A Phone Isn't A Map

It seems to me like far too many people are calling for assistance when they aren't in any actual danger.

Perhaps that's the primary problem with too much technology in the outdoors? If people were equipped only with a map and compass, even if they were navigation experts, they'd still have to walk themselves back to the car.
But with cell phones, sat phones, radios, beacons... why not call for rescue? :rolleyes:
 
Actually with the right software a phone is a map (and GPS)- Gaia software lets you down load seamless USGS maps (including 1:24k maps) and you don't need a cell signal to use GPS with this software. You should always carry a paper map and compass- with the ability to use them, but you can ditch the GPS with a phone and right software. While I carried a map and compass on my 100+ mile trek in the Bob Marshall Open, I heavily relied on my phone, especially when trails were frequently covered by several feet of snow.

It's another tool in the toolbox.
 
I think the main issues are:

- GPS and phones simply are not as good as a map and compass, especially when knowledge comes into play.
- GPS and cell location data adds a variable to the equation which lessens the effort to figure out where exactly you are, and the technological locations are very often wrong.
- A lot of remote locations do not have cell access, or very poor access.
- Relying on equipment with batteries opens your skillset to a series of unknowns.

I think the biggest issue is that people are now going out thinking they have an easy guide on their phone, but it simply isn't like that. Navigating in the wilderness is very hard, especially if you are off trail or on old trails. The smartphone isn't that smart, but people think it is and then trust it will make up for their lack of knowledge and skills.
 
mtwarden said:
Actually with the right software a phone is a map (and GPS)- Gaia software lets you down load seamless USGS maps (including 1:24k maps) and you don't need a cell signal to use GPS with this software. You should always carry a paper map and compass- with the ability to use them, but you can ditch the GPS with a phone and right software. While I carried a map and compass on my 100+ mile trek in the Bob Marshall Open, I heavily relied on my phone, especially when trails were frequently covered by several feet of snow.

It's another tool in the toolbox.
Click to expand...
Real maps don't run out of power.
 
true enough, that's why you have a paper map with

a paper map doesn't tell you where you are at or where the trail went when you're on top of 6' of snow in the fog, that's why you have a gps with you in addition to that paper map and compass

it's another tool in the toolbox
 
It REEEEALLY shouldn't be an either or kind of thing. Both are necessary pieces of kit IMO.
 
Cell phones screens are just too small to give very much area perspective. But I know, you can zoom in and out. Still not the same as a real map. Yes, use both if you can....
 
The newer phones are getting a little larger and most are now bigger than handheld GPS units- screen brightness the nod does go to most GPS units however- in bright sun my iPhone 6 leaves a little to be desired
 
How is the scaling and north orientation on a phone? Pretty poor I'd imagine, and you can't really set your compass on the phone. So no, the phone is definitely not essential. It's an ok backup, but not much else.
 
It makes phone calls. Definitely essential. The navigation may or may not help. Still worth having.
 
mtwarden said:
true enough, that's why you have a paper map with

a paper map doesn't tell you where you are at or where the trail went when you're on top of 6' of snow in the fog, that's why you have a gps with you in addition to that paper map and compass

it's another tool in the toolbox
Click to expand...

Not in my tool box, my phone is a dumb phone. Calls and text only. Doesn't even have a camera. And all these decades later that hasn't mattered a bit. Who'da thunk it!
 
Bob W said:
It seems to me like far too many people are calling for assistance when they aren't in any actual danger.

Perhaps that's the primary problem with too much technology in the outdoors? If people were equipped only with a map and compass, even if they were navigation experts, they'd still have to walk themselves back to the car.
But with cell phones, sat phones, radios, beacons... why not call for rescue? :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Sorry but I don't like shaming people that think they need help. If you think you need help...CALL!!! Even if it's stupid in hindsight. CALL! Women ask for help, children hide, and men refuse help. Every searcher knows this. Shaming people from calling is bad. Sorry if it seems like I'm picking on you but I don't want someone reading your post to think they shouldn't call. Education about the outdoors is lacking which I'm assuming is your point. I've passed many a people climbing one of our popular hikes in 90 degree weather with flip flops and no water so I know that first hand. :) we get calls from that trail all the time even in the middle of summer and even though thousands of people make that trek on a daily basis. It's akin to teaching people who visit the beach about tides. But if they're stuck. Call.
 
I can navigate with map and compass and dead reckon, but phones are mighty nice as navigation instruments when you have signal (and battery). I use my phone on walks through the woods to keep track of distance and pace, but it also tells me direction, shows me satellite imagery of my location, and map trails then export them to Google Maps. Don't blame phones, blame the people who go out ill prepared, and they should be charged for "rescues".
 
Even if you have a GPS you have to know how they work and always use other sources to add to the GPS.
Here we laugh at Shop-Rite Supermarket trucks .Apparently the driver just looked at the GPS and ignored all the signs !!
One lane bridge, with a T at the other end.He couldn't turn at the T couldn't back out so had to be towed back out !!
 
I think that article says more about human stupidity than it does about phones.

Folks have been going to areas like that without the proper stuff and come unstuck long before the phones came. No amount of paper map is going to help the idiots that don't take the right stuff, never has, never will. Worse is that most humans are hive-minded and take a cold comfort from being part of a group. If other people are doing it they will do it too. The Mass Tresspass of Kinder Scout in 1932 shows women going up that in what are tantamount to ball gowns. I'm sure they felt safe just because they were in a pack. Collective mindedness also finds swimmers doing stuff they probably wouldn't do on their own just because other people are swimming at the beach too. Wind in Neo-Bushcraft and Survival TV culture and the stage is set for disaster. They wont be lighting fires or making bunkers from twigs or anything like that. Knowing lowland skills like how to carve a clothes peg, or what kind of bark is best for lighting the range, or any other housewife skill wont save you. Neither will having a trendy axe or the toughest knife on the planet in old man beige . These people don't know that. It is because they are morons that don't know what is good kit from bad kit, or how to use good kit for the best that gives them problems. Blaming the modern phone culture for the failures these people are as effective agents is just misguided.

It is no different to when vehicle GPS like the Tom Tom came along. They are brilliant bits of kit in the right hands. Probably saved a few husband / wife arguments too. Mr Ego and Mrs Whingingtwat would be losing their way less often and arguing over to whether to ask for directions. On the flipside their were numerous accounts from dullards with a blind adherence to the Tom Tom moaning 'cos it sent them a less than optimal route. There was even that legendary one on Top Gear that showed a route had been plotted a ludicrous amount of miles off track, and involved exiting and then entering the country again by ferry. On balance I think we all know the automobile sat nav despite the fact that stupid people can't get the best from it. What was that thing about a man not being allowed to have steak because a baby can't chew it?


Phones are superb in skilled hands provided you have the right software and have thought ahead about the power supply. I'm far from expert in these matters but I believe I run makes it a brilliant tool. I use it on the tredder with Open Cycle maps, Open maps, and a bunch of other stuff that makes it work just like a car Tom Tom. I happen to like stuff that not only emulates what a Tom Tom does but is also geared for Taxi Drivers and Truckers. For on and off the bike it has a whole bunch of Ordnance Survey topo maps. It's probably worthy of a special mention here that one bit of software I have on it it used extensively by SAR units [see below for a few of 'em that use it], and they aren't all lowland units. A feature I particularly like about that is that if you whole team are running it you can link together so that every member throws up a beacon so as that all the others can know where they are are at given time. I love good old map and compass but to pinch a Clarksonism; this is like walking out of a biplane and into a space shuttle. That so many skilled people can use this stuff effectively clearly demonstrates that it is not the tool that is the weak link.

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The problem is that people now think of phones as part of their brain. People now immediately think of google when a problem comes up, think of searching a word if they do not know how to work through an idea. This is a severe limitation on critical thinking and shows an increase in the 'collective mindedness' or herd mentality. The technological gear acts as a crutch which is supposed to bridge the person's lack of skill.

One might contrast this with the Soviet and American philosophy of weapons. Strangely, it was the collectivist Soviets who thought enough of their people that they had the skill to care for and use a weapon while swapping out parts if necessary in the field. They made a practical design. The individualist Americans on the other hand only thought of high-tech guns which were less practical and prone to failures in the environment, thinking that only the experts could fix them anyway. The idea was that the soldier should only have to focus on pointing and shooting, and the superior abilities of the weapon would make up for its impracticality. This effectively meant that the philosophy dealt with soldiers as if they were less-skilled, and essentially collectivised them to be dependent on the technology. (The same is true of the aircraft. Russian aircraft is designed to take flight in even the worst of circumstances, while the American aircraft requires a perfect surface in which a pebble could ruin take-off.)

Phones are essentially the same, they assume an inept or incapable user. They are a barrier to skill because of this, and the philosophy of attachment and dependence on technology is what is really at issue. There is a positive correlation between technological advance and the loss of skill of the people who depend on the gadgets. You can claim personal responsibility all day long, but if the technology is dependent upon the individual not having personal responsibility then there will be constant pressure against the individual to prevent him from claiming it.

In other words, the very ease of use of the phone and the illusion that it gives you a correct location is a barrier to learning proper navigation skills. If you stick with the phones then on top of the skill you also have to repeatedly fight the false information in the phone/app. There is a clear drag written into the technology working against skill. The compass and map philosophy assumes that the user will be able to work with the technology and adapt to it for practical use. The phone philosophy assumes an inept user who will be fine so long as conditions are perfect and that he doesn't need the skill or knowledge to know how the technology really works.
 
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The modern smartphone is probably the single most powerful and versatile tool you can carry with you. Nothing wrong with those that eschew them, but my cell phone solves more problems for me day in and day out than any other piece of equipment could possibly hope to.
 
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