Wolfram special

T

tattooedfreak

Steel mutilater is more like it.
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Mar 12, 2010
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So I got some GFS steel, Wolfram special, 26c3, sheffcut and some silver steel just to play with. The 26c3 works a dream and ground like butter after a slow hold.. working the Wolfram special and it starts cracking all over. I'm sure I was working it hot enough, is there something special to working it?
Ignore the dent, I was going to cut it off when I saw the other cracks.
 

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Hey Hoss,

Why do you think it was too hot rather than too cold? What are the signs to look for? So when I inevitably fail I'll know why...
 
A.McPherson said:
Hey Hoss,

Why do you think it was too hot rather than too cold? What are the signs to look for? So when I inevitably fail I'll know why...
Click to expand...
Most of the time it is too hot, forging, heat treating etc.

The higher the alloy and the higher the carbon, the lower the forging temperature.

Almost every forge I’ve ever seen runs too hot, it’s just not necessary.

Hoss
 
DevinT said:
Most of the time it is too hot, forging, heat treating etc.

The higher the alloy and the higher the carbon, the lower the forging temperature.

Almost every forge I’ve ever seen runs too hot, it’s just not necessary.

Hoss
Click to expand...
Ok, but there isnt a lot of alloy in it, except for tungsten, its similar to W2 and I havent had issues with forging W2 or 26c3 at the same or similar temps. Would the tungsten cause that much issue? What would be the upper limits for temp, Im using a single burner forge although I did have the psi up high.
I have a few feet, so I'll try again with my thermocouple in and maybe try with some san mai as well.

12345678910 said:
Have you got a data sheet for that steel ?
Can you find one ?

I bet it's hot short and you were too cold.
Click to expand...
According to GFS
C:W:Mn:Cr:Si:P:S:
1.13%2.23%0.24%0.42%0.2%0.012%0.016%

with their HT
Heat Treatment Cycle:
Normalise at 850 - 880C for 5 to 10 minutes, air cool to room temp
Heat to 810 - 820C and hold for 5 minutes (66HRc as quenched)
Oil Quench (Suggested Oil is Rye 32)
Temper twice for two hours at 200C for 64HRc

I havent read anywhere about it being hot short, although my thoughts are that I may have forged it too long but Ive read and watched the kitchen knife guys who are using it at much thinner blanks and cold forging as well, yet having very few problems. Or at least not reporting them.

I'll try it in a few more ways with better temp control and post up later.
 
tattooedfreak said:
Ok, but there isnt a lot of alloy in it, except for tungsten, its similar to W2 and I havent had issues with forging W2 or 26c3 at the same or similar temps. Would the tungsten cause that much issue? What would be the upper limits for temp, Im using a single burner forge although I did have the psi up high.
I have a few feet, so I'll try again with my thermocouple in and maybe try with some san mai as well.


According to GFS
C:W:Mn:Cr:Si:P:S:
1.13%2.23%0.24%0.42%0.2%0.012%0.016%

with their HT
Heat Treatment Cycle:
Normalise at 850 - 880C for 5 to 10 minutes, air cool to room temp
Heat to 810 - 820C and hold for 5 minutes (66HRc as quenched)
Oil Quench (Suggested Oil is Rye 32)
Temper twice for two hours at 200C for 64HRc

I havent read anywhere about it being hot short, although my thoughts are that I may have forged it too long but Ive read and watched the kitchen knife guys who are using it at much thinner blanks and cold forging as well, yet having very few problems. Or at least not reporting them.

I'll try it in a few more ways with better temp control and post up later.
Click to expand...
I’m not sure what answer you are looking for, try it for yourself and find out.

Industry never forges high carbon steels over 2100’f.

I see lots of knife makers forging at >2250’f.

Most of the failures on forged in fire are from over heating.

If you forge in the correct temperature range, you won’t have any problems.

I have forged tens of thousands of pounds of steel in my nearly 50 years of knife making.

However, I’m not there to watch you forge so it could be something else, but unlikely.

Hoss
 
Here’s the recommended forging temperatures according to Tool Steels 4th edition and Heat treaters guide 2nd edition.

O1: 1800-1950
O7: 1800-2000
F1: 1800-2000
F2: 1800-2000
F3: 1800-2000
W1: 1800-1950
W2: 1800-1950
W5: 1800-1950
W7: 1800-1950

Hoss
 
tattooedfreak said:
So I got some GFS steel, Wolfram special, 26c3, sheffcut and some silver steel just to play with. The 26c3 works a dream and ground like butter after a slow hold.. working the Wolfram special and it starts cracking all over. I'm sure I was working it hot enough, is there something special to working it?
Ignore the dent, I was going to cut it off when I saw the other cracks.
Click to expand...
Hi there, yeah I think like others mentioned you were forging too hot.
Tungsten steels like this one and the Japanese blue paper steels for example really don't like the higher temps.
I learned it the hard way in my forge-welding beginnings, lots of steel bits looking like graham biscuits and that is a complete no-go for a good blade.

Also with all that tungsten it doesn't move while hot as easy as 26c3 for example.
But it would be good practice to lower your forging temps a bit anyway for other stuff also, your steel will benefit from it quite a good bit. Very hot forging can get problematic with retained austenite that is near impossible to get rid of, especially in very high carbon steels like 26c3, sheffcut and Wolfram Special.

If you are forging in the same bracket as the F1-F2-F3 steels mentioned in the post higher you should be fine. A good normalizing cycle at 1700f should be done afterwards, and a short DET anneal is recommended with this steel.
If forged and heat treated right it is a steel that can give very nice results. Basically Aogami 1ish for a fraction of the price.
 
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