I agree with everyone who advocated the 7inch blade over the five in all their reasons, but I have one more: if by some stroke of bad luck you break the tip of your 7inch blade (I doubt it will happen to the RAT) you probably still have at least 5inches (unless its REALLY bad). Do the same with a 5inch blade and you got the same size blade as a large folder or even a SAK.
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5" or 7" fixed blade?
- Thread starter MaineEdge
- Start date
David E. - its not a pointless argument, infact it was not an argument at all, but a question. I have never owned a large knife that would efficiently chop wood. But I jfeel walking around on slippery uneven ground with a 10" razor sharp blade could be a little more dangerous than a duller hatchet with only a 3-5" blade. It was a question, not an argument, but you can argue if you would like.
Codger_64
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...Some specific, real life chores that a 7" blade will out perform the 5" blade are ANY chores that involve chopping, prying, reach etc. Limbing, clearing, chopping firewood/kindling, making stakes etc... You can just start to get some good blade speed and snap with a 7" blade (MUCH more so when you get past 7), its just not there with most 5" blades.
I don't use a knife to chop. I use a chopping tool like a hatchet or axe.
I don't use a knife to pry. I use a prying tool. If I did run upon a circumstance that required me to pry with my knife, would the extra 2" of leverage make a substantial difference?
My knife with a shorter blade reqires me to be 2" closer to my work?
If I go into the woods to limb, clear, chop firewood and kindling, you betcha I'm going to carry an axe, saw, hatchet etc., not a sheath knife. Stakes? I can whittle a stake with a five inch blade just fine.
I don't equate larger knife size with performance and versitility for the chores I use a knife for. As stated, I use other tools for the chores people seem to want to push a knife to accomplish.
But then, each to his own. I find the five inch blade to be adequate. Others like SAKs, ten, twelve, heck swords and bayonets. Fine.
Codger
I don't use a knife to chop. I use a chopping tool like a hatchet or axe.
I don't use a knife to pry. I use a prying tool. If I did run upon a circumstance that required me to pry with my knife, would the extra 2" of leverage make a substantial difference?
My knife with a shorter blade reqires me to be 2" closer to my work?
If I go into the woods to limb, clear, chop firewood and kindling, you betcha I'm going to carry an axe, saw, hatchet etc., not a sheath knife. Stakes? I can whittle a stake with a five inch blade just fine.
I don't equate larger knife size with performance and versitility for the chores I use a knife for. As stated, I use other tools for the chores people seem to want to push a knife to accomplish.
But then, each to his own. I find the five inch blade to be adequate. Others like SAKs, ten, twelve, heck swords and bayonets. Fine.
Codger
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if your in the bush knife or not there is a chance of getting hurt...That's part of what keeps people like us going back and other people away...I'd have to agree that chopping is best with an axe...where as skinning small game or filleting a trout other things that might need to be done in a survival sit are more suited towards a 4-5 inch blade than a 7 inch one and a good 4-5 inch blade (if it's woth the steel its made from) should take kindly to battoning if some chopping is needed
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Is everyone really concerned about "sheeple"?
Maybe it's much different in Canada, but it has never really concerned me, let alone become the deciding factor on which style of blade I carry.
Anyway, that said, I think Codger made a good point, but if I were packing a BOB or a kit for the truck, I would be inclined to put in a larger blade, but
for hiking uses I tend to have an axe or machete anyway, and I prefer the control I have with a smaller blade, it just feels better to whittle with a blade 5 inches or under. But I know it feels better to chop with a larger blade.
It just depends on what tasks you are going to be doing.
The largest blade I have is a cold steel bushman, and I intend to cut that down a bit. The larger knives I have had have tended to see a bit of use then just got given away to friends who had a fancy for them.
Maybe it's much different in Canada, but it has never really concerned me, let alone become the deciding factor on which style of blade I carry.
Anyway, that said, I think Codger made a good point, but if I were packing a BOB or a kit for the truck, I would be inclined to put in a larger blade, but
for hiking uses I tend to have an axe or machete anyway, and I prefer the control I have with a smaller blade, it just feels better to whittle with a blade 5 inches or under. But I know it feels better to chop with a larger blade.
It just depends on what tasks you are going to be doing.
The largest blade I have is a cold steel bushman, and I intend to cut that down a bit. The larger knives I have had have tended to see a bit of use then just got given away to friends who had a fancy for them.
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You were the one that said:
If you now want to change that to "walking on slippery uneven ground" that's fine by me.
Either tool, a large knife or a hatchet, can injure or kill the user if they are stupid, unsafe, panic, or are a klutz.
Weight-wise, it doesn't make much sense to carry a medium knife AND a hatchet when a larger knife, by itself, could fulfill both roles.
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I suppose if you could pack all of that in your vehicle, then it would be a better way to go.
But if you DID have to carry it on you..........I bet that 'prying tool', ax and probably hatchet would get left behind pretty quick.
A GOOD knife could do all of those things easily. A poor knife could not.
Keyword for a good large knife: VERSATILITY
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MaineEdge......welcome.....nice to see more Mainers on here. I'm Downeast.
To answer your question really depends on your own preferences. Are you a multiple tool guy or a one tool to do everything guy? Me, I'm a hatchet man myself, most likely because my father and grandfather were both fond of hatchets. For me the size of the knife hasn't become a serrious issue because I always have a hatchet when I am in the woods. Having said that....
my current field knife of choice is the Becker 7. I intend to pick up a Ranger 9 in the future as well as a Kuk, prehaps that will change my opinion.
Good luck.
To answer your question really depends on your own preferences. Are you a multiple tool guy or a one tool to do everything guy? Me, I'm a hatchet man myself, most likely because my father and grandfather were both fond of hatchets. For me the size of the knife hasn't become a serrious issue because I always have a hatchet when I am in the woods. Having said that....
my current field knife of choice is the Becker 7. I intend to pick up a Ranger 9 in the future as well as a Kuk, prehaps that will change my opinion.Good luck.
For what its worth, If im taking an axe, I wont take my BK7, itll be my buck 192. But, when I'm not taking an axe, Ill have my BK7 and my vic fireman. Also in an addition to when and where ever i'm going, ill also have my leatherman wave with me, mainly for the pliers,file and fully serrated blade.
Codger_64
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These practices are simply not a part of my normal outing activities. I never need to chop firewood. And what is there that has to be pryed in the woods? Chopping wood and these other activities are things I do here on my farm. When I am practicing woodcraft, I make small fires using deadfall. Slender cane or saplings make shelters. Logs are not required. I don't build cabins out there. A good knife is one that fills the individual's needs, not one that fills someone else's. Do you not think that after such a lengthy time with my knife in the woods and jungles, I don't know best what suits me in each situation?
Codger
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I have no way of knowing how deep or how long you go into the woods, much less under what conditions. For all I know, you never lose sight of your car. Then again, maybe you taught Rambo a thing or two!
Chop firewood? Not with my knife, but I could reasonably expect to chop and delimb a few branches for a shelter in a survival situation.
You might need to use a knife to pry open logs for grubs, etc.
A longer knife could be used to baton thicker logs to get to the dry core when it's been raining for days.
Sure, it's a personal choice, no disputing that. But no matter WHAT knife you choose, get a GOOD one. Something that'll hold up under abuse when you have to use and abuse your knife in ways you'd never thought necessary. If it breaks, you could die.
Or, if it's between a longer knife in camp or in the car, or a shorter one with you, then take the shorter one with you.
What is your knife choice, Codger ?
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the way I see it, If I dont want an axe with me, its gonna be a bigger' knife that comes along. Plus its a joy when not in a survival situation to have some knives to play with
When im in the woods, Many times im in kinda thick brush, And its nice having the BK7 out, "waiding" through the light brush, One thing I dont like doing if cutting small twigs with an axe while moving, too much weight swingin' around.
When im in the woods, Many times im in kinda thick brush, And its nice having the BK7 out, "waiding" through the light brush, One thing I dont like doing if cutting small twigs with an axe while moving, too much weight swingin' around.
Fonly, I agree with that. :thumbup: If you live somewhere where you don't enoucnter brush and thickets, you may have not see the need for a larger blade, or even a machete.
We get into this kind of discussion a lot. Everyone has their preferences, and that is good, we all know what works for us, and what we like.
Regional Differences & Personal Preferences:
I've pointed to this before. I do notice an East-West and North-South Bias when it comes to gear. We know everyone has personal preferences, and that's because we are indiduals. Probably more so individualistic than your basic sheeple out there. We know what we like and dislike and will say it.
The regional differences make perfect sense, as each one of us is faced with varying terrain and foliage. I find that my ideas here in the Mid-Atlantic region, match more closely to people to like Runningboar in the Carolina's and Coldwood in the Adirondacks. Probably because we experience similar levels of forestation.
On the fire topic someone mentioned, in another thread, in the SW US you just stare at some dried foliage and it wants to ignite. made me laugh! I had been looking for some dry tinder and kindling and had to bring some damp stuff inside to dry it. So, even tinder material is different based on region.
So, why wouldn't equipment likes and dislikes also vary by region?
I actually think they do.
I've learned more about staying warm from reading the posts by our friends in Canada. More about making fire in the cold and damp from those in the Pac NW.
The regional differences is what we share, mostly, and what keeps us all from spouting the same line like robots, time after time.
When folks pop in, from time to time and ask "What knife" , we typically ask for what purpose. Perhaps, also, it would help asking "what region".
I would be hard pressed to be too specific about 'what knife' may be best to use in the Sonoran Desert.
We get into this kind of discussion a lot. Everyone has their preferences, and that is good, we all know what works for us, and what we like.
Regional Differences & Personal Preferences:
I've pointed to this before. I do notice an East-West and North-South Bias when it comes to gear. We know everyone has personal preferences, and that's because we are indiduals. Probably more so individualistic than your basic sheeple out there. We know what we like and dislike and will say it.
The regional differences make perfect sense, as each one of us is faced with varying terrain and foliage. I find that my ideas here in the Mid-Atlantic region, match more closely to people to like Runningboar in the Carolina's and Coldwood in the Adirondacks. Probably because we experience similar levels of forestation.
On the fire topic someone mentioned, in another thread, in the SW US you just stare at some dried foliage and it wants to ignite. made me laugh! I had been looking for some dry tinder and kindling and had to bring some damp stuff inside to dry it. So, even tinder material is different based on region.
So, why wouldn't equipment likes and dislikes also vary by region?
I actually think they do.
I've learned more about staying warm from reading the posts by our friends in Canada. More about making fire in the cold and damp from those in the Pac NW.
The regional differences is what we share, mostly, and what keeps us all from spouting the same line like robots, time after time.
When folks pop in, from time to time and ask "What knife" , we typically ask for what purpose. Perhaps, also, it would help asking "what region".
I would be hard pressed to be too specific about 'what knife' may be best to use in the Sonoran Desert.
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I do. Just not a 5" or even 7" one
Like I said in my first reply, I go smaller before I'd go bigger. My 4 1/2" drop point serves me quite well, but when I buy another similar knife, it will be more like 3 or 3 1/2, not 5". For kitchen/camp/removing a granny knot/whatever, I find I don't really need more.
On those occasions when I do want more steel, 5 or 7" just isn't enough. There's just no way you're going to get a great deal of leverage out of that, unless it has a crazy reverse-taper grind to pull the balance forward. If you don't like to carry a 9"+ knife or machete, you need a hatchet or hawk.
I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, but I am thoroughly unconvinced of the overall value of a mid-length blade. I would rather deal with the total weight of my 4 1/2" drop, 9 1/2" bowie, AND tomahawk, OR the limitations of any one of the above, than compromise on one blade that doesn't quite measure up to any of them. JMHO, YMMV, etc. etc.
Alright, now we are getting a good discussion going.
Greetings from central Maine Falnovice.
The reason I started asking about a small hatchet and folding pocket knife is because I usually only carry a CRKT folder with me - usually an M16-12 or an M21-12 for in home/city uses, and when there is a chance of being outdoors I carry my M21-14SF with a 3.875" blade which has been customized and beefed up. It is an extremely capable knife, and I feel completely capable to handle most situations when carrying it - and it fits in my pocket! I was planning on upgrading to a RAT 7 or BK7 for deep woods activities and camping - but recently realized that rather than carrying a large, heavy blade that draws a lot of attention, I could carry a lighter small hatchet that would chop wood better than a large knife, and use my CRKT knife for all other chores such as making traps, fuzz sticks, cleaning and preparing fish and food, skinning, etc. These two tools would do more chores - more efficiently for me, than one tool that is capable of doing all, but not well. Plus, if you break your big blade you can no longer do the chopping, and only have a smaller weakened blade.
I am sure plenty of you will disagree, but that was my rational. What I like about the CRKT folder in my pocket is that I can always carry it, and have it on me, which is important. When you bring survival equipment like a big knife and your prepared then you never need it. But the day you decide not to carry your large knife - thats when something will happen.
I agree with GibsonFan - I don't think a 5-7" knife would be big enough for chopping. I still plan on buying a large knife to play around with, and practice skills, but I am pretty sure I will always leave a knife big enough for chopping back in vehicle when hiking in popular parts of the state.
Greetings from central Maine Falnovice.
The reason I started asking about a small hatchet and folding pocket knife is because I usually only carry a CRKT folder with me - usually an M16-12 or an M21-12 for in home/city uses, and when there is a chance of being outdoors I carry my M21-14SF with a 3.875" blade which has been customized and beefed up. It is an extremely capable knife, and I feel completely capable to handle most situations when carrying it - and it fits in my pocket! I was planning on upgrading to a RAT 7 or BK7 for deep woods activities and camping - but recently realized that rather than carrying a large, heavy blade that draws a lot of attention, I could carry a lighter small hatchet that would chop wood better than a large knife, and use my CRKT knife for all other chores such as making traps, fuzz sticks, cleaning and preparing fish and food, skinning, etc. These two tools would do more chores - more efficiently for me, than one tool that is capable of doing all, but not well. Plus, if you break your big blade you can no longer do the chopping, and only have a smaller weakened blade.
I am sure plenty of you will disagree, but that was my rational. What I like about the CRKT folder in my pocket is that I can always carry it, and have it on me, which is important. When you bring survival equipment like a big knife and your prepared then you never need it. But the day you decide not to carry your large knife - thats when something will happen.
I agree with GibsonFan - I don't think a 5-7" knife would be big enough for chopping. I still plan on buying a large knife to play around with, and practice skills, but I am pretty sure I will always leave a knife big enough for chopping back in vehicle when hiking in popular parts of the state.
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Where does everyone hike or camp that you run into soooooo many people? And as been said already, who cares what the sheeple think? I understand some silly state laws might have to be followed (or ignored) but dang ! I'm sure not going to leave essential equipment at home or in the vehicle for fear of upsetting some namby pamby grass-eater.
And what would you have if you broke a smaller knife? Seems like breaking a large knife would put you where you're starting at w/ a small knife.....
If I had to make ONE point in all of this, it would be to buy QUALITY. It would take a nuclear explosion to break a Busse or Swamprat, and even then I'm not so sure.
I'm aware of only a handful of those that have broken. One of them was due to being shot - twice - with a 30-30. The first shot didn't do it! Another was due to a guy pounding the crap out of it with a pipewrench for 8 hours practicing his batoning 'skills.'
On the other hand, I've seen a picture of a Cold Steel Recon Scout that broke at the handle/blade junction. A Ka-bar bent 90 degrees.
Buy a knife you know you can't break if you're going to risk your life with it.
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I CA, it is a felony to have your sheath knife concealed (i.e. in a pack) The PC Sheeple out here give you looks of fear and would likely report you to the authorities when you wear a big knife (like my BK7) on your belt. If you are hiking out in the Mojave or Sonoran desert you frequently run into others doing the same thing, especially if you use established trails (it would be dangerous to off-trail, back-country in the desert.) This is why I carry a 110 folder and a multi-tool, which should be adequate for most survival situations. But, I would prefer to carry a fixed blade if I could. In CA it is more a matter of surviving sheeple than the hostility of the desert.