WWII Japanese sword w/questions

mhawg

mhawg

Joined
Jan 10, 2003
Messages
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This is the sword my father brought back from Japan in about 1950. He was an Army Infantry Lieutenant while serving in Japan and Germany. He believes that it is an officer's sword. It has begun to show signs of deterioration from age. It has been handled very little, the old man saw to that, but it has been indoors in an air-conditioned environment in SC for all of these years. What I want to know is; 1. Is there anything special about this sword. 2. what do I need to do to help preserve and/or repair it and it's scabbard.

This is where it has rested most of my life, no, that is not an active fireplace.
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Here are some shots I took outdoors of the sword and scabbard
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First of all I believe those to be Kai Gunto mounts... which are different from Shin Gunto mounts. If I'm not mistaken Kai Gunto mounts were Naval mounts. Most Shin Gunto mounts have the brass tsuba with the little heart type cutouts in the corners while the Kai's had an oval tsuba usually with a copper rising sun type plate on top and bottom.
 
If you're comfortable removing the handle an image of the tang would be most helpful... often these swords are machine made and have only simple armory marks on the tang... but sometimes you find a genuine Gendaito blade or something perhaps even older.
 
So that would involve just slipping out the 2 wooden pegs to free the blade?
 
mhawg said:
So that would involve just slipping out the 2 wooden pegs to free the blade?
Click to expand...

Yeah... look at them closely though... one side will be a larger diameter than the other... it's cone shaped... you want to push it out FROM the small end. And do not clean the tang... if it's a sword of any value the patina is a part of it's overall worth. You can't always tell my file marks either... I've seen machine made Guntos with file work on the tang... I think they did this so that it gripped the inside of the tsuka (handle) and would resist slipping. Remove the pins and just gently pull off the tsuka... if it resists... take a wooden mallet (Like that in a kitchen) and give a gentle tap on the top of the tsuba (Guard)... not to much though... if it's a really on there you might want to consult a professional... the last thing you want to do is damage it. If it takes more than a tap... walk away. There might be a pin you can't see that has been covered by settling tsuka ito (Handle Braiding). To knock out the pins get a small wooden dowl (Spelling) and use it like a punch... hit the dowl with a small hammer to knock out the pin. It should be tight... but not like a steel roll pin or anything... it may very well be loose though as these things wear with age and often need be replaced.
 
Often with the pins removed if you just choke up under the tsuba and squeeze it will slide the tsuka free from the tang about an inch and then removing it from there is simple.
 
Steel-Junky said:
Yeah... look at them closely though... one side will be a larger diameter than the other... it's cone shaped... you want to push it out FROM the small end. And do not clean the tang... if it's a sword of any value the patina is a part of it's overall worth. You can't always tell my file marks either... I've seen machine made Guntos with file work on the tang... I think they did this so that it gripped the inside of the tsuka (handle) and would resist slipping. Remove the pins and just gently pull off the tsuka... if it resists... take a wooden mallet (Like that in a kitchen) and give a gentle tap on the top of the tsuba (Guard)... not to much though... if it's a really on there you might want to consult a professional... the last thing you want to do is damage it. If it takes more than a tap... walk away. There might be a pin you can't see that has been covered by settling tsuka ito (Handle Braiding). To knock out the pins get a small wooden dowl (Spelling) and use it like a punch... hit the dowl with a small hammer to knock out the pin. It should be tight... but not like a steel roll pin or anything... it may very well be loose though as these things wear with age and often need be replaced.
Click to expand...

Very good advice. Didn't realize SJ was so well-informed on these matters.
 
OldPhysics said:
Very good advice. Didn't realize SJ was so well-informed on these matters.
Click to expand...


I've had a long lasting love affair with Japanese swords. I used to own a Gendaito from Ishido Teruhede. It was a beautiful piece... unfortunately money troubles forced me to part with it. I also had a machined Kai Gunto. It wasn't anything special but it was quite a finctional well made sword. Even their basic swords the Japanese took seriously.
 
Rich S said:
You might check my Japanese sword site for more info. Look under the military swords
pages, etc. The info given so far is right on. If I can be of help just post here.

BTW Steel-Junky - I also have an Ishido Teruhide in civilian mounts that
I used for iaido (back when I had knees that worked :-)

Rich S
The Japanese Sword Index
http://www.geocities.com/alchemyst/nihonto.htm or
http://home.earthlink.net/~steinrl/nihonto.htm
Click to expand...


He was a fine smith... Mine was an excellent example. It was a sight to behold. I had a Koto merchants sword for a while... it didn't have papers but the lines seemed to indicate that it was well crafted. The tang was shortened and part of the signature was cut off. It was made into a semi-waki style sword I assume to be concealed... I bet that thing saw some interesting times.
 
OK, I finally got the confidence to take the handle off of this sword. Is is a "Hattori Hanzo Sword"... just kidding. I showed the peg (mekugi) I removed whole, the other was in pieces. I assume this is bamboo. If anyone can give me any info on this sword it would be appreciated. Thanks.

XXX
BFBRADFORDSWORD_2533.jpg

XXX
BFBRADFORDSWORD_2548.jpg

XXX
BFBRADFORDSWORD_2538.jpg

XXX
BFBRADFORDSWORD_2550.jpg
 
Steel-Junky writes:

"First of all I believe those to be Kai Gunto mounts... which are different from Shin Gunto mounts. If I'm not mistaken Kai Gunto mounts were Naval mounts. Most Shin Gunto mounts have the brass tsuba with the little heart type cutouts in the corners while the Kai's had an oval tsuba usually with a copper rising sun type plate on top and bottom. "

Exactly! Note the little "anchor" stamp on the tang: this denotes Naval issue as does the Kai mounts... mounts DO MATTER in military Japanese swords. They speak of who the sword was issued to and the rank of the person who wore it. It, as with any knife could be/can be/was monkeyd with perhaps but thats another matter. Originally, these mounts, scabbards and tassles were significant of rank and duty.

I'd bet it is also, as were many marine blades both Royal Japanese Marines and Marine Landing Force, made of stainless steel. See how bright the blade and tang? ... like the day it was made. These date from at least 1937 or perhaps earlier; most are unsigned so your blade may be quite valuble really. I passed on one at the last show for $700 not as nice as yours.

m
 
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Here are the Arabic numerals '3' & '7' on the separate parts. I cannot distinguish a clear '7' on the tsuba however.

XXX
TSUBA
BFBRADFORDSWORD_2566.jpg

XXX
SEPPA & SEPPA FUSED ONTO FUCHI
BFBRADFORDSWORD_2569.jpg
 
Takayama To Masahiro kore saku

Made by Masahiro (at) the Takayama Sword (factory)

Not a traditionally made nihon-to. Western steel and oil quenched.....Naval Officer's mounts.....
 
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