14c28n sandvik steel, any update on ht?

S

stezann

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Apr 13, 2011
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Hallo,
is there anybody out there which has experience with this steel?
I read an interesting thread from 2009 here on the bladeforums.com, and i wish someone has since developed experience with that steel and could give some suggestion on the ht, and share it's opinions on the steel.
Thank you

Stefano
 
stezann said:
Hallo,
is there anybody out there which has experience with this steel?
I read an interesting thread from 2009 here on the bladeforums.com, and i wish someone has since developed experience with that steel and could give some suggestion on the ht, and share it's opinions on the steel.
Thank you


Stefano
Click to expand...

I have been using it for about three years now and really like it. I put it in my oven at 1400 degrees and take it to 1940 degrees at the rate of 2400 degrees per hour then I plate quench it then sub zero it (-7 degrees)for about 30 minutes then temper it at 345 degrees for two hours. This gives me a 61 - 62 Rockwell which is what I want for my slipjoint blades. For springs I don't do the sub zero,I go from the plate quench to a temper at 1100 degrees for two hours.
I have made and used several prototype folders and used them extensively for day to day use and I like this stuff. I have had zero problems with staining and it holds an edge very well.
Do you have any other specific questions?
Note: All my temperatures are F.
 
Thank you very much Calvin, you gave me the numbers i was after.
you do plate quench, did you have bad experiences oil quenching this steel?
 
stezann said:
Thank you very much Calvin, you gave me the numbers i was after.
you do plate quench, did you have bad experiences oil quenching this steel?
Click to expand...

No,I've never had a bad experience oil quenching this steel because I've never attempted to oil quench it because it is an air quench steel. I didn't mention wrapping this steel in high temperature stainless steel foil because I assumed you already knew that much. You can quench it in still air but I plate quench it to minimize warping,I make folders and so I can't tolerate much warpage.
 
Thanks Calvin,
i have had experiences with a number of carbon steels, but for me it is the first time hardening stainless. I have available SS foil, but i was unsure about using it considering the short soak time (6 minutes) related to the 3 mm stock i made the knife from...my concern is the risk making a mess with the wrapping in the quenching time (i have no plate quench device). I was also thinking to quench into oil down to black, check for distortion, then still air, then sub-zero and then tempering a couple of times with quenches to sub zero in between.
Have i other options available, like for instance trying to wash the blade in thin clay instead of foiling?
Regarding the sub-zero quench, how do you place the blade, and where? Is it enough still air in home-freezer, or better submerged into alcool in a vessel?
I know the theory behind the procedure (continuos cooling, RA issues, carbides precipitation etc...) i think i really need to know some pratical tips from a first-hand experienced knifemaker like you, toghether with the nice tested numbers you kindly gave me.
best regards,

Stefano
 
stezann said:
Thanks Calvin,
i have had experiences with a number of carbon steels, but for me it is the first time hardening stainless. I have available SS foil, but i was unsure about using it considering the short soak time (6 minutes) related to the 3 mm stock i made the knife from...my concern is the risk making a mess with the wrapping in the quenching time (i have no plate quench device). I was also thinking to quench into oil down to black, check for distortion, then still air, then sub-zero and then tempering a couple of times with quenches to sub zero in between.
Have i other options available, like for instance trying to wash the blade in thin clay instead of foiling?
Regarding the sub-zero quench, how do you place the blade, and where? Is it enough still air in home-freezer, or better submerged into alcool in a vessel?H
I know the theory behind the procedure (continuos cooling, RA issues, carbides precipitation etc...) i think i really need to know some pratical tips from a first-hand experienced knifemaker like you, toghether with the nice tested numbers you kindly gave me.
best regards,

Stefano
Click to expand...

Sandvik's information says to get it below -5 deg F,no need for a soak. Your home freezer should handle that with no problem.
I think your wasting your time trying to do all that other stuff you are thinking about. You are unnecessarily complicating a very simple process. Have you ever heard if KISS? That stands for Keep It Simple,Stupid!:)
Google Sandvik,get the heat treat info directly from them and follow it religiously,they know their product better than anyone. They developed this steel in conjunction with Kershaw,they were using Sandvik 13C26 but wanted more stain resistance and better edge holding,thus 14C28N.
Be sure to use the high temperature stainless tool wrap,you don't want it to melt.
 
That is very interesting info Calvin and thanks for posting, I had read the Sandvik (UK) info and they only mentioned oil quench but my problem was getting the foil pack off the blade fast enough from a horizontal kiln solo in the shop!! I have seen some guy's in the Netherlands using vertical kilns, one removes the blade and the other stands buy with the pliers to rip the packet off and then straight in for the quench.

I just experimented with a frozen plate quench and achieved a 59hrc which I wasn't too disapointed with on a 5" bladed hunter but it is reassuring to read you have had good results this way for a few years.
 
Dovetailer said:
That is very interesting info Calvin and thanks for posting, I had read the Sandvik (UK) info and they only mentioned oil quench but my problem was getting the foil pack off the blade fast enough from a horizontal kiln solo in the shop!! I have seen some guy's in the Netherlands using vertical kilns, one removes the blade and the other stands buy with the pliers to rip the packet off and then straight in for the quench.

I just experimented with a frozen plate quench and achieved a 59hrc which I wasn't too disapointed with on a 5" bladed hunter but it is reassuring to read you have had good results this way for a few years.
Click to expand...

You don't have to freeze your quench plates,room temperature is good,freeze the blade immediately after plate quenching,take it below 0 degrees farenhite,to -5 or -10 no need for a long soak,then temper for the final hardness that you want.
 
:thumbup: Thanks for that, do think it would be better for a room temp plate quench?I keep the plates in an old freezer anyway but I have found with A2 steel the first blade quenched achieves 64/65 HRC and the second 63/64 I am now only processing the two at a time to keep the numbers up before the tempering cycle. I kind of just applied the same "shop" experience to the 14c thinking the quicker I got the temperature down it might be worth a point or two up the Rockwell scale and went with that, but with a final 59 HRC I certainly have room for improvement to give me the ability to choose relative to the blade.

Cheers
Toby
 
Cooling Rates

OIL - 410* C /sec ,
Copper Plates - 220* C /sec
Iron Plates - 100* C /sec
 
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