A question on bone.

J

jackknife

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Oct 2, 2004
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In a very recent post somebody had a question on how bone ages. In it, one forumite pointed out that all the bone that Case uses is stabilized. I was unaware of that fact, and wondered if the amber bone on my damascus 'nut was going to absorb any of the mineral oil used to lube the joint now and then. Or a bit of lemon oil on a fingertip rubbed on the scales.

So I ask, where did this info come from, and is it accurate? I don't want to waste time doing something that is not needed.

Thanks.

Carl, Grand High Muckba in search of an answer.
 
If that was the case then would I have had the same positive results with my tea and coffee dye job on that peanut I posted up a week or so ago? I would be curious to know as well.
 
Well another question might also be - is this stabilization permanent? Or is it actually more of a "seasoning" or aging where the bone perhaps stabilizes as far as shrinkage (prior to use as a knife scale and prior to assembly) compared to when it's just been harvested?

I doubt giving it a little TLC with mineral oil does it any harm at all. In fact I'd guess it can only help, especially over the years as the scales are exposed to moisture, perspiration, etc.
 
I lost a bet to waynorth when I believed GEC had told me that all their bone was stabilized
He informed me that NOBODY stabilizes bone, its an unnecessary expense.
I suggest you contact Case directly.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...od-Traditional-Barlow?p=12984059#post12984059
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...od-Traditional-Barlow?p=12984239#post12984239
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1142769

fwiw, stabilizing involves soaking the material in acrylic, it is definitely permanent
 
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I saw that comment, and I'd never heard of this either, about Case's bone. I'm skeptical if it's truly stabilized. Only thought that occurred to me (speculative), is if perhaps the dye Case uses to color their bone has some additive in it which may act to 'stabilize' the color, to minimize fading or color shifts in the long run. To me, this wouldn't be anywhere near the same as the pore-sealing characteristics of true 'stabilization' using polymer resin forced into the material under pressure, which is designed to keep materials from absorbing moisture and shrinking/swelling/warping as a result. This isn't even necessary with bone; it's very stable in that sense, anyway. As mentioned, it seems it would be a completely unnecessary expense to do it.


David
 
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I have doubted the veracity of the stabilized bone statements myself, but would also like to know for sure ( cattle bone that is ).
I do however recall reading that giraffe bone must be stabilized because of it's porosity.
 
Well, I dyed a very new CASE knife a much darker red by using a lot of tea & a small amount of salt. So, it certainly soaked up that lot (with great improvement) so I'm convinced that oils & sweat will also do their thing. Stabilized may refer to curing it long enough to prevent warp?
 
willgoy said:
Well, I dyed a very new CASE knife a much darker red by using a lot of tea & a small amount of salt. So, it certainly soaked up that lot (with great improvement) so I'm convinced that oils & sweat will also do their thing. Stabilized may refer to curing it long enough to prevent warp?
Click to expand...

'Curing' makes more sense to me, i.e. drying until moisture content is low, but 'stable', much like woodworkers do with raw wood before building projects. This, instead of 'stabilizing' in the usual sense (impregnated with polymer resin, under pressure).


David
 
"New bone scales are often impregnated with polymer resins under pressure, (Case does this), that are nearly impervious to the environment. I choose mostly bone scales myself, but I like jigging."

This is the statement I was referring to in my OP. I was just wondering if indeed I had missed something about Case impregnating the bone they use. It got me curious.
 
I think that statement was never verified and in fact jon_slider called GEC and they said they do not do this. I'd tend to think they let it cure/season (as was mentioned above with lumber) until it's stable and won't shrink or warp any longer. That's probably more along with what "stabilized" means. Just my thoughts, I could be wrong.
 
jackknife said:
"New bone scales are often impregnated with polymer resins under pressure, (Case does this), that are nearly impervious to the environment. I choose mostly bone scales myself, but I like jigging."

This is the statement I was referring to in my OP. I was just wondering if indeed I had missed something about Case impregnating the bone they use. It got me curious.
Click to expand...

That's the statement I noticed also, and my reaction matched yours. I'd never heard of it from Case, or even about them. As involved as the resin-under-pressure stabilization process is, I'd think Case would go to some lengths to highlight it, if in fact they do it. Wouldn't be worthwhile without some significant value-added benefit, in which case I'd think they'd publicize it in pretty big fashion.


David
 
I have dyed several Case knives, and it is not a surface change but has clearly soaked in.

I have an Amber bone knife that is picking up some color changes at the end near the pivots, as though it is wicking in from the cut end where the bone meets the bolster.

These are all 2013 purchases. I agree that some of the Case bone handle styles seem to look almost as though they are acrylic coated, due to how smooth and shiny they are when new out of the box. I can't believe that is all from just buffing and polishing of raw bone. But maybe it is.
 
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Bone can be very dense, and will consequently polish to a high gloss without any added substances. My understanding is that after dying, the bone is lightly oiled, and then used. That's it!
 
This has been posted before, but I was just watching it again. It's a vid from the 'How It's Made' series, featuring Case pocketknife production. Only treatment(s) shown for bone handles are 'dipping' in dye, to color them, and in the case of the finished knife shown in the vid, there's also a little paint applied for a specialized logo. No indication of any other special treatments for the bone. It occurred to me, in watching this, I don't think it'd be stabilized prior to the color dip (dye wouldn't absorb, I'd assume), nor is there any indication of such treatment anywhere after. Some of the final buffing/polishing is also shown.

As waynorth has pointed out, bone polishes up nicely; much like steel or plastics, or stone, with just appropriately-chosen abrasives for sanding & polishing.

[video=youtube;BSz5P8Ak4_g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSz5P8Ak4_g[/video]


David
 
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Nobodly stabilizes bone. When anything is stabilized it is done in a vacuum, not under pressure, which is counter-intuitive to me. Another sidelight: Many specimens of bone are more dense than many specimens of stag. In fact, Sambar stag is much more dense and more desirable than all other species of deer. Elk is particularly porous, and apparently whitetail and mule deer stag is also, as it is almost never seen. I have heard that the best bone is from large and aged cattle from the Zebu variety in Argentina. But, who knows?
 
In addition, stabilizing bone by impregnating with resin would likely be prohibitively expensive, or at least would bump Case's knives into the GEC price range or above.
 
tongueriver said:
Nobodly stabilizes bone. When anything is stabilized it is done in a vacuum, not under pressure, which is counter-intuitive to me. Another sidelight: Many specimens of bone are more dense than many specimens of stag. In fact, Sambar stag is much more dense and more desirable than all other species of deer. Elk is particularly porous, and apparently whitetail and mule deer stag is also, as it is almost never seen. I have heard that the best bone is from large and aged cattle from the Zebu variety in Argentina. But, who knows?
Click to expand...

I believe there may be something to your comment about cattle from Argentina. I know for a fact that from their beginnings throughout their existence Holley, who liked to use a lot of bone, imported all their bone from South America. I do not have a reference stating Argentina. Must be something to it when there is such a large supply right at home. As a side note they rarely jigged their bone scales. I know we all like our jigging but I have a number of examples that are well over a 100 years old and the bone looks wonderful. Much harder to see the wear versus when it is jigged.
 
The next evolution in bone will be from the uber expensive bone from Japanese Kobe cattle. All that natural and anti-biotic free organic milk, grains, Asahi beer, Trice daily hand massages, and roomy comfortable quarters produces a bone quality and density second only to non-porous metals. Kobe Beef Bone futures should be in every man's investment portfolio.
 
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