A good solid example of GSM cutting corners- DLC coating replaced with Cheaper Alternative on some models

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DayofReckoning

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Mar 11, 2021
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I'm sure most of us here have seen the new line of Cold Steel classic folders like the Espada XL and Ti-Lites coming in new colors like OD green and Tan, along with the blacked out blades, right?

Well, foolish me, before playing my order, didn't bother to fully read the knife description, as I just assumed it was the same old DLC coating that Lynn Thompson has always given us on these special blacked out knives. Wrong. Turns out GSM has decided NOT to use DLC coating, instead choosing some cheaper alternative that apparently gets scratched easily. See video below (I'm not the maker of that video).


So just making this post to make people aware, if you order one of the new colored models like the Espada XL or Ti-lite, you ARE NOT getting DLC coating but something inferior.

EDIT: Title edited.
 
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DayofReckoning said:
I'm sure most of us here have seen the new line of Cold Steel classic folders like the Espada XL and Ti-Lites coming in new colors like OD green and Tan, along with the blacked out blades, right?

Well, foolish me, before playing my order, didn't bother to fully read the knife description, as I just assumed it was the same old DLC coating that Lynn Thompson has always given us on these special blacked out knives. Wrong. Turns out GSM has decided NOT to use DLC coating, instead choosing some cheaper alternative that apparently gets scratched easily. See video below (I'm not the maker of that video).


So just making this post to make people aware, if you order one of the new colored models like the Espada XL or Ti-lite, you ARE NOT getting DLC coating but something inferior.
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I knew I was right when keeping my black XHP Espadas as safe queens.
 
Looking around since making the post, it seems to be a mixed bag on what knife has what. The Espada and some other folders say "Black coating" whereas some of the Ti-lite's say DLC coated.
 
jux t said:
If that’s true, that really stinks. I loved their DLC, it was the best in the biz.
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Their DLC is still available on certain blades, but it appears that many models are getting this cheaper alternative instead, which definitely is not DLC coating. "Black coating" is the key to look for in the knifes description.
 
Not really surprising that is would happen. If they aren't going to offer DLC coating, shouldn't just put some black coating that will wear off with little use. Hate to see what other corners they will cut.
 
DayofReckoning said:
I'm sure most of us here have seen the new line of Cold Steel classic folders like the Espada XL and Ti-Lites coming in new colors like OD green and Tan, along with the blacked out blades, right?

Well, foolish me, before playing my order, didn't bother to fully read the knife description, as I just assumed it was the same old DLC coating that Lynn Thompson has always given us on these special blacked out knives. Wrong. Turns out GSM has decided NOT to use DLC coating, instead choosing some cheaper alternative that apparently gets scratched easily. See video below (I'm not the maker of that video).


So just making this post to make people aware, if you order one of the new colored models like the Espada XL or Ti-lite, you ARE NOT getting DLC coating but something inferior.

EDIT: Title edited.
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That particular Espada uses a black PVD coating which is actually a more durable option in comparison to our DLC coating. PVD is actually a more premium option. Can you please post a few close-up images of the scratches? We would like to investigate this further.
 
Shaun Cazin said:
That particular Espada uses a black PVD coating which is actually a more durable option in comparison to our DLC coating. PVD is actually a more premium option. Can you please post a few close-up images of the scratches? We would like to investigate this further.
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It is addressed at around the 30 second mark in the video I linked.
 
MolokaiRider said:
I was under the impression diamond like carbon was a bit more robust than physical vapor deposition.

They do share a similar application process to the material being applied too.
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That is my understanding as well, considering PVD uses metals for the coating while DLC uses carbon with a hardness similar to diamond. Depending on the metals used in PVD can usually determine if it will be as effective as DLC or not able to hold up to the same wear.
 
I don't think I would draw any conclusions from that video. People on Youtube can be very unreliable sources of information when it comes to knives. A guy pulls a knife from his pocket, it rubs against some unknown piece of metal, and the guy says it scratched the blade.

I'm no expert on blade coatings, not generally a fan of them either, but I've seen incidents where a black-coated blade came into contact with a metal that was softer than the blade coating, and the softer metal left traces embedded in the surface of the blade coating (transfer) that looked like scratches. But a little rubbing with a cloth and some WD40 made those marks disappear.

I don't know what metal that little part of that guys jeans was made of, but without personally examining the knife I would at least have to consider the possibility that it was a transfer, and maybe not actually scratches through the coating.

Maybe let's not be so quick to condemn Cold Steel based on one Youtube video where the facts are not certain.
 
Shaun Cazin said:
I watched the video but was hoping to get a closer look, it was hard to see the damage from the video.
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Understandable, it's difficult to see depending on your display. If you freeze the video at 49/50 seconds, you can see a long scratch along the spine towards the tip. Also at 53 seconds there is a clear mark/scratch.
 
killgar said:
I don't think I would draw any conclusions from that video. People on Youtube can be very unreliable sources of information when it comes to knives. A guy pulls a knife from his pocket, it rubs against some unknown piece of metal, and the guy says it scratched the blade.

I'm no expert on blade coatings, not generally a fan of them either, but I've seen incidents where a black-coated blade came into contact with a metal that was softer than the blade coating, and the softer metal left traces embedded in the surface of the blade coating (transfer) that looked like scratches. But a little rubbing with a cloth and some WD40 made those marks disappear.

I don't know what metal that little part of that guys jeans was made of, but without personally examining the knife I would at least have to consider the possibility that it was a transfer, and maybe not actually scratches.

Maybe let's not be so quick to condemn Cold Steel based on one Youtube video where the facts are not certain.
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You can see the deep long scratches in the video. Did you watch it before commenting?

The DLC we are used to with Cold Steel would never scratch under the circumstances the user displayed in that video.
 
DayofReckoning said:
You can see the deep long scratches in the video. Did you watch it before commenting?

The DLC we are used to with Cold Steel would never scratch under the circumstances the user displayed in that video.
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Yes, I did watch the video before posting. The blade had silver colored marks on it, and the piece of metal the guy said the blade came into contact with was also silver.

It's certainly possible that the marks were actual scratches through the coating, but like I explained, based on my experience I would also have to consider the possibility that those marks were transfer marks.
 
killgar said:
Yes, I did watch the video before posting. The blade had silver colored marks on it, and the piece of metal the guy said the blade came into contact with was also silver.

It's certainly possible that the marks were actual scratches through the coating, but like I explained, based on my experience I would also have to consider the possibility that those marks were transfer marks.
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It's certainly possible, but on my 4K display it certainly looks like scratches down to the metal to me. The owner of the video is very experienced with Cold Steel blades, I imagine he tried scrubbing the area to see if it's what you said, but maybe he didn't.

Even without the scratches, I believe my argument stands that Cold Steel has downgraded here, as my understanding is PVD is inferior to DLC coating. If that's incorrect someone can correct me.
 
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