Winter Shelter Dilemma...

Joe Fowler

Joe Fowler

Joined
May 14, 2008
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I posted this in the Wilderness Skills forum, but those jokers are no help. ;)

(I know many of us frequent that forum, but I'm guessing some may not.)

Anyway, I went up the canyon today to learn from a friend how to fish without... well, anything, and low and behold the canyon floor is covered in snow! All the leaf litter I had planned to use to make my shelter is covered in 8 inches of snow!

I wanted to build a debris hut for the "Mega" contest but I don't know if that's an option anymore. So here's my question:

What are my other options for building a shelter with two conditions... it has to require NO tools (like a debris hut) and it has to keep me warm with NO sleeping bag (again, like a debris hut.)

Any suggestions?

Oh, and fishing without poles, lines, nets or spears? You'll have to wait to find out. ;)
 
I am not familiar with the woods you have in your area? Here in AK the trees are small and manageable with plenty of branches year round.

I should have taken a picture a couple weeks ago when I built mine. If you google you can find the army and air force survival books. I think one of those has a shelter that would suit your purposes.
This link show the shelter but I didn't use a parachute. Limbs and branches will work but it takes longer to fill in all the gaps. If you notice the one large log on top of the entrance, it is tied there in order to pack snow on top.
http://www.gi.alaska.edu/ScienceForum/ASF17/1741.html


Scrape away the snow to get to the ground clearing enough for you to sleep in and whatever equipment you want to bring in.

Use one center beam running lengthwise and herring bone off of that. One end of the long beam will be on the ground and the other end will be elevated tee pee style. Use brush, tarp whatever to cover. The minimum snow thickness on the shelter should be 8-12" in order to maintain the heat inside. For the door stack wood partly up and for whatever opening is left use as an entrance and close off with a makeshift door or whatever equipment you have.

You won't need any cord etc if you manage your wood effectively. Ensure your center beam is supported well so you can cover your shelter with enough snow.

I should have taken a picture.....
 
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You could still make a debris hut - the material inside the hut should be as dry as possible, but the material on the outside (ribs/mesh) could be damp or even wet (it can rain on a debris hut!) and work. You could also pile snow on top of the outer shell if desired. It would take some planning to separate the material properly, given the snow cover on the ground, but do-able. To make a proper debris hut in the winter in most places other than the southwest, will require a LOT of debris (you want it a full arm's length deep before you even get to the frame) - expect about 1/2 day of debris collection in dry conditions! The pile/mound of material should be about 6'-8' tall and around 12' in diam. It sounds like overkill, but it compresses a bit. If it's wet, the mound will obviously not be as high and fluffy.

Could you make a modified snow cave?
I would grab a stick (always have a stick!) to use as a digging/scraping tool.

The problem is that while snow is insulative, it will not function quite like a debris hut, where you can snuggle inside and stay comfortable - you will still need to stuff the shelter with nesting material.

As Stalking Wolf would say: "Go ask the squirrels."
 
Hey Joe, which canyon did you go up? Digging beneith the snow to the brush/leaves is probably a good way to go. If there are pine/ever greens in the area, it might help to build the shelter under a large one. I say this because there probably is less snow under one and pine needles are great for brush shelters.
 
I always thought that if I were stuck in that scenario that I would use pine bows for insulation. Never tried it though.
 
wildmanh said:
Hey Joe, which canyon did you go up? Digging beneith the snow to the brush/leaves is probably a good way to go. If there are pine/ever greens in the area, it might help to build the shelter under a large one. I say this because there probably is less snow under one and pine needles are great for brush shelters.
Click to expand...

Last year I went up American Fork Canyon. Do you know of another place that would be full of leaves (and no snow!)?
 
I'm planning on taking some vacation time this week to make my contest entry, and let me tell you, I will be SERIOUSLY upset if I find snow on the ground when I get there :) .

I've never even camped with temps below the 50's or so, and now they are forecasting lows in the low 30's in the area where I'm going. That's cold enough, I don't think I could handle the snow!

If I never make it back here to post anymore then I didn't survive my survival contest entry :) . Sounds like you are going more hard-core, with NO tools :eek: I've got to at least have a knife or machete and basic psk, guess I'm more wimpy :D .
 
The trick is to show the survival skills, not put yourself in a survival situation.

I will have tools, I'll just not use them (unless I have to).

:thumbup:
 
I'm thinking I'll just find another area lower in the valley that's drier and stick with the debris hut.

Thanks for the help everyone!
 
Joe Fowler said:
Last year I went up American Fork Canyon. Do you know of another place that would be full of leaves (and no snow!)?
Click to expand...

There is a place in Provo Canyon North West above Canyon Glen park that I've used in the early spring that I think is called Johnson's Hole. From what I can tell, it's in Utah Wilderness land (Public) and the main floor of the valley is about 52,000 feet. There are lots of Scrub Oak, Box Elder and some Maple up there especially at the back end of the valley, plenty of long grass too.

Drive to Canyon Glen Park. Walk to the back of the park towards the Provo River Trail. Somewhere along the trail (Look for a wood Power/Phone Pole) is a sign that says Great Western Trail Access. Take the Switch backs up till you come to a ridge. There are 4 switch backs. At the ridge a trail goes north into a small valley and the Great Western Trail heads North West up the ridge. You want to take the trail North into the valley. According to Google Earth it's about 1 mile back into the trees at the north West end of the valley where I camped a couple times last spring.

GPS Quardinates for the middle of Johnson's Hole:
Lat: 40°20'4.64"N
Lon: 111°37'41.86"W

Here's a Thread I posted earlier in the year: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=738687&
 
Joe Fowler said:
Cool! Thanks a bunch, Heber!
Click to expand...

Not a problem! The 30ish minute hike into the little valley is a little intense at first but very worth it. I posted pictures from a campout back in May in the W&SS forum, Brush Shelter Skeleton. There are a bunch of good pictures of Johnson's Hole in that thread. Hoping to do a little camping there this Spring if I can.
 
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