Wtc Knife Auction Is Back On...

fracmeister

Petroleum Engineer
Joined
May 26, 1999
Messages
1,686
The link is here. I got approval to bid last time. I made numerous suggestions. One of the knifemakers told me that he had agreed not to make anything else with the steel -- he offered it to me if I was the winning bidder. I suggested checking with all the makers and at least being able to be unequivocal that no more would be made and possibly offer the remaining steel. I suggested that an independent appraisal might give a FMV now that we could establish the FMV as < 25000$ (via one auction) -- potentially leading to a tax break. I suggested a starting bid of 10,0000 to 15,000. I made a number of additional suggestions but they were wasted breath. All that said, I do hope they sell for more than 25,000$.
 
I hope that I am wrong, but I have a feeling that this auction is going to end up the same way the last one did.
 
So they changed nothing and just relisted? If nothing's different what's going to make it sell this time?

edit--Just noticed there's a second thread going on this discussion.
 
where did the last one end?

No bids after ten days.

The minimum bid was $25,000. They say that proceeds will go to charity, but then declare that the fair market value of the set will be the winning bid; this means that there's no tax deduction possiblity here. If they were to declare the FMV to be $10,000, for example), then the buyer could probably (and I say probably because I don't know the winner's tax situation. Consult your tax professional for specific advice about your unique tax situation.) deduct the amount in excess of $10,000 from their federal income tax. For most folks in the financial league to be buying $25,000 knife sets, this amounts to getting a rebate of almost 40% (more if you face state tax too) of the amount in excess of $10,000. The charity, of course, still gets the full amount. That would make the purchase a lot more attractive to high-dollar bidders.

A lot of what we call "high net worth individuals" have a charitiable trust through which they make their charitable donations. Such a trust must give away 5% of its earnings every year. If such an individual bought this set, they could pay the $10,000 from their own disposable funds and have their trust pay the remaining $15,000+ dollars. That way, they get the knives to display in their den for $10,000 out of their own checking account and the $15,000+ (which is money they'd have given away anyway) gets counted toward their trust's 5% requirement.

The winner may end up being a business. For example, a knife company may buy this set to display in its own lobby, board room, or the CEO's office. Companies like to brag about how much they give to charities, especially charities like New York Fire Fighters. Buying a $25,000 decorator accent for the board room is the sort of thing that gets CEOs in trouble with shareholders. But giving $15,000 to New York Fire Fighters is the sort of thing that makes shareholders proud to be shareholders. So, again, it's desirable to separate the two components.

It amazes me that this managment company their using, which, if you look at their website, has done some high-dollar charity auctions ($60,000 for two tickets on the last Concorde flight, for example) isn't handling these knives in a more savvy way.

As my sainted father often said, "If you always do what you've always done, then you'll always get what you've always got."

The auction listing on eBay looks the same. I can only hope that they've done some behind-the-scenes stuff differently. Otherwise, I fear that they're only gonna get what they've always got.
 
I did get a phone call advising me of the relisting after I emailed and asked about it. I can imagine others thinking just what I have...OK, maybe it is worth more than 25k...but I don't want to bid first at that level! I know an ebay guy that sold a 235,000$ Ferrari on ebay. Didn't sell the first few times with an opening bid of $200,000 and a reserve of $225,000. He relisted it at a 100,000$ opening bid and the same reserve -- I even bid 125,000$ on it (knowing the reserve) and there were about 10 more bids before it got to the reserve -- At least the guy bidding 235 knew that someone was willing to offer 234k!

Good luck to them.... it doesn't make sense to me, but these guys are the alleged professionals.
 
The process to bid is designed to scare off the marginalia. Ebay requires a credit card type confirmation on file to make a bid over 15,000$ or another verification of identity. Then Kompolt requires that you post a letter from your bank guaranteeing the bid. It has to be faxed and then delivered to them within 48 hours. I think these are good requirements, but they basically guarantee that no bids would be received in the first day or two.

My guess is that they got enough feedback from people who either signed up the first time or didn;t get done in time to keep the initial bid price.
 
I've got the credit card on file with eBay, ID verified, all that stuff. It's this "letter of honor" thing that's got me nervous. I've never heard of such a thing. I've gotta go in and see Angie tomorrow, I should ask her about it and what the procedure is.
 
My guess is that they got enough feedback from people who either signed up the first time or didn;t get done in time to keep the initial bid price

That's what I mean when I say that I hope they've done something behind the scenes and aren't just relisting it for no reason. I really can't believe that they would. This is a professional firm with experience in these sorts of things.
 
as the firefighter responsible for the collection of the steel and getting the project started : i will state that all the makers involved gave me their word that no other knives would be made from the steel. to do so first of all would be totally reprehensable (to profit from this event is unthinkable)these guys are true americans and that is why they got involved in this .. secondly how in the world could they verify that the steel was indeed wtc steel, with out someone to confirm its source(namely me).. and thirdly to make any more knives out of the steel would totally devalue their contributions to this one of a kind set.
 
Originally posted by Keith Montgomery
I hope that I am wrong, but I have a feeling that this auction is going to end up the same way the last one did.




It did, The opening bid is way too high. And far too much bs to go through to bid. They should start the auction at $1000 per knife and just require the bidder to be pre-approved by the seller to bid. eventually these will be sold, probably quietly for $8000 or $9000.

Drew
 
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