1084 heat treat

M

MCoughlin

Joined
Feb 1, 2005
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471
I just got 3' of 1084 from TKS the other day. I have not worked with this steel before and any help you guys could give me regarding where to start with heat treat (drawing temps etc.) would really be appreciated.

I tried the search without luck.

Mike
 
Brian..One question..Does the temp of the quenching water need to be anything specific? Other than that, thanks for the attachments. Exactly what I needed. I'm printing it off and it goes on the garage wall beside the O1 chart.

Barkes,

If I can get one ground out in the next couple of days I may give you a call before I heat treat for some tips. Thanks.

:D Mike
 
mikxx1 said:
Does the temp of the quenching water need to be anything specific? :D Mike
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Did you really mean to say that you were quenching in water? I would suggest quenching in oil; something like Park Metallurgical's #50 oil would be good.
 
Oh Ok. I looked at the info sheet and it said water or brine but if oils the way to go...that works for me. Thanks for the clarification.
Mike
 
Mike,

Water is the fastest quench and brine in next, but both are so severe that you can end up with a cracked or shattered blade. Oil is not as fast a quench, but is easier on your blade. Here's what Park Metallurical says about two of their quenching oils;
#50 QUENCH OIL Low viscosity quench oil that approaches water in quench speed, yet gives a more uniform, less severe quench than water. Recommended for open quench system operating below 120 deg F.

AAA QUENCH OIL The most popular, widely used quench oil. This patented accelerated quench oil provides maximum, uniform cooling rate for austenitized steels, as well as clean, easily washed work when properly maintained.​

I use both of these, #50 for "10XX series and "water quenching" steels, and AAA for O-1.
 
Barkes Knife Shop said:
I will help you. I use the 1095 all the time. And its almost like 1084. Its great for knives. And heat treats good as well. Call me sometime here at the Shop. I am here all day long. Will be happy to help you with this.

Barkes :thumbup:
http://my.hsonline.net/wizard/knifeshop.htm
1.812.526.6390
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Thanks for the help. I enjoyed talking knives with someone. Other than this forum I don't get to very often. Check your e-mail.

Mike
 
Barkes,
I clay hardened my 2nd 1084 blade today.
I tried tempering at 350F for 2 hours and got no change in color on the blade (I cleaned up the blade before temper with some 120grit so I could see the colors clearly after tempering). I'll raise the temp and try again. The hamon worked though I can see it already which is good.
Mike

Brian,
Have you done any 1084? I'm curious what other makers temper at because the chart you gave me states to temper at around 500f for hrc60ish. It appears my oven is off or my temp was too low. My oven seems fine for O1 @ 400 though:confused: .
Mike
 
Chris Meyer said:
Mike,

Water is the fastest quench and brine in next, .......

Chris, this is a very common misconception.Brine is faster than water.It has to do with the raised vapor point,and the increased thermal conductivity.
The order of quench speed is : Brine-Water-Oil-Air

Brine is often considered a gentler quench than water due to the fast that it cools quicker and more evenly,thus avoiding cracking more than water .A fast oil does this better for most knife steels that need quick quench times.
Stacy
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Mike, I use a bunch of 1084 and really like it. I quench in 130deg. peanut oil, temper in oven 1 hr. at 400degs., air cool, 1 hr. at 425degs. Has worked well for me with both small and large blades
Rick
 
Rick Lowe said:
Mike, I use a bunch of 1084 and really like it. I quench in 130deg. peanut oil, temper in oven 1 hr. at 400degs., air cool, 1 hr. at 425degs. Has worked well for me with both small and large blades
Rick
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Sounds good. I will go up a bit and see what happens. Can't see it hurting the blade as long as I work my way up in temp right? I used canola oil @ 140F with clay coating and full submersion for quench. I then gently ground off the crap so the blade was nice and clean and then tempered. I can see where a hint of straw coloring looked like it wanted to come out so I'll try working my way up in temp. Do you get the straw color with your method? I'm grateful for the advice I just don't want to go too far. It could be my oven too. I'm trying to get my toaster oven set up so I don't have to use my spanking new house one anymore. At this rate I may be going back to the house oven.:grumpy: We'll have to see. I had better results with it.

Mike
 
Mike,
Out of curiosity,what is your concern with the straw color?
If the steel is clean and the temper is done at the proper temps.It should have a color from straw to bronze.
 
I would second Stacy's question here. Color is fine for old blacksmith books, but we should really be thinking about time and temperature--and controlling both of them. I have gotten near purple colors by triple tempering 1084 for two hours each time. I did not clean the blade between cycles and there seems to be something of a cumulative darkening effect. But so what? I know exactly how hot the oven was. Color can be deceiving.

John Frankl
 
I'm not necessarily "concerned" about the color. I was using color as a secondary reference because my toaster oven is not digital and I was under the impression it should be a straw to bronze, as you said, color. I'm just starting to use 1084 and some advice I already recieved told me I should have straw to bronze coloring after temper. I just want to make sure everything is where I need to be because if it's not I'm going back to my house oven which is brand new and seems quite accurate to me. I do test all my blades before finishing but if anything crappy happens like chipping edges I don't want to be scratching my head wondering if it's the temper temp (because I'm new to this steel) or my oven. I want to know if this will work for tempering as using the house oven for 1 or 2 blades at a time seems quite costly after seeing this months bill. Anyway, thanks for the tips I will keep in mind color doesn't seem to be too important however I'll be willing to bet there will be some who disagree. lol
MIke
 
Mike,You should be fine with that color after temper.I love the look of blades when they come out of the oven.
A good pyrometer is a valuable tool,and should be on your list of "things I need".I think you will like 1084.
As john pointed out,time and temperature control are the primary things in tempering.Even 25 degrees can greatly affect the end result.Most ovens are not that accurate.Also don't rely on the digital readouts on home ovens.They are not necessarily accurate.Check any oven,even a $1000 Paragon can be off.Test cones are a good way to do this.
 
bladsmth said:
Mike,You should be fine with that color after temper.I love the look of blades when they come out of the oven.
A good pyrometer is a valuable tool,and should be on your list of "things I need".I think you will like 1084.
As john pointed out,time and temperature control are the primary things in tempering.Even 25 degrees can greatly affect the end result.Most ovens are not that accurate.Also don't rely on the digital readouts on home ovens.They are not necessarily accurate.Check any oven,even a $1000 Paragon can be off.Test cones are a good way to do this.
Click to expand...

Sounds good although I don't know what test cones are. Are they similar to tempil sticks (they melt when certain temp is reached)?
Thanks,
Mike
 
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