ZDP-189 Leek vs. S30V Random Leek - which and why?

F

FliGuyRyan

Joined
Dec 2, 2005
Messages
456
Alright. I just canceled my order on a new random leek because I remembered the hype about the ZDP-189.

Here's the thing... I don't care about plain or serrated (I'll like it either way) or the price difference. As one member put it, I just want something EXTREMELY sharp that will stay that way for awhile. I want it thin and I wanted easy one-hand opening which the Leek fulfills all of these.

The problem is, I hear about S30V being hard to sharpen. What is the verdict on the ZDP-189 and is it more difficult and annoying to sharpen than the S30V? And does the blade edge indeed last THAT much longer on the ZDP-189? Also, are there advantages to the Random Leek's blade style concerning strength of the blade (I heard about a couple ZDP-189's tips breaking).

Also, this might be a little out of this league, but what about the Damascus on the way? Is that better than ZDP-189 and what is the proposed cost if known?

Those of you with experience, please let me know what you would do and why?

Thanks again!
Ryan

P.S. This will eventually go to Iraq, so I might not have a sharpener and will one or the other stand up better (reverse tanto)? I'm not terribly tough on my knives (my Leatherman Charge TTi and Benchmade auto-Stryker), but I want the reassurance that it will hold up...

Also guys, this is not related to this topic at all, but what is a good lubricant for knives and possibly for flash light threads? Will Nyogel work for both?
 
From what I understand The harder the steel is, the more brittle it is, zdp189 is very hard and brittle. I myself have no problem getting s30v sharp and keeping it sharp. I much prefer s30v!
 
ZDP would be much harder to sharpen, and the S30V really shouldn't be any harder to sharpen than your Stryker's 154cm.
 
The problem is, I hear about S30V being hard to sharpen.
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I don't know where you heard this, but I disagree.
Using my Spyderco Sharpmaker, I have no problems sharpening S30V.
 
If you want a knife to hold a razor edge as long as possible ZDP-189 is hard to beat. I can’t say it’s as easy to sharpen as VG-10, but it won’t burr up like S30V does.
I wouldn’t count on the tip holding up under harsh conditions, the Leek is normally made with a specifically thin tip. It cuts very well, but doesn’t like to punch through car doors etc.
You have ups and downs to each one, but as long as you’re careful with the tip I’d get the ZDP-189 Leek. You’d be getting what is arguably the classiest version out there, and get to try out the latest in metallurgical technology first hand.
The ZDP-189 Leek going for a really good price at Knifeworks right now.
http://www.knifeworks.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=7896&HS=1
 
Joshua J. said:
I wouldn’t count on the tip holding up under harsh conditions, the Leek is normally made with a specifically thin tip. It cuts very well, but doesn’t like to punch through car doors etc.
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Which tip do you think would be stronger from these materials:
440, ZDP, or S30V?
 
FliGuyRyan said:
Here's the thing... I don't care about plain or serrated (I'll like it either way) or the price difference. As one member put it, I just want something EXTREMELY sharp that will stay that way for awhile. I want it thin and I wanted easy one-hand opening which the Leek fulfills all of these.
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No questions ZDP189 way better then CPM S30V. Both are PM steel, but CPM S30V is like entry level PM as 420 among non PM, and ZDP is on top so far.

However I think you'll better find miniCyclone ZDP which bit tougher then Leek.

Kershaw-Cyclon-009-ZDP.jpg


And for sharpening - the better steel - easier to make it extremely sharp. I never any trouble to sharpen ZDP as well as CPM S90V and other top steel. But get diamond sharpener.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
I just received my ZDP-189 Leek (dated Nov 06 - good, bad, feedback on date?) and so far it's amazing. The blade is beautiful as it's polished and the titanium handle is really elegant in my opinion. I wanted the Leek because I enjoy the blade shape over the miniCyclone's shape and I like how light and small it is. I bought the original standard Leek for my dad and I like mine a lot better - hehe. We'll see how it goes, as I may just buy a Random Leek just for kicks...
 
Kamkazmoto...

I took a look at the S30V/G10 Leek and I liked it except for the fact that in my opinion it defeats the main Leek characteristic of being thin. Grip is indeed the best with the G10, but even with my ZDP0-189/titanium Leek, I find the titanium pretty "grippy" and it's not smooth but slightly textured. Also, it's SUPER LIGHT, which is not a comparison to the S30V/G10 Leek as far as weight, but just a general statement about the knife.

I like the knife a lot though... it's awesome. The only thing is the tip and durability of the ZDP-189. We'll see how it holds up, or I might be buying a Random Leek anyways. I saw some forum member sent his ZDP-189 back to Kershaw because the tip broke. He asked if they could put a S30V Random Leek blade on it, and that's pretty sweet. S30V/titanium would be cool as well.
 
My ZDP189 Leek broke at the tip while cutting soft plastic (search to find my thread on this), then rusted/pitted terribly after getting damp and not being cleaned until the next morning. Having spent quite a chunk of change on it, I was not happy.

Kershaw could not have been better to deal with. They sent me my titanium handle with an S30V Leek blade in it. It is a terrific combination, I am totally in love with this light, attractive, edge-holding combination.
 
Patapsco Mike said:
My ZDP189 Leek broke at the tip while cutting soft plastic (search to find my thread on this), then rusted/pitted terribly after getting damp and not being cleaned until the next morning. Having spent quite a chunk of change on it, I was not happy.

Kershaw could not have been better to deal with. They sent me my titanium handle with an S30V Leek blade in it. It is a terrific combination, I am totally in love with this light, attractive, edge-holding combination.
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As I remember it was not cutting soft plastic, but some kind of drilling, anyway twisting move were applied to Leak thin delicate tip. Did you do the same to your CPM S30V leak blade?

I think it will be fair enough to do while you talk too much about this, so ZDP got reputation as being too brittle based on this single case of misuse.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
nozh2002 said:
As I remember it was not cutting soft plastic, but some kind of drilling, anyway twisting move were applied to Leak thin delicate tip. Did you do the same to your CPM S30V leak blade?

I think it will be fair enough to do while you talk too much about this, so ZDP got reputation as being too brittle based on this single case of misuse.

Thanks, Vassili.
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You have a pretty good memory Vassili. I was making a hole in a soft plastic kids sliding board- opposite another hole I had made with another knife. The plastic was slightly thicker than what you find on a screw cap for a gallon of milk. I used a slight twisting motion, you are correct, but I am not a knife novice. I was aware of the potential for damage, and I was being very gentle. A knife that can't do what I was trying to do is IMO useless for EDC. And yes, the S30V Leek finished the hole, and has since expanded that hole several times (as leaves clogged it up from time to time) with no problem.

Mine was not the only broken tip, three or four others had their tips break.

Last, the tip breaking wasn't even my biggest problem- the rusting was. ZDP189 is very, very prone to rusting and pitting. This is another strike against it for a hard use EDC. I would never buy another ZDP189 knife unless it's a safe queen.
 
Patapsco Mike said:
You have a pretty good memory Vassili. I was making a hole in a soft plastic kids sliding board- opposite another hole I had made with another knife. The plastic was slightly thicker than what you find on a screw cap for a gallon of milk. I used a slight twisting motion, you are correct, but I am not a knife novice. I was aware of the potential for damage, and I was being very gentle. A knife that can't do what I was trying to do is IMO useless for EDC. And yes, the S30V Leek finished the hole, and has since expanded that hole several times (as leaves clogged it up from time to time) with no problem.

Mine was not the only broken tip, three or four others had their tips break.

Last, the tip breaking wasn't even my biggest problem- the rusting was. ZDP189 is very, very prone to rusting and pitting. This is another strike against it for a hard use EDC. I would never buy another ZDP189 knife unless it's a safe queen.
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Well, drilling hole in soft plastic twisting blade (Leak blade!) and cutting soft plastic are very different thing. Now did you make hole bigger with CPM S30V leak or drill another hole with it same way as with ZDP189? Again cutting off edges of the existed hole and drilling one is different things, different kind of load on the tip - no twisting.

I also have some experience with knives and I think Leak with ZDP is excellent
cutter. I also will not drill with it in similar situation, but rather pry or better to use its cutting power with nidle like tip I rather cut out that plastic in small circle then use it as a drill twisting it. At least my experience with knives give me hint not to twist it - is it ZDP or CPM S30V or even 440A.

I have good memory and remember that there is no solid evidence that ZDP is brittle more then any other premium steel. All reports including yours are misuse not like it break during normal cut.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
FliGuyRyan said:
I saw some forum member sent his ZDP-189 back to Kershaw because the tip broke. He asked if they could put a S30V Random Leek blade on it, and that's pretty sweet. S30V/titanium would be cool as well.
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Patapsco Mike,

It was you I was referring to in the above post. I remember reading that huge thread you started and I learned a lot from your thread. Vassili brings a valid argument to the table though as far as the uses on the Leek's resume not being a twisting/drill like motion.

Because of your thread (which I appreciate the debate and references), I now will carry my CRKT M16-13M with AUS8 for "drilling/prying" work, and use my ZDP-189 for cutting. I love the Leek for it's thin profile, light weight, and ultra-sharp, high edge-retention blade. It's a beautiful knife for sure, and I will have to get a good sharpener to mess around with angles and grind and all that stuff that I have NO IDEA about... any help on that would be great. I know there has to be a "sharpening 101" thread on here. Any ideas? Also, does anyone know of a lubricant for both knives and flashlight threads?

Thanks guys... any more thoughts?
Ryan
 
FliGuyRyan said:
Patapsco Mike,

It was you I was referring to in the above post. I remember reading that huge thread you started and I learned a lot from your thread. Vassili brings a valid argument to the table though as far as the uses on the Leek's resume not being a twisting/drill like motion.

Because of your thread (which I appreciate the debate and references), I now will carry my CRKT M16-13M with AUS8 for "drilling/prying" work, and use my ZDP-189 for cutting. I love the Leek for it's thin profile, light weight, and ultra-sharp, high edge-retention blade. It's a beautiful knife for sure, and I will have to get a good sharpener to mess around with angles and grind and all that stuff that I have NO IDEA about... any help on that would be great. I know there has to be a "sharpening 101" thread on here. Any ideas? Also, does anyone know of a lubricant for both knives and flashlight threads?

Thanks guys... any more thoughts?
Ryan
Click to expand...

Use gun-oil, like Formula 3 or something - do not use any Militec, TufGlide or WightLighting - all of them does not work as a knife lubricants at least for me - gun oil works perfectly. I also use some silicon loaded fabric I bought from

Alpha Knife Supply
Chuck Bybee
Titanium Man
titanium.man@gte.net
425-868-5880

As well as sharpening - if you has no experience - get Spyderco Sharpmaker. But ultimate solutoion will be Extra Extra Coarse DMT diamond stone + Extra Fine. This will cover all your needs. If you need moer - Extra Extra Fine DMT and leather loaded with 1 micron diamond powder will cover almose any sharpening needs even really sick needs...

But have a look at Mini Cyclone or Spydecro Delica-Endura if you want thick tip.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
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