.308 Win Rifle, Your top three choices, make and model, and why?

Marion David Poff

Marion David Poff

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Oct 8, 1998
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If you were looking to purchase one .308 Win semi-automatic, magazine fed rifle, with an eye for function and performance without passing the point of diminishing returns, what rifle would that be?
 
In a non-crew served weapon, in order of preference:

1) Knight's Armament (Stoner) SR-25
2) FN FAL (DSA, StG-58, L1A1)
... distant third
3) Armalite AR-10

STONER SR-25
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1st choice: A good M1 Garand--maybe the Peerless Grade N.M. M1 Garand from Fulton Armory--I've just got a soft spot for them.

2nd choice: M1A, DSA or SR25. It's a close race. I'd take any of them :D A buddy of mine owned an M1A, which he sold and later replaced with a DSA, so I've shot those two. I've wanted an SR25 since they came out. If I were forced to choose right now, I'd get an M1A Scout Squad Rifle.

I forgot about the 7.62 x 51 Galil. If SHTF I'd want the M1A or that. Spendy though . . .
 
Let me throw something in the mix.

I am probably leaning towards the DSA SA-58 FAL or a Springfield Armory product.

Functionally, what differentiates them?

What makes one a M1A and the other a FAL?

And you can feel free to get as technical as you like.

What are the functional issues, pistol grip versus rifle stock?

Can you get a M1A with a pistol grip?

Oh yeah, and I wanted to say, you guys are being really great with the information, thank you.
 
I say an M1A Match/loaded. Built like a tank, ultra-reliable and as or more accurate than any other semi 308, with the possible exception of the $10,000 HK sniper rifle. Personally, as much as i like the AR-15, and i DO like them, if reliability is foremost in your mind, i would stay away from rifles patterned after it. The AR design is not as inherrently reliable as the M14 design and can jam if any one of several things are slightly out of whack. Flame away, but i have a lot of expreience owning and shooting ARs, and they have a somewhat picky and inefficient gas system, the gas rings often cause problems, blown primers get stuck under the trigger completely disabling the rifle, you get bolt-over jams when the bolt fails to strip the top round, something the green folowers are said to correct, and theres more, but in any case, none of these things are a concern with the M14's rugged, rotating bolt action, and more reliable gas system. 20 rounds of reliable 308, under an inch at 100 yds, hard to beat. Get the composite stock to save weight. Next choice is an FAL.
 
Whenever my friends and I get into these "what if" debates, my comments are always tempered by the fact that I am a handloader. Basically, I can handload with any combination of powder, brass, bullet or primer; as a bullet caster, I can pour modern bullets and even bullets from the last century that are no longer made commercially.

Before I begin, let me say that the .308 is a fine cartridge, and because it's a military caliber, you can buy them by the ton. Just about every firearm manufacturer makes a .308; I don't even know all of the bullet manufacturers that provide all of the bullet weights.

Having said that, if I was looking for a firearm/load combination as I think you mean, I would start out with another cartridge--and that is the 7mm 08.

Any firearm could be rebarreled, and the magazines should still work without being modified. The 7mm bullet shoots flatter, hits just about as hard and groups tighter in my experience. 7mm bullets come in a vast array of weights and types, even a Ballistic Tip.

I intend to rebarrel my Ruger Ultra-Light .243 Win to 7mm 08 or 7x57 when the time comes.
 
1. M-14...Because it's a GREAT automatic battle weapon that doesn't "jam", and can shoot the eye out of a gnat at 100 yards. Also, with its' wood stock, if it runs out of ammo, it can be used as a club.

2. Ruger M77...Because it has a GREAT Mauser '98-type action that's smooth, strong, and totally reliable.

3. Winchester model 70...Just because it's a Winchester.:).
 
For what its worth, the recent Navy (SEAL) contract for 300 "semi-auto sniper systems" went to Knights Armament for the Stoner designed SR-25, which will bear the Navy designation as the Mk 11 Mod 0. Aside from sharing appearance, the SR-25 differs in many ways with some 40% of the parts which are not compatible with the AR-15/AR-10 systems. Stoner was said to address the deficiencies in the AR-15 platform when he designed the SR-25.

As you can imagine, they Navy was well aware of the faults of the AR-15/M16/M4 gas system, which is said to have been largely corrected in the Stoner's SR-25 design--though technically don't ask me how. But, it says something that the Navy could very well have picked an M-14/M1A derivative system, an HK PSG-1 system, or any other "system" out there, but didn't.

And one can't make the argument that this was a "low bidder" or "bureaucratic"-influenced decision--as the contract was only for 300 rifles for one of the most elite and well-funded units in our military.

Also, FWIW, the US Army Rangers are said to now be piggybacking onto the Navy's Mk 11 Mod 0 purchase.
 
Three magazine fed semi autos?

1.) Springfield M1A, and loaded if possible. These are proven battle rifles, and very accurate. I like the action, and just the feel of the rifle is great. They are a little pricy, but would be my number one choice for a .308 battle rifle.

An Armalite or FN FAL(DSA) would be a good choice also.

2.) Browning BAR MKII .308. I am a Browning man. These have a very smooth and reliable action, beautiful, and light.

3.) Remington 7400 .308. These are priced right, reliable locking bolt semi auto action(unlike the 742), light enough to pack all day, and I believe you can still get the 10 round steel mags for these.

Good luck finding your new rifle.
 
HK91 and it's relatives. Simply one of the most reliable semi-auto (or select fire) actions on the market.

I have been staying away from the Remington autoloaders for years. They were comfortable to carry and accurate, but they were ackward to disassemble, and the plastic plate covering the bolt was a constant headache. Four of us use to have these guns, and I can't recall a single time when all four guns were serviceable. There was alway at least one in the shop getting that #### plastic plate replaced.

n2s
 
Let's see....

Best: M14/M1A
Best value: FAL
Most 'gadgety': Armalite AR-10
Least expensive, without getting 'cheap': CETME

Personally, I am waiting until Fall, 2004, to see what happens with the 1994 Assault Weapons Ban, since it expires at that time. If it looks like it will not be replaced, there is no reason to pay more for a 'pre-ban' rifle. So I will be investing most of my 'gun money' in my M17S, and putting some away each year until then, to get an M1A with all the trimmings.

To answer a few questions:

"Functionally, what differentiates them?

What makes one a M1A and the other a FAL?"

The methods of operation are quite different - I don't think the details are really that important, here. Suffice it to say that the M14/M1A has an edge-up in reliability and accuracy, but is also quite a bit more expensive, both in initial price, and in purchase of magazines and such.

"What are the functional issues, pistol grip versus rifle stock?"

I think this is like the 'revolver vs. auto' debate - everyone has a preferrence, and is usually convinced that his is the best way. Generally, it seems to me that competition shooters prefer pistol grips, or semi-pistol grip (imagine a pistol-grip shotgun, with a buttstock attached low on the back of the grip, or pick up a copy of the August issue of American Rifleman, which has one on the cover, as well as a series of articles on the M14 and M1A)

"Can you get a M1A with a pistol grip?"

Stock, no. But aftermarket stocks in a variety of forms are available. Additionally, a variant of the M14 was produced, called the M14A1. Its stock had a pistol grip, as well as a folding forward grip for the off hand. These stocks are occasionally available. Of course, they are expensive, as with all other things related to the M14.

So, FAL is probably your best bet, for a good value. The M1A is much more expensive, but is arguably the most accurate 7.62mm service rifle ever fielded.

Speaking of caliber.... remember that .308Win and 7.62NATO are not the same - a .308Win chamber can safely fire all 7.62NATO ammunition (assuming the firearm, itself, can take the mil-spec pressure), but a 7.62NATO chamber may not be able to safely fire all .308Win ammunition. From what I recall, if you wish to use .308Win ammunition in a 7.62NATO rifle, you need to get a .308Win headspace gauge, and make sure the headspace is lower than 1.636-1.638

--JB
 
The 'good' choices are narrow, and most have presented here...

The prime determinant is going to be your intended usage...

If you're primarily going prone via a scoped and bipoded position, the M1A is hard to beat with the right ammo.

But, if you intend to carry on hikes, in the field, or during 'bug out', I'd go with something like the FAL bush by SA/DSA, or the H&K 91/SA SAR-3/CETME...

Pistol grips are purely subjective...they look cool, they feel right, but they don't do diddly to improve accuracy.

A 'bush' M1A or FAL clone would be my first choices. Should you find yourself in the position where you 'just can't decide'...then buy both. :D

Mel
 
My choice would be M14/M1A. I own a Winchester M14 from 1961. A lovely rifle.
I also own a Galil ARM in 7.62. A "fun" gun but not very accuate. I don't like rifles with which the rear sights come off with the receiver cover - not an issue with the M14/M1A unlike the Galil or L1A1.
 
If money were no object, either the H&K PSG1 or Springfield M25.
Cost being a factor, M1A Scout Squad Rifle or M1A Loaded Standard.
A super low cost alternative is the SAIGA .308 Win. It's Russian made on an AK action. Accuracy certainly won't be MOA, but for about $400, who cares? They only take 10 round mags AFAIK, and have an integral side mount scope rail. I looked long and hard at one of the carbine versions (very handy) at last months gun show, but decided to wait until I read a little more on them.
 
Did a little more checking on the Saiga's and they are limited to an 8 round magazine. There is a conversion to allow the use of M14 magazines.
 
I'm with Melvin. (I think I have typed that before.... scary)

I could list you three rifles easily enough, but I'd have to know what they were going to have to do for me.

If you were looking to purchase one .308 Win semi-automatic, magazine fed rifle, with an eye for function and performance without passing the point of diminishing returns, what rifle would that be?
Click to expand...

..."with an eye for function and performance...." leaves me wondering what I have to perform, and function is going to follow the job at hand. For me at least, the intended usage is the key.
 
What do you want to do with the rifle? Do you have a budget in mind? Do want evil nasty features like a Bayonet Lug or Flash Hider? Why does it need to be magazine fed?

A pre-ban M1A can wear a pistol grip stock but, those are collectors items and very hard to find. In the late 80's the stocks alone cost around $325. I believe it was called an "E-2" stock. This was a part of the M1A program to get it in a usuable full-auto form.

I have always had a sweet spot for M-1 Garands so, the choice to get an M1A SuperMatch was an easy one. It has an improved gas system over the M-1 but, a NM M-1 is nothing to be ashamed of at the target range. A National Match M-1 upgrade from Springfield Armory was ~$800 last time I checked include a new stock and all the expected goodies. A SuperMatch is nearly twice that.

A Belgian FAL is a thing of beauty. It is also a well proven battle rifle that stands with the best of them. As a soldier I would opt for the FAL (the Argentine rifles are very good as well). The secondary FAL market seems a little soft these days so, if you have the money, a clean used Belgian FAL is a good way to go.

In a post ban FAL, the DSA's are the way to go unless you are looking at a custom build up by someone like Arizona Response or one of the others professional shops that do this kind of work.

If money is no object, then rifles like the SIG AMT and H&K PSG-1 (bunker/fixed position rifle) may be options. Why don't SIG rifles get mentioned more...

A final word on the Stoner rifles, both .308 and .223 flavors. These are they best, bar none, "AR-15" style rifles I have seen. Period.
 
"A pre-ban M1A can wear a pistol grip stock but, those are collectors items and very hard to find."

An M1A does not need to be pre-ban, to have a pistol grip stock, as long as it does not have any of the other 'evil' features (bayonet lug, flash suppressor, folding stock, grenade launcher).

The 'E-2' stocks are quite expensive, however there are aftermarket pistol grip stocks available from several companies.

--JB
 
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