A question that has been asked before

Keith Montgomery

Keith Montgomery

Joined
May 9, 2000
Messages
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There is a knife that I would like to own, but there are a couple of reasons that make me want to look at having it made by a maker other than the original designer of the knife. The first reason is that the original maker has a horrible reputation and I wouldn't even think of ordering from him. The second reason is that I want the blade to be forged and the original is stock removed. I want the knife to strongly resemble the original, but it can differ somewhat. Would I be doing something wrong by looking to have this knife made by someone other than the original maker?

Then the next question becomes, are there makers that would take on this commision?
 
Keith Montgomery said:
The first reason is that the original maker has a horrible reputation and I wouldn't even think of ordering from him.
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Spill the beans! Who's this rotten scumbag?
I say GO FOR IT!!!!! NEVER, NEVER, NEVER give a thief money.....
You might as a well a alchoholic vodka!
Good Luck with your decision, but I want details!
BTW..... I'd say find another maker who already makes something similar, and tell him what you want. Don't mention that it looks like another knife, just that you want one of his models with your custom modifications. They are CUSTOM makers, after all.
 
Kieth,You obviously have plenty of experience dealing with knifemakers,and orders.My opinion,for what it is worth,is that there is nothing wrong,with asking a maker,that you are comfortable working with,to make a knife similar in design,but forged.The idea that the blade is forged,and not stock removal,and will have the "other " makers mark on it,this is not the same knife.Kinda like saying,I don't think it should be a liner lock,cause it isn't Walker.I do not think there is anything wrong with what you want to do,at all,Go for it.Please show us what you had 'em make,too!
 
If it's better than the original, how can it be wrong. Plageurism would require IMO, the design be legally patented and/or enough copies were made to draw attention. Otherwise I say go for it.
 
I have had the same thought a time or two.
Good luck and show us what you have made if you go that way.
 
upon how unique the style is to that maker alone.

FR instance, Joe Cordova is going to FORGE me a Loveless style chute knife. No problemo, him and Bob are cool, and he will do a top quality job, I know I will get something nice, and different.

IF it was going to be a forged version of one of Jack Crain's Predator knives, well, I suppose that it could be done, but why?

Why have a knife, or a knife styled by a maker who is a dick, when there are so many top shelf makers around that are TOTALLY willing to work with you, and can help you create something with them that reflects who YOU are as much as what THEY are?

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
I've been asked to copy another knifemaker's work - but add my "spin" to it. And, honestly, I have mixed feelings about it.

A few negatives:

#1 - I start out "second best". Sounds catty, but making knives can be an emotional investment by the maker and having to sweat it out to somebody else's design can be aggravating.

#2 - When someone else sees the finished product, they assume I designed it. So, ultimately it reflects on me. Either I designed it, or I plagarized it.


A few positives:

#1 - I actually like to take other people's ideas/suggestions and incorporate them into mine...and I know I'm not the only one.

#2 - if the other maker has a "bigger name" than mine...I would be flattered to be considered to make an "interpretation" of their work and explore their process.





My suggestion?

Find a maker who already makes something somewhat similar. Tell them what you like about the other maker's design and that you would like to see their version.



Best of luck! :thumbup:
 
Daniel Koster said:
My suggestion?

Find a maker who already makes something somewhat similar. Tell them what you like about the other maker's design and that you would like to see their version.
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My exact thoughts. :)
 
I don't think there is anything wrong in what you want to do. What's important is how you present it. Go for it.
 
I don't think there's anything wrong with that idea but I do think that most makers wouldn't be interested. Put yourself in their shoes - after spending N years developping their own style, doing someone else's design? What's the attraction? The exception are younger makers who want to try something different.
 
Joss said:
I don't think there's anything wrong with that idea but I do think that most makers wouldn't be interested. Put yourself in their shoes - after spending N years developping their own style, doing someone else's design? What's the attraction? The exception are younger makers who want to try something different.
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I think it depends. There is absolutely no problem finding makers that follow the designs made famous by makers such as Scagel, Randall, Loveless, Fisk and Moran. Others will copy the designs of Michael Price, Will & Finck, Searles, Schively or Samuel Bell without worrying about these being someone elses designs. Individual makers will have their own ideas on this subject. Some absolutely refuse, others are iffy about it, and still others have no problem at all. I think it also depends on who the original maker is.
 
GFarrell3 said:
If it's better than the original, how can it be wrong.
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That's what they say in China!
:eek:

Keith, it depends on who made the original knife and how much the design is indentified with the originl maker. If the design is highly original and would instantly be recognized as that designer's work, then I'd say don't try and have another Maker copy it for you.

If the knife isn't really that original and other Makers do similiar designs, then ask one of them to make you a knife in the same stylistic direction.
 
...it's a recipe for disappointment from many angles.

There are so many makers who are worthy in their own right of satisfying a smart collector with their own style, that that's a 'siren song' you don't need to hear.

If said maker is such a perceived dickhead to you, then why even respect him with his design?

Keith, you have superb taste. Move forward.

Coop
 
Hee-hee, Jim said dickhead. :D

Keith, just find a maker who's already in trouble for copying designs and you're all set. :)

OK, seriously, you already know the answer, as usual, it depends on several factors, but, if I were a maker, I wouldn't do it unless the design and maker were very well regarded and were totally OK with it.

I can't be the only one playing knife detective and trying to think of a dickhead who makes an interesting stock removal fixed blade, wait a minute! AB doesn't forge, right... :)
 
Actually, Steven amazed me by nailing it right on the head. The knife is the Predator Machete.

I think what I will do is look for a maker willing to work with me to come up with a design that uses some of the styling cues of the Predator Machete, and also willing to forge a knife that big.
 
I am a new maker, but probably wouldnt touch this one unless I could contact the original maker and ask their permission. This is all dependant on how unique it is, and how much the design asked-for resembles or uses the original's style. I think the tough thing here isnt so much you asking as the repercussions on the second maker's reputation if the original maker throws a fit (which may be more likely since you said he is a dick).
I think theres a distinction between doing a scagel-type knife in homage to a master, and doing a semi-copy because the original maker doesnt want to be dealt with. One is highly flattering to the original maker who has developed a style over years, the other highly insulting since you basically want his developed style, but dont want to associate it with him.

just my .02
 
this it?

crainset001-s.jpg




tough decision indeed...
 
I would love to see a forged rendition of that blade! :D I think the approach to be taken has been suggested - find a maker who is comfortable with working to customer specifications and ask if he would be interested in redering his interpretation of that style of knife. Not a clone, but an hommage. Have him draw up a sketch - you may well like it better than the knife that inspired it.

I can think of one or two that might be game.

Roger
 
Id be a bit more concerned considering that knife is also Patented....according to the website. Not sure how close you can make a new one without stepping over that imaginary legal line...
 
TikTock said:
Id be a bit more concerned considering that knife is also Patented....according to the website. Not sure how close you can make a new one without stepping over that imaginary legal line...
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It's one man making one sale who may choose to not choose to even put his own mark on it! Yes, there is the legal question and ethical question, but IMO..... it's really kind of moot due to the fact that it's just one sale between you and the maker, that no one else ever has to know about. Okay.... It's not moot, and everyone has to choose how they are going to interpret right and wrong, but I'm sure that a reputable maker will work with you to get something in your hands that you'll be happy with.
But get back to another off-topic topic. What is so special about that knife? Wait around a while and get a Fusion Busse Battle Mistress when it comes out!
I don't get the short false edge on the back. Why would you want a knife like that to hinder your penetration? It's your money, but IMO the predator machete is more of a fantasy piece than anything really useful. I hope your version comes out better!
 
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