1095 hamon trouble

B

Big_TM

Joined
Mar 7, 2013
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Hey guys,
I'm having a bit of an issue with the hamons on my last batch of knives. This was the first time I used my new evenheat oven, I applied satanite on the blades let it dry then put them into the oven let it ramp up to 1475 and soak for 10 minutes then quenched in warmed canola oil. I could clearly see a difference in the steel from where the satanite was, yesterday I hand sanded them in up to 1000 grit. And then dipped them in my 4:1 water to acid mixture without any good results. The funny thing is that I also etched a knive that I heat treated with my coal forge and the hamon turned out great. I'm a little bit stumped by this and was wondering if anyone has had this problem as well?

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I've been trying on hammon lines too. I found that the only acid I get good results from is ferric chloride. I'm sure other people with more knowledge that I will have better advice for you, but that's what I got!
 
I tried using the electric oven for hamon a few times years ago. Then went back to using the forge.

Use a torch for smallish blade too.





 
I agree with Don, somehow, a forge of flame seems easier to get a hamon with. You get the edge up to temp, make sure everything is even ... and quench. The steel under the clay is just barely in the austenite range, and quickly drops back to pearlite while the edge converts to martensite. This makes a very distinct junction where they meet - called the hamon.

Also, you are not using a fast enough quenchant. You need Parks#50 or brine for 1095 to get an active hamon. The canola is slow enough that the heat under the clay bleeds down and wipes out any hamon. It will work good enough to harden the blade, but won't work well if you want a hamon.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
I agree with Don, somehow, a forge of flame seems easier to get a hamon with. You get the edge up to temp, make sure everything is even ... and quench. The steel under the clay is just barely in the austenite range, and quickly drops back to pearlite while the edge converts to martensite. This makes a very distinct junction where they meet - called the hamon.

Also, you are not using a fast enough quenchant. You need Parks#50 or brine for 1095 to get an active hamon. The canola is slow enough that the heat under the clay bleeds down and wipes out any hamon. It will work good enough to harden the blade, but won't work well if you want a hamon.
Click to expand...

What about W2? Could I do a 2 second quench in water, followed by a canola quench if I was going for a hamon in W2?

I got Walter Sorrels Hamon DVD, and as I think you know he does all his hamon quenching in water. That just scares the s*** out of me to do though. so I thought of an interrupted quench.
 
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My limited experience tells me 1095 requires a bit thicker clay application than W2. 1095 hamons are nice, but more subtle, in my limited experience. I tend to sand to higher grits with 1095 than W2, and tend to use more vinegar etching as well, to bring the white out more.
 
Thanks Don and Stacy for the help. Just another quick question then should I not use the oven for W2?

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Big_TM said:
Thanks Don and Stacy for the help. Just another quick question then should I not use the oven for W2?

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Click to expand...
I do not use the oven for W2, but I've been practicing a long time and do not over heat my blades. ;)
 
Big_TM said:
Thanks Don and Stacy for the help. Just another quick question then should I not use the oven for W2?

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Click to expand...

I use an evenheat for W2, and it works for me. Although I would likely overheat it in a forge!


 
If the blade thickness is quite thin, preheated canola oil, with good agitation, should be able to harden the knife. As far as bringing out activity, the quenchant plays a big role so one needs to tune the variables and settle with his own materials/methods.
The wildest, more organic hamon out there are often made with interrupted water quenches, whereas often P50 leads to more "painted" or "engineered" look. Steel's microstructures and temperatures also make/break the hamon activity.
All of this looks insanely complicated, this is the perfect field for having a notebook at hands and many testing specimens...in just one day you could figure out what setting works best for your shop.
The professionals here could help you with the starting tips
 
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