440 core with 316 cable jacket?

G

gregariousgavin

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Feb 19, 2016
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Im a sailor and we are getting ready to do our first long haul race. Very excited. I wanted to make the crew some cable knives made from the braided cables that are being changed out. Making knives our of the boat, you see. I just learned that 316 stainless makes a lousy knife. So now I'm trying to figure out how to keep the soul of the project and still get some performance out of it. So...

Can I forge and hammer out the cable and wrap it around some better stock so it will be a decent knife but still have that etched cable knife look? Will the two types of metal get along alright? I'm new to metal. If there is a better core, let me know.

Thank you in advance for the advice!
 
I haven't seen anything but stainless cables on sail boats for a long time. I have never heard of stainless cable being welded up ... so my answer is NO.
 
Stainless/carbon steel damascus never made much sense to me .However stainless/stainless is possible both forged from scratch [ Devin Thomas ] or Damasteel [powdered metal.] The blade blanks can be bought but as a beginner DYI project definately NO !!!
 
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I've welded stainless cable with powder. It doesn't have that cracked look that carbon does though. Looks pretty ugly on the sides, but the ends look nice. I plan to make some more for fittings soon, re-oriented.

This isn't remotely a beginner project. I'd place it on the HIGHLY advanced column.
 
javand, any pictures of what the ss cable looked like in the end?

I should also mention that I'm not doing this on my own. I have a very experienced metal worker that I am partnering with this on. He has made a career of doing metal sculptures and I see a lot of combination metals in his work. I just want to have a lot of information for when we start. He's made many knives before but basic. His other work is advanced so I'm sure we can make it happen.
 
The fact that you feel a metal sculptor and welder is the same as making very complex damascus in a canister says - NO.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
The fact that you feel a metal sculptor and welder is the same as making very complex damascus in a canister says - NO.
Click to expand...

Yeah, what Stacy said. No matter what combo of metals your sculptor friend works with, he's not forge welding stainless. This requires specialized equipment, and direct experience. There are only a small handful of people in the world that have the experience and equipment necessary to make pure stainless damascus. In fact, I just had a lengthy conversation with a local master welder about how it's done, and he was baffled. Anybody can tack or braze stuff together, but creating cohesive complete foundational joining of multiple alloys of steel (especially stainless) is a completely different thing. No offense.

I'll will take a photo though if I can find a piece in my trash pile, so that you'll know how much of a waste of time it would be to try, even if you did succeed.
 
Here's a photo of one of the bars I made. Not sure what kind of stainless cable it is (300 series of some type, as it was non-magnetic), dark metal is 1084. You would have to use some kind of powdered filler metal around the cable to fill the voids. Stainless won't squish all together into gaps like carbon will, it barely wants to stick even under optimal conditions. As you can see, on the first attempt, I still had some blow-out of the cable even though the powder is evenly welded all around it. I alleviated most of this in the second attempt, but it looks like crap regardless.


scable.jpg
 
And that is the photo I have been searching the internet for.

Conclusions: People debate on if it can be done, people have done it, there are a few techniques but using 316 cable just doesn't look as nice as I expected. Abandon project. Still want to make a san mai. Might get some improved plow steel cable.
 
Highly recommend using carbon cable, it looks nice and is a much more reasonable project. Make billets of cable damascus first, then sandwich them on a core of carbon steel of your choice, 1084 being a great option.
 
Carbon steel cable damascus gets its pattern from a certain amount of decarb in the outer parts of the wire. 316 has almost no carbon. If done correctly, stainless cable with a martensitic stainless core, would look like plain 316 w/440 core.

Hoss
 
Hey gregariousgavin,
As an ex-sailor and boat builder, might I suggest you make a knife that will be useful rather than unique. Make it out of Bohler/Udeholm M390 stainless. It has enough chrome that is will be as close to rust free as possible and enough vanadium that it will cut all the hi-tech line you want and still maintain an edge.

Tim
 
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