Buck A fair review of the 110 and 420HC

How do you feel about 420HC and the 110?

  • The 110 is deservedly a classic, but has been eclipsed for practical purposes.

  • The 110 is deservedly a classic and hasn't been eclipsed.

  • The 110 is not really a classic, in my opinion.

  • Buck's 420HC was good in its day, but its day has passed. It's a budget steel now.

  • Buck's 420HC is not a budget steel, because the BOS heat treatment has kept it relevant.

  • Buck's 420HC is a budget steel; they're just being cheap by still using it.

Results are only viewable after voting.
Old Biker said:
I disagree with your last statement. I haven't seen any that provided useful content. Other than that you pretty much got it right.
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At the risk of going off topic, I feel obliged to say that not only DBK but also Nick Shabazz, Cedric & Ada, LuvThemKnives, Outdoors55, Project Farm, and a few others I can't recall off the top of my head produce content that I have found very useful.

And even Joe X, who inspired me to get the Strongarm. :-)
 
Another Shepherd said:
At the risk of going off topic, I feel obliged to say that not only DBK but also Nick Shabazz, Cedric & Ada, LuvThemKnives, Outdoors55, Project Farm, and a few others I can't recall off the top of my head produce content that I have found very useful.

And even Joe X, who inspired me to get the Strongarm. :-)
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The Gerber Strongarm (420HC) was a well known and durable tank of a knife before that weirdo ever got ahold of one.
 
Buck 420HC is the best steel ever made. Many will disagree with me, but part of my criteria to be the best includes the ability to sharpen with traditional mediums and not diamonds.

Buck 420HC in a hollow ground blade supports a better edge geometry than the crappy modern steels that need more matrix metal behind the edge to hold carbides in place.

Buck 420HC is tough and not brittle like cheesy, poser powder metallurgy steels.

I’ve sharpened many knives with many steels and blade geometries, and none take as refined an edge as Buck 420HC.

I can process two deer or hogs with a 420HC 110. A couple minutes with a stone, coffee cup, or leather belt, and I’m back in business.

If I had to choose one steel to get me through life on this side of Eternity, it would be Buck 420HC. Hands down, no questions asked.

If all the modern, Vanadium Carbide, and powder metallurgy steels suddenly disappeared from the face of the earth, my life would be unaffected and I would go to sleep that night with a smile on my face.

My two cents. Hey, you did ask. :)
 
kafolarbear said:
Them saying "this knife dulls after one rope cut when other knives of similar price don't" isn't an opinion, it's a fact. Now whether or not you think that's an important metric for your knife is an opinion.
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I didn't watch the video and I'm not gonna waste time with it, what kind of rope are they cutting? 1 inch hawser line that's been sitting on a beach and is impregnated with sand? I can say for certain that buck 420 doesn't dull on one cut of any synthetic arborist grade rope.

Who in real life walks around just hacking up perfectly good rope anyway? I'd be more concerned about how many cuts in an actual cordage that normal people use every day it takes to dull a blade. Marilla and hemp are truly something that's outdated. There's a reason it's not used in critical rigging operations, and they make ratchet straps that are worlds more durable for tying a canoe to your car.
 
I think the magic they are able to squeeze out of a pretty outdated steel is phenomenal. For nearly every walk of life who will buy a $60 110 and actually use it, the steel (due to the heat treat) is perfectly fine.
I have 10s of thousands of dollars worth of knives in my collection. My old man might have 5 knives. At least 4 of them are 110s I've given him over the years for his birthday. He's used and abused about 5 110s over 50 years of being a down in the dirt contractor. They cut and do their job. They sharpen and don't get too loose with age. I think he's misplaced one of them and my younger brother borrowed one of his other ones and left it sitting on the track of the skid steer...that one was toast.

Other than that, they have worked for him. I wish I could be as content as he is with his knife ;)
 
I don't understand why simply being "budget steel" makes it bad.

If budget is to be defined as inexpensive, and the steel has proven itself thru time.....

......To me that's a wise purchase.
I guess you could always get something better for more money, that's true of anything.

You can always spend all kinds of money on a depreciating asset and buy a really nice car.
But is that a wise purchase in the end?

There's something to be said about simply being satisfied with what works.
Or you can minimize it in an attempt to justify your beliefs.
 
Wild Willie said:
I didn't watch the video and I'm not gonna waste time with it, what kind of rope are they cutting? 1 inch hawser line that's been sitting on a beach and is impregnated with sand? I can say for certain that buck 420 doesn't dull on one cut of any synthetic arborist grade rope.

Who in real life walks around just hacking up perfectly good rope anyway? I'd be more concerned about how many cuts in an actual cordage that normal people use every day it takes to dull a blade. Marilla and hemp are truly something that's outdated. There's a reason it's not used in critical rigging operations, and they make ratchet straps that are worlds more durable for tying a canoe to your car.
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That's besides the point, in the video they're comparing a buck knife to all the more modern steels and designs they've tested over the years and they find that even amongst budget knives with budget steels, you can get better performance for your dollar. No one is questioning whether a Buck 110 will cut nor whether it's a knife that has been trusted by millions over the course of decades. The question is if a Buck 110 in design and steel holds up performance wise compared to knives from other brands with more modern designs and modern steels at a similar price point.

If you put aside the nostalgia I'm sure many of us have for classic American knives like a Buck 110 or KABAR USMC you'll probably find that knives have only gotten better over the decades and designs that worked in the past still work, but you can get designs and materials for a similar price point that work even better. We're all hobbyists at the end of the day and most of us I'm sure would be served perfectly well with a $20 gerber and a cheap kitchen knife for most of our cutting needs. And yet part of the fun of this hobby is figuring out how we can take something that should be as simple as a sharpened wedge and make it as high performance, good looking and user friendly as possible. If for you that's a Buck 110, that's awesome. But I see no harm in testing products that have long been considered tried and true and comparing them to modern products to see how they hold up.
 
How is determining what medium is being cut beside the point? Do you spend your days cutting 3/4 inch marilla rope? Or are you more likely to cut a piece of 550 cord? Of course something like k390 is gonna cut more abrasive rope than 420hc. Then, when it finally dulls, how many average people have the capability to sharpen said knife?

What I've failed to see in 13 years of working with rope almost every day is anyone using marilla/sisal/hemp rope for anything. What I do see day to day, work being excluded are smaller diameter cordages being used. What's a more "reality based" test, cutting the things that normal people cut day to day, or some gigantic piece of natural fiber cordage that you have to go out of your way to find?

I'll add that when it comes to cutting anything dirty, making 3 extra cuts before needing a sharpening that takes 4 times as long tends to lose you time in the long run.

Maybe someday one of these chuckleheads will take the time to count the cuts one can make in a piece of paracord. Or actually take a knife out to a real job site and see what happens.

I'm all for carrying a nice knife in a hot new steel, but to look at it from a pragmatic standpoint it's completely unnecessary. I do so because I'm an edged tool enthusiast. Not because it's more practical.

Forgot my quote... K kafolarbear
 
There used to be a guy on this forum who took every opportunity to advocate Buck 110. Where is he? Anyway, for around $30 I think Buck 110 is a good buy, though I sold mine soon after. There are currently far more better knives though a bit more expensive. It is what it is. I don't look down people who still love and worship this knife and I don't blame people who do not want to touch it at all.
 
Wild Willie said:
I didn't watch the video and I'm not gonna waste time with it, what kind of rope are they cutting? 1 inch hawser line that's been sitting on a beach and is impregnated with sand? I can say for certain that buck 420 doesn't dull on one cut of any synthetic arborist grade rope.

Who in real life walks around just hacking up perfectly good rope anyway? I'd be more concerned about how many cuts in an actual cordage that normal people use every day it takes to dull a blade. Marilla and hemp are truly something that's outdated. There's a reason it's not used in critical rigging operations, and they make ratchet straps that are worlds more durable for tying a canoe to your car.
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Willie, don't bring any of your own real world use stuff into a thread about couple of youtube guys. what are ya thinking.


DapperDon said:
Two Dutch guys bashing an American Classic.
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howdy there.....
 
kafolarbear said:
If you watched the video you'd see they put it through a series of tests comparing it to other knives they put through similar tasks. Them saying "this knife dulls after one rope cut when other knives of similar price don't" isn't an opinion, it's a fact. Now whether or not you think that's an important metric for your knife is an opinion.
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Well their fact can be off if they are dulling it in one cut. I’ve been using a 110 for 34 years now and I know it will make more than one cut and many more. What sharpening angle did it have? What kind of rope did they use? There’s several metrics that can cause it to have an unsatisfactory result. I can only go by my own experience and results and I can tell you it’s far from what they claim.

There are millions of Buck 110s out there and you would think that if they weren’t any better than their review claims Buck wouldn’t still be making them after 59 years but they are. Just check Bucks production numbers to date.
 
Wild Willie said:
How is determining what medium is being cut beside the point? Do you spend your days cutting 3/4 inch marilla rope? Or are you more likely to cut a piece of 550 cord? Of course something like k390 is gonna cut more abrasive rope than 420hc. Then, when it finally dulls, how many average people have the capability to sharpen said knife?

What I've failed to see in 13 years of working with rope almost every day is anyone using marilla/sisal/hemp rope for anything. What I do see day to day, work being excluded are smaller diameter cordages being used. What's a more "reality based" test, cutting the things that normal people cut day to day, or some gigantic piece of natural fiber cordage that you have to go out of your way to find?

I'll add that when it comes to cutting anything dirty, making 3 extra cuts before needing a sharpening that takes 4 times as long tends to lose you time in the long run.

Maybe someday one of these chuckleheads will take the time to count the cuts one can make in a piece of paracord. Or actually take a knife out to a real job site and see what happens.

I'm all for carrying a nice knife in a hot new steel, but to look at it from a pragmatic standpoint it's completely unnecessary. I do so because I'm an edged tool enthusiast. Not because it's more practical.

Forgot my quote... K kafolarbear
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It's not about the rope cutting. The rope cutting test is just a way to measure edge retention that is standardized across their videos, your original comment said something about opinions not being akin to facts, and I'm pointing out the conclusion they came to about the 110 is based off their own tests that they've put multiple other knives through. They could have been cutting rope, cardboard or thousands of sheets of paper, the point is the edge didn't last as long as it did in other knives that conducted the same test. And mind you the video isn't really shitting on Buck or the 110, just objectively comparing them to what's already out there at a similar price point. As someone who has spent many hundreds of dollars on low alloy carbon steel knives, I totally understand the sentiment of "I just like the knife and it works for me" but that's not what these videos are about.

jbmonkey jbmonkey wants to scoff at the results of a YouTube knife video compared to "real world" use which is a bit silly. In "real world" use, most people don't have a point of reference because they only really work with one or two knives at a time. Very few people have the resources to buy hundreds of different knives in countless sizes, grinds, steels and styles to compare them in how they feel, cut, and hold an edge. If their knife is sharp at the end of the day without chips, it's a great knife to 99% of people. I've had people tell me their $13 gas station knife is the best knife ever and is still sharp after years of use, then they hand the knife to me and it's dull as a hammer. Despite all the "real world" use they've put their knife through, they still insist their dull chipped knife they bought off the side of the I-85 is the best tool ever, because that's their only reference point. Standardized tests that we see in videos from the likes of DBK or Cedric and Ada are useful for the people who want to get the ultimate bang for their buck out of their knife, or at least want to know what they should expect from a certain price point and I find nothing wrong with that.
 
Hard to beat 60 bucks for an American made folder, a great leather sheath, and outstanding warranty.

The 420hc is perfectly fine for most folks, especially considering how easy it is to sharpen and how well it resists corrosion.

Plus tarnished brass looks great, and if you want, a few rubs with Flitz brings it right back to shiny.
 
kafolarbear said:
It's not about the rope cutting. The rope cutting test is just a way to measure edge retention that is standardized across their videos, your original comment said something about opinions not being akin to facts, and I'm pointing out the conclusion they came to about the 110 is based off their own tests that they've put multiple other knives through. They could have been cutting rope, cardboard or thousands of sheets of paper, the point is the edge didn't last as long as it did in other knives that conducted the same test. And mind you the video isn't really shitting on Buck or the 110, just objectively comparing them to what's already out there at a similar price point. As someone who has spent many hundreds of dollars on low alloy carbon steel knives, I totally understand the sentiment of "I just like the knife and it works for me" but that's not what these videos are about.

jbmonkey jbmonkey wants to scoff at the results of a YouTube knife video compared to "real world" use which is a bit silly. In "real world" use, most people don't have a point of reference because they only really work with one or two knives at a time. Very few people have the resources to buy hundreds of different knives in countless sizes, grinds, steels and styles to compare them in how they feel, cut, and hold an edge. If their knife is sharp at the end of the day without chips, it's a great knife to 99% of people. I've had people tell me their $13 gas station knife is the best knife ever and is still sharp after years of use, then they hand the knife to me and it's dull as a hammer. Despite all the "real world" use they've put their knife through, they still insist their dull chipped knife they bought off the side of the I-85 is the best tool ever, because that's their only reference point. Standardized tests that we see in videos from the likes of DBK or Cedric and Ada are useful for the people who want to get the ultimate bang for their buck out of their knife, or at least want to know what they should expect from a certain price point and I find nothing wrong with that.
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Then cut things that something people can relate to is what I'm saying... How many people outside of YouTube weirdos have cut a friggin sisal rope? That isn't anything that your average Joe knife user is gonna be able to translate to their needs. Cut some effing dirty drain tile, or garden hose, or see how many feet of copper wire you can strip* maybe see how many bags of sackrete you can open. Spend a day hanging drywall, see how much fun a reprofile is after a day. You know, real world stuff that people in the trades do.


*Obviously these people have no lives outside of garnering Internet points, so don't say that it's too time consuming.
 
kafolarbear said:
It's not about the rope cutting. The rope cutting test is just a way to measure edge retention that is standardized across their videos, your original comment said something about opinions not being akin to facts, and I'm pointing out the conclusion they came to about the 110 is based off their own tests that they've put multiple other knives through. They could have been cutting rope, cardboard or thousands of sheets of paper, the point is the edge didn't last as long as it did in other knives that conducted the same test. And mind you the video isn't really shitting on Buck or the 110, just objectively comparing them to what's already out there at a similar price point. As someone who has spent many hundreds of dollars on low alloy carbon steel knives, I totally understand the sentiment of "I just like the knife and it works for me" but that's not what these videos are about.

jbmonkey jbmonkey wants to scoff at the results of a YouTube knife video compared to "real world" use which is a bit silly. In "real world" use, most people don't have a point of reference because they only really work with one or two knives at a time. Very few people have the resources to buy hundreds of different knives in countless sizes, grinds, steels and styles to compare them in how they feel, cut, and hold an edge. If their knife is sharp at the end of the day without chips, it's a great knife to 99% of people. I've had people tell me their $13 gas station knife is the best knife ever and is still sharp after years of use, then they hand the knife to me and it's dull as a hammer. Despite all the "real world" use they've put their knife through, they still insist their dull chipped knife they bought off the side of the I-85 is the best tool ever, because that's their only reference point. Standardized tests that we see in videos from the likes of DBK or Cedric and Ada are useful for the people who want to get the ultimate bang for their buck out of their knife, or at least want to know what they should expect from a certain price point and I find nothing wrong with that.
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I scoff at these reviewers...well I already said why in my first post here. go read it if ya want to know. be a waste to type it over. I also scoff that you think Willie's real world use of a knife at his job that uses knives and do cutting that actually matters in his work......doesn't count as much as some youtube reviewers "testing." i know Willie and what he does for a living. I can tell ya he isn't feather sticking on youtube for a job.

that position you've taken is comical, sorry but it is......
 
The 110 is absolutely a classic and 420HC is absolutely a budget steel. There’s nothing wrong with that. I have one and am confident it will cut things. There’s also nothing magic about the heat treat and there’s nothing wrong with that either. They just figured out how to optimize the steel characteristics. No heat treat process can ever do more for a steel than the steel composition will allow. People often forget that.

As far as the video, material testing is generally done in a way to accelerate the failure of the material or make it fail outright. I did an internship in the material testing lab at a major appliance factory a few decades ago. Among the many tests we ran, one was to test the corrosion resistance of the metals and coatings by scratching them and placing them in what was essentially a well controlled sauna until there was either nothing left or they were obviously going to outlast the appliance. No kitchen appliance would ever see the harsh conditions we tested them in in the real world. Point is, we couldn’t wait 20 years to see if your refrigerator door would rust before the refrigerator stop refrigerating. We had to make them rust quickly and extrapolate from there. The testing in the video might not be what some would like but as long as it is performed consistently the results have some real world validity.

At the end of the day if you like the 110 that’s great. In my opinion there are much better knives now but that doesn’t mean the 110 isn’t still a good knife.
 
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