ZT801 Elmax or S110V pro cons, opinions and wisdom based knowledge.

Joshua_Barney · Jun 10, 2015

I'm looking to purchase what I would call my first high quality knife. I like the ZT801, found it in S110v and Elmax I need some input...to make a decision. I'm not totally made up on which knife I want but I'm closer than I have been. I have toyed with the idea of a Kingdom Armory Mini Samaritan, Hinderer Skinner, and various ZT models. this will be my main knife My use will be hunting, fishing, slicing, dicing, self defense, cutting plastic,cardboard and myself (shaving) and Lastly for self defense. It also must be sexy and durable..I wont be hammering away with it a I Intend on getting me a Nessmuk or similar knife for that purpose. Currently the ZT 801 is tempting me I'm just not sure which steel to go with. thanks.

Charr · Jun 10, 2015

If it's just a question of which steel, I would personally go with the S110V. In my experience, it holds an edge longer than Elmax, and is still overall easier to sharpen (though it is still something you will probably want professionally sharpened unless you have an Edge-Pro or Wicked Edge generally) than Elmax is. It is a little less tough, but honestly most people won't notice it, and I don't think ZT has taken the hardness up enough for it to he too much of an issue.

Honestly, I just don't like Elmax that much unless it is from Microtech or on a custom knife. It generally doesn't come out as well as it should when larger companies like ZT and Lionsteel use it in larger productions. When treated right, Elmax performs similarly to M390 in many regards though, and it's excellent. Most of the time, it is hit or miss when it's used in larger productions, and you will get some blades that do not perform as they should.
If you want an edge to last linger though, S110V is a better choice generally. Just depends on what you prefer.

I also prefer the feeling of smooth stonewashed Ti over the grooves on the regular 801, but that is just me.

michaelm466 · Jun 10, 2015

S110V will hold an edge noticeably longer, the longest of the stainless steels, however because of that it will be the most time consuming to sharpen. Although, with diamond stones not really that big of a problem. Elmax hold an edge about like S30V, and is one of the toughest stainless steels and will be easier to sharpen. So you can have easier sharpening more often, or Harding sharpening less often. I prefer S110v in smaller EDC/ slicer type blades, and Elmax for harder use fixed or large hard use folders. For the 801, I'd go S110V

Charr · Jun 10, 2015

michaelm466 said:
S110V will hold an edge noticeably longer, the longest of the stainless steels, however because of that it will be the most time consuming to sharpen. Although, with diamond stones not really that big of a problem. Elmax hold an edge about like S30V, and is one of the toughest stainless steels and will be easier to sharpen. So you can have easier sharpening more often, or Harding sharpening less often. I prefer S110v in smaller EDC/ slicer type blades, and Elmax for harder use fixed or large hard use folders. For the 801, I'd go S110V

I've actually never had any trouble sharpening S100V. On the contrary, I usually found Elmax to be more of a pain than it was worth when talking about ZT's blades because it was very obnoxious to keep sharper longer with simple touch-ups on a strop, and regular stock removal was very rough, though not extremely hard.
Seems like S110V has a better grain structure than Elmax to me, since it feels much better on the stones and strop, and it also comes to a fiber finish much more easily.

If I was going to re-profile a blade, I wouldn't really want to have to do it in S110V because I imagine that would be rather time-consuming, but of I just stripped it occasionally, it was much easy to maintain for me and keep sharp.

And what you said about Elmax being similar to S30V is what bugs me about mass-produced blades in Elmax. When you buy an Elma blade from ZT, you can expect it to have edge retention similar to S30V or slightly better, but when I get a custom knife on Elmax, I usually find it holds it's edge more like M390 (though is still more annoying to sharpen but a little more tough), and that really bothers me.

Although, either way I still agree that S110V is the better steel in the case of the 0801.

hhmoore · Jun 10, 2015

The other side of that coin is that the s110v version is harder to find & typically posted at $100 (or more) over the price of the Elmax version on the exchange. You can buy a new Elmax 801 for about $80 less than the average posted price of a secondhand 110v.
I'm not knocking the 110v - in fact, I've kicked myself for not grabbing one when they were released - but, as your first quality knife, the Elmax version isn't likely to disappoint you.

Joshua_Barney · Jun 10, 2015

I guess that begs the question as to what a good price for an 801 with the s110v is? I know I dont have the foggiest idea......

Scurvy092 · Jun 10, 2015

The 0801S110V is one of my favorite knives. Gets a crap ton of pocket time and it's the cheapest knife in my collection. If you are going to be using it for light duty tasks, boxes, packages etc etc, it'll probably never go dull.

If you are going to be doing more medium duty stuff, go for the Elmax.

Sonnydaze · Jun 10, 2015

The Kingdom Armory Mini-Samaritan has a rather short closed grip-length...3 1/2"...Note these specs:
Overall Length: 6 1/2 in
Blade Length: 3 in
Cutting Edge Length: 2 7/8 in
I have owned a mini-Samaritan and it's a fine folder, but I gave it to my 12-year-old grandson.

The ZT 0801 is much larger for larger-sized hands.
Blade Length: 3.5 Inch (8.9 cm); Closed Length: 4.7 Inch (11.9 cm)
Overall Length: 8.2 Inch (20.8 cm); Weight: 5.8 ounces (164.4 g)

Both the Elmax and S110V are good steels. But be sure to buy one that FITS your hand-size.

Joshua_Barney · Jun 11, 2015

Scurvy092 said:
The 0801S110V is one of my favorite knives. Gets a crap ton of pocket time and it's the cheapest knife in my collection. If you are going to be using it for light duty tasks, boxes, packages etc etc, it'll probably never go dull.

If you are going to be doing more medium duty stuff, go for the Elmax.

What about field dressing animals. let me be specific "cleaning the animal" not actually quartering or bone-ing out game..maybe some skinning....?

Joshua_Barney · Jun 13, 2015

so would a knife in M390 be a better option than a knife in S110V?

flarp · Jun 14, 2015

Joshua_Barney said:
so would a knife in M390 be a better option than a knife in S110V?

Strictly looking at edge retention based on the blade steel, Ankerson's rope cutting tests ranked S110V a bit better than M390. If you're looking at a different knife entirely, then that's another matter.

I have an 0801 in Elmax, M390, and S110V. The one that gets the most use is the Elmax one (mainly because it's in green). With somewhat regular maintenance (quick touch-up on the Sharpmaker periodically), the edge retention is effectively the same for my uses. If you are cutting a lot of very abrasive items regularly or like to use your knives until they are dull before re-sharpening, then you would get more benefit from the S110V or M390 ones.

Fanglekai · Jun 14, 2015

Joshua_Barney said:
What about field dressing animals. let me be specific "cleaning the animal" not actually quartering or bone-ing out game..maybe some skinning....?

Geometry and edge finish matter more than steel type. Also keep in mind that processing game isn't the same as cutting rope, so a rope test has no bearing on processing game. Any sand, dirt, grit or anything else in the fur is going to dull any steel no matter what it is. There's no need for a super fancy knife to process game. You could easily get the job done with a $10 Old Hickory and use a $10 Kabar leather sheath.

Additionally, folders aren't ideal for processing game. Get a fixed blade that fits your budget. Get some sharpening equipment and learn how to use it if you don't already.

Joshua_Barney · Jun 14, 2015

Fanglekai said:
Geometry and edge finish matter more than steel type. Also keep in mind that processing game isn't the same as cutting rope, so a rope test has no bearing on processing game. Any sand, dirt, grit or anything else in the fur is going to dull any steel no matter what it is. There's no need for a super fancy knife to process game. You could easily get the job done with a $10 Old Hickory and use a $10 Kabar leather sheath.

Additionally, folders aren't ideal for processing game. Get a fixed blade that fits your budget. Get some sharpening equipment and learn how to use it if you don't already.

If geometry and edge finish are all that matter then none of us would need fancy knives or the next new or better steel (ymmv) I like folding knives and have never used anything other than a folder for cleaning animals. And id like a great steel too. I use a knife daily and a handful of times during the year I use one to clean animals. So a fixy isn't a necessity currently....I'm actually looking at a few different knives currently my short list for an EDC+ and may include others

Benchmade 940
ZT 801S110V
Kingdom Armory mini Samaritan

CelticCross74 · Jun 15, 2015

skip the 0801 and get either the knifeworks 0350 in M390 or a 0550 S35VN. For what youd be using the knife for those two are just better suited ergonomically are cheaper than the S110V 0801 and their steel is of similar performance. Ive got an Elmax 0801 thats has a mirror polished 15dps edge and a 0550 with the same mirror polished 15dps edge. 0550 has its edge backed up by a thicker blade and 0550 ergos are above the 0801. Both cut like scalpels but the 0550 is my "thumper" knife. Despite the thinned out edge I do quite a bit of cutting with it and the edge is still as keen as it was when I first got it back from being pro sharpened. Handle of 0801 doesnt have enough grip if your hands are wet sweaty

Fanglekai · Jun 15, 2015

Joshua_Barney said:
If geometry and edge finish are all that matter then none of us would need fancy knives or the next new or better steel (ymmv) I like folding knives and have never used anything other than a folder for cleaning animals. And id like a great steel too. I use a knife daily and a handful of times during the year I use one to clean animals. So a fixy isn't a necessity currently....I'm actually looking at a few different knives currently my short list for an EDC+ and may include others

Benchmade 940
ZT 801S110V
Kingdom Armory mini Samaritan

During the years I've been here I've seen maybe a handful of people who needed anything more than a basic cheap steel. Super steel is a marketing term. It's all about wants, and that's as good a reason as any to buy something. So buy what you want. I gave you my perspective, that's all. Geometry is king, though, and that's a fact.

Joshua_Barney · Jun 15, 2015

That's cool and I don't have a problem with that. I appreciate everybody's input and such as its informative. I won't argue geometry as I don't know anything about geometry....I like a nice looking quality knife super steel or not. Id like a new 940 with d2 steel but it's been hard to find as that's been a good steel for me in the past with a couple of knives.

My USA made old timer that my late grandfather gave me is going into safe place as its been used well and has always been razor sharp just a lot of sentimental value. I have my knives professionally sharpened always.. My sharpening skills quite frankly suck. a problem I hope to remedy over time and with a new wicked edge system to help...yay!

I've had really great cheap knives but I "want" something usable and a little flashy or different. I'm not into safe queen's either.

I do appreciate your feed back as it's very helpful.

Fanglekai said:
During the years I've been here I've seen maybe a handful of people who needed anything more than a basic cheap steel. Super steel is a marketing term. It's all about wants, and that's as good a reason as any to buy something. So buy what you want. I gave you my perspective, that's all. Geometry is king, though, and that's a fact.