1084 from Aldo's has alloying-HT?

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Ghostman3

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Jan 12, 2016
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So 1084 from Aldo's has some alloying to it. Every thread I search just says hear to non mag or just past and quench. Never really mentions and soak time or anything about getting the alloying into solution. Is this really the case though? Every other steel with alloying it's recommended to normalize with some higher temps around 1600 and down to "set" the alloys and then soaking before quenching. Should Aldo's 1084 be treated like 52100 or 80CRV2??

Also I bought a thermometer with ceramic sheath probe from Auburns Instruments and WOW!! So cool and well worth $90 to actually see the temps and I can set my forge to hold pretty darn steady at 1475 +/-10° which is really cool too. Now I just need a muffler. Is sch 40 sufficient thickness for a muffler?

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1084 does not require a soak.
I think what you want is called a "muffle."
 
A lot of what you are calling "alloy" are just trace elaments remaining from the melt becaus removing it all would not be cost productive.
 
I've forged a few yards of the last three batches of Aldo's 1084FG and definitely consider the HT to start there. My thought is that, even though it's a eutectoid steel, it's also heavily spherodized. High 1600f+ heats provide the energy needed to allow the available carbon to properly diffuse into the lattice. Then the last few descending uniform heats are aimed at grain refinement. My experience with njb 1084 quenched in Parks 50 is that no soak at any stage is necessary as long as you get there. That's basically unavoidable when you forge it and generally results in tools that both take and hold better edges relative to similar I've done by stock removal off the same bars. Even without mechanical reduction, I believe you will leave some performance on the table if you simply touch 1475f and quench.

Others will tell you different. Ignore them as they are wrong.
 
What you are seeing in those specs is what an honest and good suppliers tells you. Aldo could have just as easily said his 1084 has .88% carbon. .15% chromium, and .80% manganese. These are the only significant numbers in the analysis. There is silicon in all steel due to how it is made, and the other numbers are trace elements in parentages too low to affect performance or HT. Aldo posts the whole spec sheet so people can see exactly what they are getting.

As said, this mix has no significant alloy content requiring solution, and no excess carbon to require carbide formation ( beyond iron carbides). Once it reaches 1500F, it is ready for a quench in a fast quenchant.

1500F is about 75-85 degrees hotter than non-magnetic. You find when the magnet stops sticking, and heat one shade of red brighter ... then quench.
 
We have a batch of Aldos 1084 that need thermal cycling. Otherwise it would not take an edge. You could see the globules in the edge.
 
soak, normalizing, thermal cycling... for clarity, stock removal- which ones are absolutely required for aldos 1084 ?
 
john april said:
soak, normalizing, thermal cycling... for clarity, stock removal- which ones are absolutely required for aldos 1084 ?
Click to expand...

I normalize and thermal cycle everything I get from NJ Steel Baron because I'm under the impression (from discussion here) it's all in a spherodized state. Even 1084. The 1075 and 1084 I do in my forge by eye, everything else in a furnace. Stock removal or forged.
 
Ok, I wasn't sure if it had enough alloying to be considered alloying. If it is spherodized state which I was under the impression it was as well. Would a 1600+, cool to black, 1550 cool to black, 1450 cool to black, then aust temp and quench be sufficient to distribute carbon and refine grain?
 
Ghostman3 said:
Ok, I wasn't sure if it had enough alloying to be considered alloying. If it is spherodized state which I was under the impression it was as well. Would a 1600+, cool to black, 1550 cool to black, 1450 cool to black, then aust temp and quench be sufficient to distribute carbon and refine grain?
Click to expand...

If you add one more 1250 cool to black you have what I do. I use tempilsticks to measure temp doing this, which isn't perfect, but I think sufficient for 1075 and 1084.
 
kuraki said:
If you add one more 1250 cool to black you have what I do. I use tempilsticks to measure temp doing this, which isn't perfect, but I think sufficient for 1075 and 1084.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I think I'll give this a shot. I have the thermometer now so I'm thinking I should be able to get pretty close, but I might get some of those tempilsticks as well.
 
Spheroidized means the carbides are spherical shaped -- but they may be small or large spheres ! Small ones are nice , large ones may need soak.
 
mete said:
Spheroidized means the carbides are spherical shaped -- but they may be small or large spheres ! Small ones are nice , large ones may need soak.
Click to expand...

So if I cut into the steel (Aldo's 1084) and look at it, then it's okay to judge this by eye? If it looks okay then for stock removal could skip normalization before HT then, right?
 
Unfortunately you can't see it that way. Even large spheres are small, maybe 2 or 3 thousandths of an inch at most. You can see them by polishing and etching then with a microscope.
 
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