why is crkt going to such cheap steels?

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paulwesley

Joined
Sep 5, 2005
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655
i had a crawford casper folder but it had 420j2 and i got rid of it just because of that. When i started learning ms steels i got rid of most of my low end steel knives just because i wanted better steel. crkt makes some good handles but their steel is going downhill fast.
 
on a good note for CRKT they just released a lightfoot desertM1 and it still has aus8 bladesteel. This IMO is a great hard use folder for around fifty bucks. Not a super steel but a great design and functional materials at a very reasonable price, wish they would make it in plain edge.
 
To keep their costs down.With other companies moving to china production there's more competition. Plus what percentage of all knife buyers actually care about the steel type? 5% maybe?
 
Dave's right. They only switched to cheap steel for their mass-market, low-end knives. Their mid-range is still AUS-8 (look at the m-16s) and their new assisted openers are American-made and 154-CM.
 
DaveH said:
To keep their costs down.With other companies moving to china production there's more competition. Plus what percentage of all knife buyers actually care about the steel type? 5% maybe?
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That would make more sense to me if the knife didn't retail for $60.00. I have seen many knives that retail for less that use better steel. If the knife was priced at $10.00 - $30.00 (like most of the competing Chinese made knives) then there would be a valid excuse to use 420J2.

The higher price may be because of a better warranty and better QC, but do the 95% of people purchasing knives that don't care about the steel, care about the warranty and QC?
 
Esav Benyamin said:
They only switched to cheap steel for their mass-market, low-end knives.
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What sucks, though, is that some of those "low-end knives" are excellent users, at least they were when they had decent steel.

(Let me rephrase that...)

What sucks, though, is that some of those "low-end knives" are excellent designs, and made excellent users, when they had decent steel.

(There, much better. As you were, soldier...)

Two of my favorite CRK&T's are the Ryan Model Seven and the Crawford/Kasper Folder, both of which fell victim to this steel switch. I've used and abused the snot outta both of mine, and they're probably the best bang-for-the-buck knives I've owned. Seeing them turned to sub-swapmeet crap to save a few bucks makes me angry. :mad:

I'm hoping that Columbia River will do the occasional run in better materials, kinda like they did with the M16 Titanium models, and the Crawford/Kasper Professional models. :thumbup:
 
Keith Montgomery said:
The higher price may be because of a better warranty and better QC, but do the 95% of people purchasing knives that don't care about the steel, care about the warranty and QC?
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No, they don't. And they probably just buy the CCC junkers they see at swap meets.

Which is why trying to compete with that crap on price is an exercise in futility, IMHO.
 
DaveH said:
With other companies moving to china production there's more competition.
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Yeah, but the slipjoints that Buck is having made in China for Wal-mart are all 440C. The cost difference can't be that great, and the Chinese are capable of good work when it's a requirement. Good and cheap is certainly an option. <Asbestos suit on> Of course CRKT doesn't really have much of a reputation to piss away ...

Gordon
 
My CRKTs, all of them, are all higher fit and finish than my Spydercos and Bucks (two companies I love). Two are well under 30 dollars, the other under 50. Including such classics as the Spyderco Paramilitary and Buck 560C in titanium.
 
youre right there are the exceptions like the aus8 and 154cm...and i like the voodoo...plan on getting one myself
 
CRKT is no worse than Victorinox, Case, Camillus, Buck, Browning, Boker, and Kershaw--all of which use cheaper blade-steels in some of their knives.

I think they have chosen a middle-of-the-road place for themselves, above the cheapest knives but below the best large production makers (Benchmade and Spyderco).

Allen.
 
Victorinox use cheap blade-steels in some of their Blade?
In which modeles? :confused:
I heard in this forum that it was difficult to know exactelly which metal they were using because it was not really fixed, they were buying so big quantities that it might fluctuate...

paulwesley write :"When i started learning ms steels i got rid of most of my low end steel knives just because i wanted better steel."
It's sad ! If you were happy with it before learning, if it was sufficient for you..why should you change? Used it and abuse it, you won't have regret, as it is low end steel !
 
Gryffin said:
What sucks, though, is that some of those "low-end knives" are excellent users, at least they were when they had decent steel.

Two of my favorite CRK&T's are the Ryan Model Seven and the Crawford/Kasper Folder, both of which fell victim to this steel switch. I've used and abused the snot outta both of mine, and they're probably the best bang-for-the-buck knives I've owned. Seeing them turned to sub-swapmeet crap to save a few bucks makes me angry. :mad:

I'm hoping that Columbia River will do the occasional run in better materials, kinda like they did with the M16 Titanium models, and the Crawford/Kasper Professional models. :thumbup:
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must agree the CRKT kaspers are pretty close to the real thing in size and shape, i liked mine a lot, if ya like the kasper try a crawford model, much much much better than the CRKT, thats what i did lol, tried the CRKT, liked it, then had to have the custom version, my first custom knife actually.

CRKT is lowering the grades of steel because most folks in that price range could care less about steel, if they even know there is a diff between AUS4 and S30V they just dont care imho.
 
Keith Montgomery said:
That would make more sense to me if the knife didn't retail for $60.00.
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How many times have you heard a knife person on an established forum (like this one!) say "I've heard great things about the Delica, but I won't get one 'cause the plastic handle feels cheap"? Same thing with gun people and Glocks.

Put your production bucks into a fine knife with excellent steel and a functional handle, and it gets passed over 'cause it "feels cheap". But a similarly-priced knife with an excellent milled G10 handle and crap steel "feels like quality". The difference in blade steel is large, but hard to assess without lots of information that just isn't available at the point of sale. The difference in handles is large, and it's wildly obvious to anybody who so much as looks at the two knives.

CRKT puts the bucks into the features that'll make the sale, not the ones that'll work best after the sale.
 
"Victorinox use cheap blade-steels in some of their Blade?
In which modeles?"

All of their models use cheap steel.
I love Victorinox SAKs, but you certainly will not find any premium blade-steel, like VG-10 or ATS-34 or S30V, on a SAK.
In fact, you will not even find AUS-8 or 440C on them.

Allen.
 
allenC said:
"Victorinox use cheap blade-steels in some of their Blade?
In which modeles?"

All of their models use cheap steel.
I love Victorinox SAKs, but you certainly will not find any premium blade-steel, like VG-10 or ATS-34 or S30V, on a SAK.
In fact, you will not even find AUS-8 or 440C on them.

Allen.
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Actually they use high chromium stainless steel similar to 440a (C- 0,5; Cr- 15; Mn- 0,45; Si- 0,6; Mo- 0,5) hardened to 56HRC. Although the steel is just right for intended purposes I would love to see a SAK made of 154cm or similar.
 
hum Ok, but they don't use crappy steel also !
What i mean is that you managed to get their blades pretty sharp quite easely... which is not the case with some chinese folders...
So considering SAK cost, for me their steel is ok ! :D

"plastic handle feels cheap"
Ok, i am a knife nut like you all... but i should admit that i would love my new Calypso Jr to have handle of G10 instead of that "mauve" plastic handle... They were so close to perfection ! I would have accepted without problem to pay 5 usd more for that ! :yawn:
 
I say if the knife cuts, use it. I have some blades made of "cheap steel" that cut great, hold and edge as long as any other knife I have and frankly have a nice handle that makes them a joy to use. I think that being a knife snob is cool. I love pulling out a really scarry blade with high quality steel, contruction, etc. and wowing everyone with it, but it's not the reason i have knives. I use them. I have a few blades made out of 420 steel that I would put up in an edge retention test against any manufacturers "high quality" steel. What are most of us cutting anyway? Cardboard, critters (hunting), ourselves (sharpening tests), rope, tape, carpet, foam, foliage food and wood just to name a few. These things can be cut in large quantities by even a cheap kitchen knife, so don't go off on steel all the time. I'm not a fan of CRKT, but think that they want to carve (pardon the pun) their own little area in the knife world and must use these steels to make the price point. When I buy a knife I think of handle comfort, ease of transporting and blade length laws before steel, but that's just me.
 
Oh, have you got some surprises coming at ya. Already, younger workers are being conned into thinking that they should ALLOW cuts in Social Security.
This is the fruit of NAFTA and GATT and every other scheme put in play since our wonderful traitor, Ronnie Reegun ...AND...every one since that scumbucket have embraced.
In the interest of profit for large corporations, this country has been sold down the tubes and now we are seeing the DECLINE of the USA and will watch with even MORE horror as our children fall to this New World Order.
It is now far too late to stop it.
The people have already become so used to the abuse that they shop WalMart because they....HAVE...to. Soon, even that will be a luxury.
Bye bye America.
:barf:
 
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