52100 steel??

Heartland_edc said:
Is it like 3V? M4? 5160?
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Zknives describes it as similar to 5160 with better edge holding at the cost of some toughness. To what extent likely depends on how it is hardened.

Spyderco only started using it in folders fairly recently, but iirc it was actually the first steel used for their Mule Team series of fixed blade blanks.
 
Planterz said:
Just because something isn't new and exotic, that doesn't mean it isn't good. Vanilla is the best selling ice cream flavor and pepperoni is the most common pizza topping for a reason. I haven't read into it myself, but I'd guess that the furor over using good ol' 52100 on a modern pocket knife is simply because it's good ol' 52100. It's familiar, well liked, and long proven.

Plus, plenty of people like carbon steels but don't want to mess the carbide-crazy CPM M4, Cruwear, Maximet, etc alloy tool steels that take forever with the right sharpening equipment to maintain.
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Oh for sure. I don't know how wild I am about non-stainless steels for general EDC pocket knives, but my kitchen is full of 1095 and I'm happy as a clam. I was just surprised by the buzz around it as if it were a "new" steel.
 
I have the Spyderco Para and the Military in 52100. Really like it in a folder platform especially these two. I find it has superior edge holding capabilities. When it does start to dull down, stropping on the back of a yellow legal pad gets it right back where I want it. It takes a fair amount of abuse. I am out in the warehouse on a regular basis and do a good(bad)job of hitting box staples and i don't see much/any damage to the blade. I cut a lot of zip ties and plastic banding - it pretty much shrugs it off. I really like how easy it is to get a very sharp edge on it - I have profiled down to 30 degrees and don't spend very much time getting a razor edge on it when its time to resharpen. I find it comparable to Hap40 performance wise.
 
I have a spyderco military and para II in this steel and love it. It will get razor sharp very easy and you can sharpened them on almost anything. I kinda like it that you don't have to use diamond stones on them to sharpen them.
 
zhyla said:
Oh for sure. I don't know how wild I am about non-stainless steels for general EDC pocket knives, but my kitchen is full of 1095 and I'm happy as a clam. I was just surprised by the buzz around it as if it were a "new" steel.
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Certainly not new, but it is rather novel to put such a steel in a modern pocket knife. You just don't see it that often. Benchmade used to offer M2 high speed tool steel in some of their knives. M4 here and there more recently. Other than that, I'm drawing a blank on manufacturers that do such a thing. And if I were being honest with myself, I have a hard time coming to terms with the idea of a carbon steel blade on a modern folder. And I have many knives in carbon steels - Case, GEC, Opinel, Schrade etc. A traditional folder with wood or bone or stag handles looks and feels natural with a patina'd carbon steel blade. But a modern knife, with G-10 or carbon fiber or titanium handles, just feels right with a stainless steel blade. A knife like a PM2 with a tarnished carbon steel blade just seems weird to me. Wrong, even. I can't rightly explain why - just convention and habit I guess. No matter how useful a combination it might be. It just seems weird.
 
Planterz said:
Certainly not new, but it is rather novel to put such a steel in a modern pocket knife. You just don't see it that often. Benchmade used to offer M2 high speed tool steel in some of their knives. M4 here and there more recently. Other than that, I'm drawing a blank on manufacturers that do such a thing. And if I were being honest with myself, I have a hard time coming to terms with the idea of a carbon steel blade on a modern folder. And I have many knives in carbon steels - Case, GEC, Opinel, Schrade etc. A traditional folder with wood or bone or stag handles looks and feels natural with a patina'd carbon steel blade. But a modern knife, with G-10 or carbon fiber or titanium handles, just feels right with a stainless steel blade. A knife like a PM2 with a tarnished carbon steel blade just seems weird to me. Wrong, even. I can't rightly explain why - just convention and habit I guess. No matter how useful a combination it might be. It just seems weird.
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One reason a tarnished PM2 blade seems wrong is the bright clip and screws will shine forever. Whereas with a traditional folder the whole thing ages together.
 
It holds a nice fine edge for a good length of time, and best of all when it comes time to sharpening it's so easy and fast compared to that CPM stuff. With 52100 an ordinary honing knife steel will get you back in the cutting came much of the time.

shqxk said:
Great for fixed but require some care. Not an ideal for folder IMO.
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....point taken. But perspective reminds us that before these "super steels" all of us carried a good old carbon steel, folding, slip joint in our pocket daily, and things managed to get cut, and the knives lasted a good long time, and the sun still came up the next day. Of course as you imply, more options exist today.
 
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One new thing to add to this discussion, is 52100 is very fine grained, which makes it great for push cutting. High carbide steels excell in draw cuts. This is an important distinction in choosing a steel. What kind of cutting do you expect? If you sharpen 52100 with a course finish, you can increase its slicing aggression. Best of both worlds.
 
image.jpg I am not an expert on steel or edges or sharpening but I love my PM 3 in 52100 because it did not take much light use to make it look used. Sometimes I grapple with spending a significant amount of money on a knife and using it to the point where it does not look pristine. With 52100 I don’t have that issue. A little use and it’s no longer “new”. For that reason I love it...and it cuts real good. (Knife pictured is less than 2 months from new)
 
I’ve seen it in a few traditional slipjoints before PJ Tomes back before he retired and John Lloyd uses it often. Good stuff.
Sure wish I kept that PJ Tomes single blade trapper.
 
52100 was a nice treat for the edge junkies amongst us. It's easy to do good things with 52100 edge wise. Sal himself likes 52100 and so understands those of us that asked for that steel. They also have stainless and tool steels available for those that don't get why.

We are very, very fortunate to have a company that is as responsive to the customers as Spyderco is.

Joe
 
52100 is like 1095 but it has 1,5% chromium alloying. Chromium makes industrial heat treatment easier; therefore, bearings are made of 52100. In knife blades 52100 and 1095 are quite equal.
 
salty141 said:
I’ve seen it in a few traditional slipjoints before PJ Tomes back before he retired and John Lloyd uses it often. Good stuff.
Sure wish I kept that PJ Tomes single blade trapper.
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I've got a few knives in 52100 by P.J. Tomes, including a two blade Scagel, and large "Remington" lockback...and one nice ivory handled, single blade trapper by John Lloyd.

Ray Kirk (master smith) also works with 52100 in both folders and fixed blades, and I have a few from him as well.

I had Kerry Hampton make me a stag handled Lanny's Clip in 52100 some years back. I believe it was his first time working with the steel and building that pattern.

One of my favorite steels in both folders and fixed blades. Probably need to pick up a Spyderco using 52100 one of these days.
 
I like the sound of 52100 also, except for the lack of vanadium... as a result, I have been leaning towards 80crv2 over other carbon steels. It's quite interesting that 52100 reports the ability to have such small grain size without vanadium. I'd love to see what 80crv2 would do given that same treatment =)
 
The small grain (in 52100) is contingent upon good heat treat. It can be coaxed a bit with the proper workflow. Done right, it's extremely fine grained.

(Edit for clarification)
 
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dirc said:
I like the sound of 52100 also, except for the lack of vanadium... as a result, I have been leaning towards 80crv2 over other carbon steels. It's quite interesting that 52100 reports the ability to have such small grain size without vanadium. I'd love to see what 80crv2 would do given that same treatment =)
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52100 is great

grain size has more to do with heat treatment then just having Vanadium.
The key is to reduce grain growth by preventing over heating and to Austenize at a lower temperature and soak with good temp contro after normalizing to break up the Carbides and thremal cycles to shrink the grain.

So it's not as simple as just adding a pinch of Vanadium.

52100 offers more strength over 80crv2
 
That's it, you guys pushed me over the edge.

Last night I had a couple of my traditional 52100 folders out and was testing the edge on phone book paper. I had forgotten just how great an edge 52100 takes. It's laser-like.

Just ordered the Spyderco Manix 2 in 52100 (DLC) so I'll have a "modern" folder in this great steel.
(Been wanting to try out a Manix anyway and this was as good an excuse as any.)
 
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