ZDP help

L

Lucky Bob

Joined
Mar 31, 2006
Messages
956
I'm having waaaay too much trouble getting my Krein-reground ZDP Leek sharp. I just got my VG-10 knife just-about-hair-popping, but I can't get rid of the #$%^ burr on the Leek!

I've tried diamond (although I don't have a good diamond hone on me, it's waiting at my folks'), a Gatco, and a Sharpmaker. I know ZDP is hard, but it's Krein-reground, and it should sharpen so much faster than it is!


Any help for a noob?

EDIT: AND 120 and 320 grit "ruby" SM stones from Congress, which I just got, which is why I busted out the ZDP in the first place.
 
I have no troubles at all with ZDP-189.

How and with what are you sharpening it?

Thanks, Vassili.
 
For me, lighter pressure got me to the edge faster with the Sharpmaker. You still need to use enough pressure to feel the stones bit into the steel but try to avoid muscling it.
 
nozh2002 said:
I have no troubles at all with ZDP-189.

How and with what are you sharpening it?

Thanks, Vassili.
Click to expand...

As said in the OP, I tried with Congress "ruby" 120 grit, 320 grit, then medium and fine stones on the SharpMaker, all at the 30 inclusive degree setting. Giving up on that, I tried using my Gatco, coarse through extra fine, at 11 with a microbevel at 15. I tried using Cliff's trick of cutting against the hone to cut off the burr and get fresh steel, but then it took too long to re-establish the cutting edge and I gave up for the night.

dczippo said:
For me, lighter pressure got me to the edge faster with the Sharpmaker. You still need to use enough pressure to feel the stones bit into the steel but try to avoid muscling it.
Click to expand...

Hmmm... I think I have, but I'll try even lighter strokes next time, see if it helps.




Thanks!
 
What's worked for me with ZDP is the raise a burr along the entire edge on both sides and then strop it away with the same grit and same angle before moving on to a finer grit and repeating. You can also do it edge-leading if you're using a Sharpmaker setup, but edge-trailing has been my pal so it's what I recommend.

If you don't mind wasting a little steel, C-Dawg shared this technique with me:

Do 15 strokes on your hone over the whole blade on one side. Has a burr been raised? If not, repeat the 15 and check again. When the burr is from tip to ricasso, repeat on the opposite side (including forming the burr from ricasso to tip). From there, do 13 strokes per side followed by 11, 9, 7, 5, 4, 3, 2, and one. The purpose of the large amount of strokes (and those numbers are arbitrary, you can get by with less and the knife will be just as sharp - just sharing how I learned it) is to get each bevel even with itself and to increase the likelihood of completely removing the scratches from the previous grit. Continue that way up until your finest grit and then slice the edge lightly into some softwood or a cork to remove the final burr.

Works for me on ZDP, VG-10, and, well, a ton of other steels. Hope it'll work for you, too.

Oh, and please do go lighter as dczippo suggested. The small shape of the Sharpmaker hones amplifies the pressure you're putting on those thin, thin edges big-time.
 
Lucky Bob said:
As said in the OP, I tried with Congress "ruby" 120 grit, 320 grit, then medium and fine stones on the SharpMaker, all at the 30 inclusive degree setting. Giving up on that, I tried using my Gatco, coarse through extra fine, at 11 with a microbevel at 15. I tried using Cliff's trick of cutting against the hone to cut off the burr and get fresh steel, but then it took too long to re-establish the cutting edge and I gave up for the night.
Click to expand...

I use DMT diamond stones ExtraExtraCoarse if needed Coarse and Extra Fine and then GreenRouge on the leather. I reported results... I do not know about that "advanced sharpening tricks" - my simple one works fine always on any steel.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
I may just wait until I go to my folks' for Thanksgiving and get my hands on my DMT XC stone, and then just wail on that one.
 
Extra coarse will not help you to get rid of burr. It eats metal like crazy and helps to form initial edge, with burr.

Are you sure you have one on the first place? Sorry, if you are not novice in sharpening, but I see before some people asking for help to get rid of burr, while they do not have one yet.

On this video burr is visible pretty good:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EP9tII6Tp7s

And my way to get rid of it is polishing (not stropping, which I believe only straighten it) with Green Rouge.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
nozh2002 said:
Extra coarse will not help you to get rid of burr. It eats metal like crazy and helps to form initial edge, with burr.

Are you sure you have one on the first place? Sorry, if you are not novice in sharpening, but I see before some people asking for help to get rid of burr, while they do not have one yet.

On this video burr is visible pretty good:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EP9tII6Tp7s

And my way to get rid of it is polishing (not stropping, which I believe only straighten it) with Green Rouge.

Thanks, Vassili.
Click to expand...
I'm 99% sure I have a burr (it bites as I slide my thumb past the edge in the spine-to-edge direction on one side, but feels perfectly smooth on the other), but I'm quite interested in your take on "polishing" instead of "stropping".

Care to elaborate?
 
You should be able to see it as it is seen on this video after first coarse stone.

I do not make a secret - it is all over this forum and I have it on YouTube.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EP9tII6Tp7s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WY8rhecws8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sI_iqAyb3xA

And DiamondBlades makes their supersharp edges this way:

cds4byu said:
That's right. They're sharpened on a 600 grit diamond slack belt until the wire edge (burr) is raised. Then the burr is removed on a cardboard wheel with white compound.

Carl
Click to expand...

And it takes few seconds.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
I watched the clips again... I still don't see how you differentiate between "stropping" and "polishing."
 
The green CrO on leather has never worked well for me, my best results at de-burring are with Spyderco Ceramic hones, either the fine or ultra-fine, and use Jeff Clark's technique. Basically super-elevate the knife to about twice the edge angle, and VERY LIGHTLY give it a couple of regular sharpening strokes on the hone. Then bring it down to the normal angle, and a couple more light strokes will do it.

The way I visualize the VERY LIGHT strokes is an old saying by Bob Ross (The Joy of Painting). Whenever he was painting a scene that required a super-light touch with the paintbrush, he would describe his technique as "two hairs and some air". That's a good description of VERY LIGHT!!!

Good luck!
 
sodak said:
The green CrO on leather has never worked well for me, my best results at de-burring are with Spyderco Ceramic hones, either the fine or ultra-fine, and use Jeff Clark's technique. Basically super-elevate the knife to about twice the edge angle, and VERY LIGHTLY give it a couple of regular sharpening strokes on the hone. Then bring it down to the normal angle, and a couple more light strokes will do it.
Click to expand...
So blade-first strokes? Sounds like it's worth trying!
 
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