4v

bodog

bodog

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Nathan, any idea when you might have some 4V knives for sale and what type of knives they may be?
 
bodog said:
Nathan, any idea when you might have some 4V knives for sale and what type of knives they may be?
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I have a sheet coming in next week which we'll be using in some upcoming development work. We're experimenting with it and will hopefully have something pretty good by the end of the year. I'll start with the EDC because that's a good form factor for R&D but my end goal with it is a racing chopper.

4V will never have the toughness potential of a lath martensite like 3V, but it has some pretty cool properties for folks interested in edge retention and thin geometry, if we can dial in the edge stability. That large carbide volume is a double edge sword. It improves abrasion resistance and compressive yield strength and may generate more eta carbide (which can augment strength like aggregate in concrete) but it also has lower ductility and impact resistance. If we can get a good balance of properties with it we will probably offer it on various projects where gross toughness isn't a primary driver.
 
What about something like your D2 skinner, but in 4V Nathan? Any possibility of seeing something like that in the future?
 
hmmm...sounds bushcrafty
 
Nathan the Machinist said:
I have a sheet coming in next week which we'll be using in some upcoming development work. We're experimenting with it and will hopefully have something pretty good by the end of the year. I'll start with the EDC because that's a good form factor for R&D but my end goal with it is a racing chopper.

4V will never have the toughness potential of a lath martensite like 3V, but it has some pretty cool properties for folks interested in edge retention and thin geometry, if we can dial in the edge stability. That large carbide volume is a double edge sword. It improves abrasion resistance and compressive yield strength and may generate more eta carbide (which can augment strength like aggregate in concrete) but it also has lower ductility and impact resistance. If we can get a good balance of properties with it we will probably offer it on various projects where gross toughness isn't a primary driver.
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Cool. The ZT 0180 with Vanadis 4E at 61-62 RC can take a pretty massive beating. Hopefully if you're going to focus on wear resistance over gross toughness in something more of an EDC you're able to get them at around 64.

For whatever it's worth the normal industry heat treatment of 4V at 62 leaves something to be desired. Don't know what ZT did. I compared the ZT with V4E to a small batch maker's 4V and the 4V kind of sucked both with raw wear resistance and fracturing at the edge. Maybe the guy overcooked it, who knows.
 
Hard Knocks said:
What about something like your D2 skinner, but in 4V Nathan? Any possibility of seeing something like that in the future?
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Possibly. But D2 will probably run circles around it in a skinner.
 
Nathan the Machinist said:
Possibly. But D2 will probably run circles around it in a skinner.
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Thank you :thumbup: I'm wanting to try some V4E or 4V but am still trying to get my legs under me as to which kind of blade. I'm a little worried about D2 taking a chip if I have to split joints breaking an animal down, but it sounds great for clean cuts.

Also, I'm sorry if my ignorance of the steel makes any of those questions seem silly, but I appreciate the answers no end Nate. Thanks again.
 
Hard Knocks said:
I'm a little worried about D2 taking a chip if I have to split joints breaking an animal down, but it sounds great for clean cuts.

.
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Dozier has been using D2 for a long time, in knives intended for hunting/skinning/game processing. Seems to work well for him, with his HT protocol.
 
I've seen a lot of the cheap knock-off knives using D2 (supposedly) and it had kinda lowered my opinion on it, plus I think a lot of makers and such favor others (like A2 and O1) over it (at least it seems that way to me). But with Nathan's talking about it and providing a better understanding of perhaps where it would fall in a potential knife line up its got me interested for sure. I know heat treat is critical for these things. I always did like that it was semi-stainless as well
 
resinguy said:
Dozier has been using D2 for a long time, in knives intended for hunting/skinning/game processing. Seems to work well for him, with his HT protocol.
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AmericanAsApple3.14 said:
I've seen a lot of the cheap knock-off knives using D2 (supposedly) and it had kinda lowered my opinion on it, plus I think a lot of makers and such favor others (like A2 and O1) over it (at least it seems that way to me). But with Nathan's talking about it and providing a better understanding of perhaps where it would fall in a potential knife line up its got me interested for sure. I know heat treat is critical for these things. I always did like that it was semi-stainless as well
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I'm probably being too paranoid, and I think it's because I've seen the same thing as in AAAPI's bolded section above. I did use a buddy's D2 blade, that one seemed to hold up good. Most likely I need to get my hands on some good D2. I'm sure not going to second-guess Nathan. If he builds skinners in D2, I'll be after one :thumbup:
 
I only use one of my knives (a Benchmade MDP, Modified Drop Point in D2) exclusively when skinning/processing deer. Always impressed on how its performed in that roll and could usually process a couple before needing a touch up.
 
I sent Nate a prototype bushcrafty/hunting type knife I had made that would be complimented perfectly by this steel option, imo

Charles Vestal made the prototype for me;
 
Lorien said:
I sent Nate a prototype bushcrafty/hunting type knife I had made that would be complimented perfectly by this steel option, imo

Charles Vestal made the prototype for me;
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Seems reminiscent of the handle on the EDC. Interesting. I'm not sure what the blade is made of, but I like the profile overall. Seems a little recurve, is that intentional for cutting efficiency or was it a byproduct of a zero grind on a prototype or something? I wonder how it would handle. Personally I prefer my belly a little more out to the tip, but still think this one is pretty usable.

What niche do you see it filling? Just curious as the 4V being not really corrosion resistant, in our climate is the opposite way I prefer to go with a steel for a bushcrafty/outdoors knife.

I can see you like your marbled CF though. Common in many of your knives!
 
this one is S35VN, hollow ground, but I'd like it stouter via flat grind. This 4V stuff looks like it will take and hold a super fine edge, which is great for bushcrafty, woodworky things, and also for fleshing/skinning type stuff I'd imagine. Corrosion resistance is not a big deal for a knife like this, compared to the attributes mentioned. Might be a great knife for your standard outdoorsy person.

the handle is slim, and the blade is around 4". Bigger than the edc, smaller than the fk.

the recurve you're seeing isn't, the edge is straight, up til the belly. In use, carving sticks and such, I don't know if more belly would be an advantage, but that's a speculation. Lots of leverage and control with this pattern

I love me some Diskin carbon fiber! The bolster and pins are nickel aluminum bronze, not something you see much of
 
Lorien said:
this one is S35VN, hollow ground, but I'd like it stouter via flat grind. This 4V stuff looks like it will take and hold a super fine edge, which is great for bushcrafty, woodworky things, and also for fleshing/skinning type stuff I'd imagine. Corrosion resistance is not a big deal for a knife like this, compared to the attributes mentioned. Might be a great knife for your standard outdoorsy person.

the handle is slim, and the blade is around 4". Bigger than the edc, smaller than the fk.

the recurve you're seeing isn't, the edge is straight, up til the belly. In use, carving sticks and such, I don't know if more belly would be an advantage, but that's a speculation. Lots of leverage and control with this pattern

I love me some Diskin carbon fiber! The bolster and pins are nickel aluminum bronze, not something you see much of
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Well, for my uses, a hollow is well suited to a skinner/caper but not so much for a bushcrafter with batoning and carving etc. That is just my opinion of course. I'm sure people use them just fine all the time.

For me corrosion resistance is always a big deal, in particular as were coastal, and almost always even more coastal where you get into salty air, and salty wood which I am sure you have some of there. My wife's family is in Florida for the most part, so when we go down there, again same story. I pretty much stick to a SS until I found D3V.

But at the beach you get into sand and little rocks etc so it's always a compromise.

For a drier climate, hands down I agree. There is a % of the community who sticks to SS though.

Understood on the recurve. Just lighting or something I bet.

And on the nickel aluminum bronze, did it oxidize for you at all? Of the of the properties I always loved about it, is the self-healing film some conditions allow which IMO is pretty cool. Rare to see it in use outside the marine industry from my experience. You always have these cool little knives that pop out of the wood work. Very cool.
 
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