1st Post - Already Need Help With This Old Ka-Bar

C

charles_the_hammer

Joined
Feb 22, 2017
Messages
34
Hello everyone. New to the forum. I was wondering if I could pick your brains about what to do with this old knife I found. I didn't pay much for it, and I would like to possibly restore the handle on it. The blade actually appears to be in very good shape with little to no rust. Lots of parkerization there, it looks like. Not going to mess with the blade. I'm definitely no knife expert (hopefully this thing isn't a knock off) but I am pretty sure the markings read "US" on top and "CAMILLUS" on the bottom. The bottom part is a little sketchy since the guard has been welded on there.

The real issue is with the old leather handle. It's shot. It's dried up, cracked, and mildewed. There are about 3 leather rings that are broken and pop off, revealing a VERY rusty shaft in the middle. The rust is expanding a has stretched, deformed, and broken the leather. This is Georgia. Maybe the humidity got to it?

The pommel doesn't appear to be on all the way tight. Some pics I have seen have some metal protruding from the bottom of the pommel. This one looks pretty empty. Is something supposed to be welded in there? Also, here is a hole running through the pommel where it looks like a pin should be. I cal see through it.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure that in this shape it probably isn't "collector grade", so I would like to do some tinkering with it. The plan is to remove the rust and disassemble it as best I can, order a new handle parts set from Ka-Bar (to replace the pommel if I need to only $8.00) and install one of the newer synthetic handles - like the black or OD Green ones that come on their newer models. The handle replacement parts kit comes with those leather washers, but from what I have seen I don't think I want to mess with stacking and shaping those things.

Where should I go from here? Is there anything I need to look out for when disassembling? Is this thing "too far gone"? What's it going to take to get it back going again? And does anyone know a place I can source those synthetic handles? Do I need to get a hold of Ka-Bar? The only replacement handles I can find are stacked leather. I think I would have to get a "pro" to do those.

Anyway, sorry to be a pain in the keister with my first post. Any assistance would be much appreciated. Many thanks. Here are some pics of this beaut:

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20170222_160353_zps5b0m6fd1.jpg


Screenshot_2017-02-22-19-07-32_zpsnadzbaix.png


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Screenshot_2017-02-22-19-07-12_zpsaarw4fxw.png
 
Welcome ! So I don't think that is the original handle ,which is a good thing because it should be easy to replace
 
Thanks. I'm just glad to be here. I can't find a place that sells anything other than the leather rings. Maybe I am just using the wrong search terms but "Ka-Bar Replacement Grips/Handles/Parts" isn't being very helpful......
 
Ok, well what you have is not a Kabar. It's exactly what you said.... a Camillus. It's a Ka-bar look a like. Camillus' are inexpensive(under $30) knives. The handle has had severe water damage. Needs to be completely replaced. It's easy. I don't believe you can get Ka-Bar parts. Wouldn't anyway because it's not a Ka-Bar. Most people would just make a new guard. And the pommel is welded, or just peened on the end of the tang. Then just cold blue everything. You can find several "how to" instructional vids on YouTube. Have fun!

Oh yeah! I forgot. The previous post was correct. Someone DID try to put new leather rings on. They just never shaped it.
 
Lots of misinformation here.
The leather washers are new, and are available from KaBar's parent company, Cutco.
It simply needs to be ground to shape.
Camillus Mk2 knives are worth far more than $30. This pattern knife is identical to the KaBar and Ontario models. All were made to the same specs for the US government.
The pommel is held on this knife with a pin-that's why there is a hole in the side of the pommel.
 
Bill DeShivs said:
Lots of misinformation here.
The leather washers are new, and are available from KaBar's parent company, Cutco.
It simply needs to be ground to shape.
Camillus Mk2 knives are worth far more than $30. This pattern knife is identical to the KaBar and Ontario models. All were made to the same specs for the US government.
The pommel is held on this knife with a pin-that's why there is a hole in the side of the pommel.
Click to expand...

Your correct on the one point. These pommels are attached via pin stock. But those washers are absolutely not new! If you think they are, you've never done a leather handle. It's all dry rotted. And read what I said again. I already mentioned it was not shaped! Last, here ya go.
http://www.survivalprimer.com/a_word_on_Sunday/CAMILLUSCUTLERYMarineCombatKnife.htm

Please forgive my ignorance. $40 dollars not $30!!! Thank you bill ever so much for catching that $10 dollar difference and the plethora of misinformation!!! LOL. J/K Just havin' a go buddy. You are correct about the pin stock for the pommel. And it's very easy, and more rewarding to cut out the leather yourself. Not to mention I bet cheaper.

Oh yeah, the Camillus has a straight hand guard. The Ka-Bar has a CURVED handgyard. The Camillus and Ka-Bar are not the same. Period!
 
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Well, let me have a go now, OK?
Call KaBar and ask them who they recommend to fix your broken KaBar knife.
Then, get back with us here, OK?
 
Well that's fantastic Bill. I admitted you were correct about the handle pin. But you said the handle is new. Read the OPs post again.

"The real issue is with the old leather handle. It's shot. It's dried up, cracked, and mildewed."

What do you think? He doesn't know what dry rotted leather is? Do you think he doesn't know what mildew is. And I showed a link selling the knife for $40. So I was $10 off. Sorry, it's been about 12 years since I researched buying one of them. So I don't understand what you being a knife repair shop has to with my comment. I can admit to being wrong on something. You should take a note. Because it's just offputting when a person thinks everything they say is Gospel. Even when proof is right there. Your a liberal democrat, aren't you? That would make sense.

Anyway, nice little plug on your part though. But I don't think the OP wants to PAY YOU to do work for him. That's the difference between us. Besides that your a liberal- that I try to help. If I'm incorrect on a point I'm glad when someone tells me. Although using loaded statements like "lots of misinformation here", is just distasteful. But your here to make money. That's it! Your not looking to help. You look to spread your name and make money. Like you are doing now. So go ahead and respond with more banter. I certainly know who NOT to have ever repair a knife. Others will as well when you keep this up.

And I do see the handle repair kit for $7 now. I agree that's the way to go. I wasn't aware of that. I am now, thank you. Good to know.
 
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David- stop digging.

The leather washers show no sign (to me) of dry rot-though 3 of them are cracked. They also appear to have never been compressed, and they certainly have never been ground to shape.
What I believe you perceive as mildew looks to be paint on the steel pommel. I have a little more experience with things like this than most people.
I believe the Camillus version predates the KaBar version of this knife, BTW- though I am no expert on MkIIs.

I can promise you that I have more work than I want to do. I don't need to spread my name and make money, nor do I come here to hustle work.

As far as my political leanings, that would be none of your business-but you couldn't be more wrong, or more offensive.
 
Didn't mean to TRIGGER you there bill. BTW-I think Chuck Schumer is looking to hire you.

To the OP, Charles, I apologize to you for my part in taking your thread off topic. I'm done with him.
 
Hi,
Well,
I've seen the pictures here,
the first one does look like 3 of the washers are cracked (a dark spot),
but the rest just look like regular leather
not moldy/mildewy at all
and not dry rotted (no powder/dust/cracking)

"I've had" some leather thongs (strings), thick leather from a craft store ,
they look very much like the leather washers here,
they don't smell moldy and they're not falling apart


I've also thrown out a black leather belt that got moldy, mold/mildew was white, it smelled like mold ...


I dont think you can tell whats rotten by looking alone if it hasn't been polished


This next picture looks like damage but is it dry rot? I think so, but my confidence is low (80%?) because I don't have a lot of experience with leather

from Leather Handle Preservation - EDGED WEAPONS - U.S. Militaria Forum
XMF5M.jpg

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And sorry to tell you, but namecalling means that you cannot admit being wrong
And though there is a lot of that on bladeforums it is officially against the rules
 
Howdy folks. Didn't mean to cause a stir.

I was just using "Ka-Bar" as a general term for this type of pattern knife. I realize it's a Camillus. I call a Pepsi and an orange soda a "Coke", too. My apologies.

The leather washers were shot. They were put on there and never pressed, lacquered, or ground. Moisture gathered wherever the metal met leather. They could not be saved.

If the guard was welded on there, it wasn't welded too good because it popped off. I guess I have everything I need to reassemble it except for the pommel pin and the leather washers.

Will the leather repair kit from Ka-Bar still fit this thing? A friend of min has a grinder and he THINKS he can accomplish the handle shaping LOL.

Just got all the rust cleaned off after soaking two days in vinegar and scrubbing with a wire brush, Brillo Pad, 120 & 220 grit sandpaper, and #0000 steel wool.

308e7ce8-a68d-425b-97c1-13c63c0e3676_zps10kimnbe.jpg


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bucketstove said:
Hi,
Well,
I've seen the pictures here,
the first one does look like 3 of the washers are cracked (a dark spot),
but the rest just look like regular leather
not moldy/mildewy at all
and not dry rotted (no powder/dust/cracking)

"I've had" some leather thongs (strings), thick leather from a craft store ,
they look very much like the leather washers here,
they don't smell moldy and they're not falling apart.
Click to expand...

They cracked and crumbled to dust. The inside of them where they touched metal was the worst. No way they could have been salvaged. Again, I'm no knife expert but I don't think there was any way they could have been made right - especially when a new set of them is $7.00
 
charles_the_hammer said:
Howdy ... I guess I have everything I need to reassemble it except for the pommel pin and the leather washers.

Will the leather repair kit from Ka-Bar still fit this thing? A friend of min has a grinder and he THINKS he can accomplish the handle shaping LOL.

Just got all the rust cleaned off after soaking two days in vinegar and scrubbing with a wire brush, Brillo Pad, 120 & 220 grit sandpaper, and #0000 steel wool.
Click to expand...

Hi,
:thumbup: on discovering the true use for Apple Cider Vinegar :D
 
And as for the cost of one of these "new", I have $5.00 in this knife. I bought it at a pawn shop. The cost of repairing this one should be much less than buying a new one. I also like to tinker with stuff. If I thought this was a collectible knife I wouldn't have done what I did to it - I would have just left it alone. I guess I get some sort of strange satisfaction seeing something in bad shape fixed up and made usable again.

I also like the fact the blade is older because I think our country used to make better quality steel - and products in general - back in the day. Kinda like how I am looking for an old pre-'64 Winchester Model 70 chambered in .308 right now when I could just buy a Remington 700 for $600 new instead. I use a 45 year old Sunbeam toaster (Made in USA) every morning.
 
Taped up the blade and applied a coat of Rustoleum "Rusted Metal Primer". Going to paint these pieces flat black tomorrow. Leaving the blade bare for now. May also paint flat black after the handle is done.

BEFORE PRIMER:

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AFTER PRIMER:

20170224_232437_zpshwldxljw.jpg
 
When you get you new washers and get them compressed onto the tang, grind/file the leather in one direction only to cut it down. You do not need to lacquer it or otherwise treat the leather. After it is finish sanded (in the same direction,) you an put a few coats of paste wax on it.
 
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