’ve read this a couple times and it’s unclear whether or not you believe “mil spec” is meaningful purchasing criteria for a civilian.

At any rate, companies use military motifs and all kinds of military-esque lingo to sell products to military enthusiasts; knowledgeable or not. Doesn’t personally matter to me if it’s stamped “USMC”.
 
"In 2013, United Cutlery partnered in a licensing agreement with the United States Marine Corps allowing United the opportunity to manufacture and distribute knives under the U.S.M.C. license. These knives not only reflect the dependability and toughness of the U.S.M.C., but a portion of every knife sold goes back directly to the U.S..M.C. to help protect our country from those who threaten us. Be assured that these U.S.M.C. knives are gear you can rely on."

Bud K licensed it years ago under their United Cutlery line. When they did, the line was less outlandish, a few Becker, Aitor, and Ontario styled knives and a few others. That being said, the USMC licensing doesn't really care, as long as the products aren't really morally offensive, and don't pass themselves off as issued goods.

Edit here's the other piece of ad copy -

"USMC KNIVES FAQS​

  • How long has USMC Knives been around?
    In United Cutlery partnered with the United States Marine Corps to produce its officially licensed USMC line of knives. The Marine Corps Martial Arts Program, a hand-to-hand combat system developed by the military branch, incorporates edged weapons into its training regimen. USMC Knives set out to craft a line of knives that would embody the spirit of this formidable fighting force.
  • What kind of products do they have?
    USMC Knives offers a selection of knives from combat fixed blades and assisted opening tactical folders to perfectly balanced throwing knives and tough kukri machetes.
  • What kind of products from USMC Knives do you have?
    We offer dozens of USMC Knives fixed blade knives and pocket knives including combat knives, stiletto knives, kukri knives, machetes and we also have USMC ceremonial swords".
 
The US military is actually VERY protective of it's trademarks.

In 2018 the Army sued a liquor store owner in New York for using the name "Black Knights" in the name of his store. The West Point football team is called the Black Knights, and the Army owns that name. The Army sued, and the store owner chose to change the name.

If the Army was willing to go through all that trouble over the name of the West Point football team, I imagine they wouldn't hesitate to go after any US based company that used it's actual name and/or logos without permission.

And on that point, in 2014 the Army sued a US based clothing manufacturer for using Army trademarks after permission had been withdrawn. The Army spent 7 years in court fighting this case, and finally won in 2021.

I don't doubt that if BudK, a US based company, and not exactly an obscure company, were using US military trademarks without permission, that they would hear about it from the US Attorneys Office.

Don't mess with US military trademarks.

I've also seen cases where former and active duty military personnel were ordered to stop using military names and insignia from the branches they served in on products they were producing for sale.
 
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I just check the USMC official list of licensees, and as of 2022 United Cutlery is still on it. Since BudK owns United, I guess they get to use the USMC trademarks under the United brand.

It was not easy to get this information. The official USMC website offers a link to that list, but you have to download it.
 
EngrSorenson said:
… I gotta say, I’ve read this a couple times and it’s unclear whether or not you believe “mil spec” is meaningful purchasing criteria for a civilian.

At any rate, companies use military motifs and all kinds of military-esque lingo to sell products to military enthusiasts; knowledgeable or not. Doesn’t personally matter to me if it’s stamped “USMC”.
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My quote at the bottom about "Put it in a movie, everyone wants it. They wanna be the killer; the killer had it, so they want it. Can't tell people nothing" ? You can replace "killa" with "military". Me personally? I think it is a meaningful criteria, as it is usually bad, and an indicator to get the civ version. Ontario is a good example of this - they still make their mil-spec knives with 1095. I prefer the 1075 for those kind of knives.

Wasn't talking about my view, I was talking about whether the public at large views "mil-spec" as a positive thing, and they do and will continue to. I see how the phrasing can be misinterpreted.
 
unwisefool said:
Your first mistake was going to BudK
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Like I said, it's a guilty pleasure, and part of which is because the stuff that they sell and the juvenile ways that they choose to market it is amusing to me. Except for when it's officially licensed by the USMC, then it just makes me sad to see a United Cutlery wallhanger with the USMC Logo on it, along with a bunch of nonsense about how you can trust your life to it because the USMC totally approves of and — for all that the average 12 year old knows — totally issues it too.
 
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