will this idea work or am i missing something

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dieselpusher6262

Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Messages
34
for myself at least sharpening recurves sucks, let alone trying to change the profile, in my case i have a ZT 0300, and i have tried clamps, crock sticks, freehand, and a HF belt sander which didnt work out too well (thankfully Kershaw has an incredible warranty, and just sometimes they will ever cover stupid) anyways threw researching the internet everyone of the reasonably priced sharpener had some type of major compromise when working with a recurve. so my idea is if i trace the exact shape of the blade. then take that outline and use it to crate template out of teflon or some type low-friction type plastic. so back to the idea, now i would have two exact blades. taking the orginal steel blade clamp it down to a work bench type area, now take your teflon replica and keeping prefectly in line raise the teflon blade and raise it to there is a 15 degree angle between the point of one tip and the tip of the other steel blade. now because you have two of the exact same pieces of material instead of having to work your way around the curves, you could use a steel rod that would be resting on the teflon blade that is connected to a diamond sharpening rod that will be moved back and forth at a 90 degree to both blades. because you would be follow the same angles on both blades and the same time you wouldnt have to ajust for the belly and tip. wish i would have drawn up my idea, explain this is a little harder than i thought. i know there would be some very little compromises like the teflon not being angled at the ame degree as the bevelm but i think that could be compensated for. i anyone has any ideas, plans please feel free to speak up. thanks landon
 
I'm pretty sure I am picturing what you're describing. If you do something simple like trace the blade onto something thin, yet stiff like the back of a notepad, and cut it out to make a template, you can see this will not work. Again, this is assuming I'm picturing your idea right. If you're talking about having the synthetic blade copy against the blade, then angle it out at 15 degrees, you will see the edge does not stay in contact. The only place that will stay in contact are the lowest points on the blade, like the belly and maybe choil. Try it and you'll see how it won't work. If you're talking about something else, then I'm like the poster above... I'm gonna need to see some pics.

Edited to add: I have completely reprofiled my Benchmade 710 recurve blade using the DMT magna-aligner with Dia-Fold stones. The stones are thin enough that you can make contact, albeit not perfect contact with the edge of the stones. Here's a photo of the result.

Ok, it won't let me upload this photo again since it's already in this thread... Second page.... http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=813130
 
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It sounds like a very complex solution. The big concern I have is that there is a third dimension that may not be well constrained (that is the 90 degree angle that you must keep your rod(s) as you move them back and forth).

I think you will likely have as much trouble after you get this thing built as you would with something like a Sharpmaker. My advice would be to keep it simple and keep practicing with a more standard method...and avoid power tools (they will cause more problems for the novice than they will solve typically).

I think there may be other problems you may run into with this teflon template...but it may be my lack of understanding for what you are describing.
 
i agree with unit on your idea being complicated. recurves are easy once you know how to sharpen them. for an easy way by hand, get a pringles can and cut off the bottom. flatten 1 side so it has somewhat of a corner so it comes close to fitting the recurve and attach whatever grit sandpaper you will need (depending on the existing edge) to it.

put the tube on your arm keeping the corner out to your right for sharpening the right side and to the left for the left side. you keep switching hands after each pass but be careful not to let the tip slip off the tube.

if you want to try another method you can check onto the paper wheels to sharpen recurves which work great. you can also maintain a recurve blade on the slotted wheel until the edge needs to have a burr worked up on it again.
 
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softrockrenegade said:
You sent in a knife for warranty replacement because you screwed up the blade on a belt sander ?!!!
Click to expand...

oh yeah, not only did i screw it up by the time i gave up and sent it in the blade was maybe 2.5" long and a inch and a half thick. i see why it is recommended that you practice on something cheap and get the right belts. learn from my mistakes if you are new to using a belt sander the 80 grit belt that comes with it will most likely remove way to much material no matter how lightly you press. anyways i email Kershaw and told them what happened and they told me to send it in. honestly i was hoping that i would be able just to buy a new blade, but after about a month they sent mine back with a new blade, no charge. EXCELLENT customer service. the only thing is the blade they installed on my knife is solid black, no ZT marking or anything. Has anyone seen this or do you think i will have any problems if the knife has a go back for warranty? ohh i drew a simple picture of what i had in mind for my sharpening device but i cant upload anything. does anyone have any ideas on what to do. since i cant show i will try explaining it a little better. first the orginal blade needs to be clamped down 90 degress from how a normal vise would hold it (laying flat). next you would need an adjustable height clamp/vise holding the copy of the blade made out of plastic (anything really but thick enough not to flex). now take a ruler or whatever and find the angle you want sharpen at and set the adjustable height clamp with the edge of copied blade just barely touching the ruler. now with everything in place you should be able to lay a straight rigid rod on the orginal blade and the copied blade and the angle if measured would be 15 (lets just say thats what you wanted to sharpen at). so if your 1" back from the tip of the orginal blade, and 1" back from the tip of the copied blade your angle would be 15 degrees. now if you move that rod so it is centered in the belly of the recurve on both blades your angle would stay at 15, same as the very end of the blade because no matter where you are at as long as your on the same point on both blades your angle will never change because the distance between the two stays a constant. if i understand correctly people have had concerns that smith a lansky-type system the angle will change as the stone moves away from the center point of the guide. i was have built something similar and used a 5/16" steel rod, epoxied to the base of an eze-lap round brass diamond sharpener (with this way i can only use the tip that came with that sharpener, but never the less it works) as long as you where exactly 90 degrees on the same point on both knives and pushed straight up your angle would be 15 degrees, and the action of the stone/rod would be the same as if you where using a stone. now i know this would work only for the width of the rod you where using, but i figure with a little practice you would be able to both push the rod on the y axis, and pull the rod along both blades on the x axis. as to the idea to use a pringles can, for what ever reason i can not keep the same angle doing it that way. let me re-state. when changing the bevel i can not keep the same angle. if the bevel is set i can touch it up though. and with a normal knife i free hand without any difficulties. anyways thanks for all the advice
 
unit said:
It sounds like a very complex solution. The big concern I have is that there is a third dimension that may not be well constrained (that is the 90 degree angle that you must keep your rod(s) as you move them back and forth).

I think you will likely have as much trouble after you get this thing built as you would with something like a Sharpmaker. My advice would be to keep it simple and keep practicing with a more standard method...and avoid power tools (they will cause more problems for the novice than they will solve typically).

I think there may be other problems you may run into with this teflon template...but it may be my lack of understanding for what you are describing.
Click to expand...

about the template. any material would work but something that is rigid and slippery (to allow the rod to easily slide across) would work. i was just think about teflon or plastic because after tracing the shape of your blade onto the piece of stock one could use a jigsaw to cut out a rough shape then sand to give the final shape. crock sticks or the SM, if i understand correctly not only do you have to keep the blade at a right angle to the base, but also in the case of a recure the knife has to angled up and down depending on what part of the blade you are on. so your hand is having to keep the blade straight up and down (the x axis) and also having to tilt the knife up and down (the y axis). with my idea all you would have to deal with is keeping the rod between both blades at a 90 degree angle. also if needed you could use both hands and go as slow as the want because the rod is supported between the two blades.
 
Dude, just buy a Wicked Edge (or DMT Aligner kit if $$$ is an issue) and be done with it. All you need to do the recurve is a narrow stone. Wicked Edge makes rounded stones for recurves, and I've found that the DMT diafolds will also work. No sense trying to be complicated with plastic blade copies, clamps that hold the knife flat, etc.
 
It's not complicated really. The main thing is, whatever you're using to sharpen must be narrow enough to sharpen smaller "sections" of the recurve blade at a time, thus being unaffected by the curvature. I find the 1/2 inch belts of my Work Sharp is better than the nearly full inch width of the Paper Wheels. Plus it puts a beautiful convex edge on my ZT 0301.

You can also use 1/2 inch edge pro stones, the Spyderco Sharpmaker(might need sandpaper on the rods if you want to reprofile), as well as other methods.
 
dieselpusher6262 said:
oh yeah, not only did i screw it up by the time i gave up and sent it in the blade was maybe 2.5" long and a inch and a half thick.

i see why it is recommended that you practice on something cheap and get the right belts. learn from my mistakes if you are new to using a belt sander the 80 grit belt that comes with it will most likely remove way to much material no matter how lightly you press.
Click to expand...

for me, there are only 2 instances for using a belt sander (with a sanding belt):
1. if you're making a knife
2. if you are redoing the whole edge, usually due to abuse or if you are redesigning the edge and lots of material has to be removed.

only people with alot of knowledge and experience should bring a knife near a sander/grinder. it is very easy to wreck a knife (as you now know) with powered equipment. it is also very easy to overheat the edge and ruin the heat treatment.

i suggest:
if you want to start learning how to sharpen knives, start with an inexpensive knife with easy to work steel. learn how to properly sharpen a straight blade before you try recurves. if you have questions, ask them before you start.

there is more than one way to go about sharpening a recurve, i'll give you one of my tricks: you can get some 3/4" or 1" thick dowel rod (8"-12" long) and some sheets of sandpaper from a home center (anywhere from 600-2000 grit depending on the finish you want). cut the sandpaper 6" long by 2"-3" wide. wrap the sandpaper around one end of the dowel rod and secure it with a few staples.
 
i know to some this whole thing sounds quite complicated and unnesseccary. i have used the sandpaper/ dowel method and it works. thing is i just had my first child and in California you are given 6 weeks paid leave to bond. now since i am used to working quite a bit i am at a loss as what to do with my free time and building this seems like like a decent use of my time. anyways thanks for the input
 
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