5160 and hammon

B

bartblade

Joined
Nov 4, 2002
Messages
344
what would be the best way to get a hammon in 5160 with a coal forge and tranny fluid as the quench and fire place cement as the clay?

how thick should i lay it on and do i need to let it dry first?

how thick should the ashy lines be?
 
Bartblade,
First I'd say get rid of the trany fluid. Get some Brownell's Tough Quench.
It's a slower quench, and better for 5160.
Also; Before commercial quenchants were very available, boiled Linseed
was used alot for oil hardening steels. It also works well.

A simple quench line can be produced by heating only the edge to just above
decalescence. You can judge by the dark line that will show between
dark red, and light red as the blade heats. On 5160, the decalescence line will show you where the quench line will be.
 
ooops, Russ was posting as I typed. Sorry for duplicate info.

Bart, hamon are best formed in shallow hardening steels with a temp in the lower end of the range. That means that a chromium-bearing steel is not the best bet. That said:

Try and get just the edge portion up to non-magnetic and edge quench. that is what works with O-1. You won't really be able to get an "active" hamon but you may be able to get a line. Clay may have some slight effect, but the metallurgy will want to override most of your efforts.
 
do you think i could get a hammon if i tempered the spine of the blade in the forge and watched the colors run in the steel like a differential temper or is that heat treat lol
 
Re-tempering the spine still leaves it as tempered martensite, bart. The hamon is formed by different crystal structures. It is a quenching phenomenon and unachievable by tempering.

Sorry I don't have better news for you. :o

Your best bet is to heat the edge with a oxy/acetylene torch. Not having that, you are going to have to try and heat just the edge in the forge. You may be able to achieve this by doing the "pipe thing", not building the coal dome over the top of the pipe, and keeping the blade in edge down. it will be a PITA, but I have seen people show light hamon in 5160 before.
 
thanks for the tips ill try on my next 1

by the way dose most 5160 etch that black like the 1 i showed the other day?
 
It has a lot of manganese, so it will get black. Dilute your etchant with distilled water and reduce the time. Steel wool or fine sand between trips in the juice. Creep up on the shade you desire.
 
I assume you mean 3:1 water:ferric chloride. I use 5:1 and can get coloration on damascus (color, not depth) in about 30 seconds or less.

How long are you leaving it in?
 
A real hamon is the border between the fine pearlite spine and the martensite edge. The junction is called troosite, which is the white hamon line. In a shallow hardening steel ,like 1095 , it shows very bright. In an alloy steel, like 5160, the alloy elements prevent the line from forming by slowing down the hardening. Edge quenching is about the only thing that will get a "hamon" in 5160. Next time try 1080 or 1095.
Stacy
 
Hey Fitzo!
What level of surface treatment are you doing between applications of etchant? I've heard anything from rubbing with Simichrome or Flitz, to 0000 fine steel wool, to 2000 grit sandpaper. I'd love to hear you process in full. Would you prefer if I pose this question in another thread (as this could be construed as off-topic... considering you wouldn't attempt a hamon on an alloy steel like 5160, I guess!)?
 
I use 000-0000 steel wool or 1200 SiC paper between each etch and at the end, Matt, under running water. I should say, this is for damascus. I don't do hamon because my forged mono-steel knives have all been O-1, full quenched, and torched backs if desired. .
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top