5160 expert advice?

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Jan 5, 2013
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I have read on a few websites that there are a few knifemakers who can really get the most out of 5160,does anyone know who they might be?aparantly it is the only steel they work with ect?
Any info would be great thanks
 
As far as I know getting the most from 5160 is just a matter of good control over the temps. & times necessary to heat treat it properly. Some people seem to think I do a pretty good job on it myself.:D
What particular qualities are you looking for?
 
I have spent quite a bit of time learning how to heat treat 5160 and there seems to be a lot of different ways temps ect I'm just wanting to learn how to do it one way that is going to get the best preformace possable..... People say "well play around with it till you find "your" way... I spend a lot of time on my ideas and design and grinding ect I just want to know like the scientific way not the garage hippy dippy way ya no
 
Again, best performance for what task? And with what size blade (length, width, thickness, and overall shape)?

Without some parameters, "best performance" is sort of meaningless.
 
Are you going to be forging it, or grinding it from a bar? What will you be using to heat it for the quench?

Optimal would probably be to use an oven, soak for 10 min. at 1525 F, quench immediately in a medium speed quenching oil. Temper from 375-450 depending on how tough you want the edge, twice for two hours apiece, and then if you want a softer spine, thoroughly heat the spine up past a blue-gray temper, from both sides, with the edge in water. I try to "soak" the blade at the spine tempering heat for a couple of minutes. You can find quidelines for tempering 5160 in books like the SECO-Warwick heat treating guide.

If you forged it before HT, you'll want to normalize it at 1600, 1575, then 1550 after forging. Then, you can sub-critical anneal it three times if you'd like to be able to drill it and grind it easily. That's 1350, air cool to 900 and quench, three times. You may want to add a 1550 normalization after rough grinding.

This is optimal as far as I understand it. I have my own ways, following the temps and theory as best as possible, since I have only a forge for HT just now. I treat 52100 similarly, but with slightly lower temps involved.

As far as I am concerned, and the industry in general I believe, a fully martensite blade with a variable temper, rather than an edge quenched blade with pearlite-ish spine, will perform better for you.

As far as the correct quenching oil, not sure what would be best. Park 50 would probably be overkill, although I've used mine with success on thin 52100 and W2. Perhaps McMaster Carr's 11 second or even 28 second oil would be a good choice. Right now I'm using soybean oil preheated to 130 F for quenching higher alloy steels, works well for me, but not truly ideal.
 
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I worked with 5160 almost exclusively for the first 3years I made knives for a living and echo Salem's advice to you.

- Three normalizing cycles at 1600F, 1525F and 1450F(quench at 1450F and heat to a very dull red a couple times)
- Do all of your shaping and grinding.
- Heat to 1525F, hold for 10min if possible and quench in medium oil(vegetable oil will do if the engineered stuff is not available)

I also recommend a full quench with selective tempering as tempered martensite is stronger than a pearlite mix. In my experience with hard use blades in 5160, I have favoured this method. I pry, baton, dig and smash stuff with my bush knives and want all the energy from my arm transmitted through the knife and into the task at hand, whether it's breaking open a stump to get at those tasty larvae or chipping through the ice for water.

5160 is hypoeutectoid but basic in it's alloy content. It doesn't benefit from deep freeze or cryo. Keep it simple and question the metallurgical validity of overly complex recipes.

....and have fun.
 
I am stock removing now but am hunting for a good anvil,I have a sweet little propane forge...holding temps isn't easy, I achieve non mag then I draw the blade in and out of the forge for five
 
The hard part of working with 5160 is finding high quality 5160 steel. There is some lousy 5160 available and some very high quality 5160 available. The best we have found comes from original John deer Load control shafts. We have tested many to destruction and have yet to find a fault in their steel. They have the horse power in the market to demand a high level of quality control in the steel they purchase and you can take advantage of that at your local John Deer Dealership. After market load control shafts can vary, there for I strongly recommenced genuine John Deer Parts.

Once you have obtained high quality steel you can push 5160 almost as far as 52100.
 
Do not buy 5160H from Southern Tool Steel. Maybe for leaf springs, but not for blades.
 
Don't know if I'd recommend Admiral... their reputation, at least for carbon knife steel, is not what it once was. I've seen small print at their site saying that 5160 in some smaller sizes would be substituted by 9260. As in, if you didn't read that little note, you might be sent 9260 without knowing it. Similar alloy, but not the same thing. So, I tried to get some 9260 from them, as I needed it for a certain sword, only to be told that they no longer stock 9260. So, had I not emailed them for info, I might have bought the smaller "5160", intending to get 9260 as it was listed as being actually what they stocked in that size for 5160. Then, I'd have gotten the wrong thing, too.

Confusing? Yes. My intent is only to convey that they seem to play fast and loose. I've heard their 1095 is kind of horrible as well, at least for knives. YMMV, I've only actually purchased from them once and that worked out OK.
 
I am stock removing now but am hunting for a good anvil,I have a sweet little propane forge...holding temps isn't easy, I achieve non mag then I draw the blade in and out of the forge for five

I have to deal with that same problem. I have a small ferriers forge. How has drawing the blade in and out been working for you? And do you check non mag everytime you pull it out?
 
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