a welder

D

dustfurn

Joined
Oct 2, 2007
Messages
72
I'm looking to buy a welder, and i wanted to see what you guys would recommend.

My only welding experience was 2 semesters of a metal workshop class in highschool (about 12 years ago). We did quite a bit of stick arc welding and I felt like i really got the hang of it.

Anyways, what sort of welder would you recommend for general blade-smithing duties (welding up billets, anvil tools, etc). One of the first projects I'm going to do after getting back up to speed on scrap is to weld up a vertical quench tank ( 3' of 6" diameter iron pipe welded to a mild steel base). I am not familiar with wire-fed and/or mig welding...is it worth it? I'm looking to spend max ~$600 (i'm just a hobbyist).

Thanks,
Dustin
 
MIG welding is the easiest and requires the least practice to master, but to weld a tank to hold your quenchant, you gotta have it just right or your oil will end up on the shop floor. TIG would be best for a tank, but it is the toughest to learn and you'll have to spend more money than $600 to get set up properly (you have to run pure argon as the shielding gas). Maybe you can get a scratch start TIG and a small "crackerbox" welder, but you won't have the heat control you need.

Harbor Freight has cheap MIGs, but they don't come with the regulator or the tank. You really can't use flux core (without gas) and get a good weld on a tank unless you are a really great welder (maybe not even then). I would save up and buy a better welder. Try http://www.htpweld.com/

They have good stuff at real good prices compared to Miller/Lincoln, etc. Good Luck!
 
You can get some older US made welders that are great machines. I am using a PowerKraft 230 that my dad got when he graduated from highschool. The cables and clamps need replaced but the welder itself is running like a champ. The power settings label has almost rusted completely and I had to re-paint them. When this one dies I will have to fork over some big bucks to adequately replace it. I would not want one that had any less power or a lower duty cycle.

You are more likely to find an older welder for a very good price then other tooling like anvils or mills.
 
I weld and used to make a living at it. I still work with welders. I would get the best DC stick machine I could get. You can weld most anything you need with the right rod. You can even get 1/16" rod and weld some pretty light gauge stuff. 1/8" thick steel is not hard with stick and I can weld 16 gauge if I needed to with stick and it won't leak. Easir to learn to do that than tig. You can do stainless and hardfacing with stick. They even make aluminum stick rod but, it is expensive and kind of hard to learn to make work. They make rod for most materials. Wire welding is ok, but, a $600 machine isn't much, and then you need a bunch of tips, gas, and you have to change spools of wire everytime you change materials. I own 2 wirefeeds, they mostly set in the corner and gather dust. I can have my stick machine on, set and pick out the right rod and be welding in less than a minute. If you want later you can get an argon bottle and a scratch tig torch connect it to your stick machine. and do some other stuff, but, I hardly ever fire up my tig rig. If you tig aluminum you need a high frequency box or power source. Tig is best with a good power source, a cooler and a foot control, but $$$ Plus, then you need to learn to control the torch with one hand, feed the filler rod with the other and control the amount of heat with a foot. Some guys can do some amazing stuff with one of those. It takes a ton of practice. You can wire feed aluminum but, it is a hassle and jams a lot unless you have a spool gun or a very short whip on your feeder. I repeat, if I could only have 1 welder it would be a decent stick machine with DC, Get a auto hood you'll love that.
 
I use a Lincoln wire welder with flux core wire.

A trick is to weld the tank up. Clean out the inside bottom real good. Sand the inside bottom with with coarse sandpaper. Wipe it out with acetone. Pour in about 1" of epoxy resin, and let it cure.
How did I discover this? Not every weld I make is oil tight.
Stacy
 
Thanks for your replies.

bladsmth said:
I use a Lincoln wire welder with flux core wire.

A trick is to weld the tank up. Clean out the inside bottom real good. Sand the inside bottom with with coarse sandpaper. Wipe it out with acetone. Pour in about 1" of epoxy resin, and let it cure.
How did I discover this? Not every weld I make is oil tight.
Stacy
Click to expand...

Stacy, are you saying to not weld it at all and just use epoxy? Or weld it up, but then pour in epoxy to fill in any gaps? If I weld it up first, I'll have a hard time cleaning up the inside bottom, cause it's 3' long!

Thanks,
Dustin
 
I recommend starting with a stick welder because it is the most versatile for the least amount of money. DC capabilitiy would be nice but I have burned alot of rods on AC and can't think of a single thing a hobby knifemaker would run into you can't do with it. Take a look at the Lincoln AC225, thats about the best bang for the buck and you'll be able to pass it on to your kids. I've probably burnt about 50lbs of rod on one here and it still runs like new. I have welded mild steel from 18 gauge to half inch thick with it and while it isn't ideal, it does it all.


For wire welders your budget leaves you pretty much entry level. You could get a basic lincoln or hobart, but wouldn't have cash left to get all the accessories, or a tank for it.
I have a remanufactured hobart handler 175 and its actually a nice little welder but I wouldn't want it to be my only welder. I personally dislike welding with fluxcore (despite my love for stick welding, go figure). And to get a tank of argon/co2 mix for it is about 200 bucks to get started. I have welded everything from 22gauge autobody panels to 1/4 inch mild steel with it and it works well, but it is very lacking in power for the thicker stuff, and I would not use it on anything over 1/4" thick.


I recommend you get the basic stick welder and spend the rest of the money on a good shield, extra gloves, a welding jacket, and an assortment of rods. You can get an adjustable auto darkening helmet for about $100 now and will be much more comfortable than flipping your lid all the time. You'll probably cook your first pair of gloves when you get back into it, and if you're like me you'll set your shirt on fire without the jacket :D Clamps are handy too
 
I have a millermatic 130 MIG machine with the argon/CO2 mix bottle. It's point and shoot welding and I use it a lot! it'll do up to 1/8 inch thick per pass. If I was going to buy it over again I would have gotten the Linclon equivalent for the same money, as it has variable power instead of 4 steps.
I want a TIG, and will be looking at the prices for the link above, Stick welders are cheap and powerful, but they are not beginner toys if you want to weld well (if you have a friend who is a pro, get one, otherwise save your pennies and buy a MIG

Like Stacy said, get an autodarkening helmet, it is money VERY well spent.
If you get a solar one, always leave it where the sunshine can charge it all the time. Yes they do have batteries (despite what the welding shop guys say) and you do not want to strike an arc when the batteries on your eye protection are dead.

-Page
 
cadillac forge said:
my thoughts after much study, just like your doing, i settled for the miller 225 thunderbolt ac/dc --i had it 5 years and have never regretted it a minute
http://cgi.ebay.com/Miller-Thunderb...yZ113743QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Click to expand...

Looks like a perfect small job welder. You can do a lot with a machine like this. Later you can cut the leads off about a foot long and put terminals on them so you can add length. With practice you can do a very good job of welding steel any steel with it.

Clean your metal to be welded. Unless it is a fillet weld (corner) make a groove or if light metal leave a gap about half the diameter of your rod. Get an auto hood. Strike in your weld zone but, a bit away from your starting point and drag slowly to it, keep your arc small and tight, watch the edges of your puddle, thats where it is happening, move smoothly. Chip the slag before you restart a weld. If you blow thru. STOP, Try a little less power. let it cool and then work the edges to fill the hole let it cool. Weld as much as you can flat. Overhead isn't much different than flat, but, run a bit cooler as the heat is going up into the metal better. Run most verticals uphill and point your rod slightly uphill keep stacking the weld, run cooler as the heat is going up. Stainless wants to fall out out a up hill run be patient. If the material is thin run down hill with a rod like 6010. It freezes up fast. It also penetrates so run it cooler than say 7018. Get your skinny gap and stick the rod right in the gap touching both sides and slightly pointed up and start down if it starts to keyhole (get a round hole on the bottom) start whipping the tip down the crack and back up to the weld to give the area a bit more time to cool and freeze up. 6010 should look like a stack of coins that slid flat. Get a welder to watch you once in awhile to point out your mistakes problems. Practice for years. :D
 
The last time I used a stick welder my shop and barn burnt down. I don't do much welding anymore but I do need to weld something from time to time. I did take a gas welding class in high school. It was a few years after that that electricity showed up. I find having a gas welder comes in very handy for a number of applications. Everyonce in awhile if I need something welded up better than I can do with the gas I'll just have it done.
 
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=94337


http://www.millerwelds.com/products/weldinghelmets/prohobby.php

An auto darkening helmet is the best thing i found for learning how to arc weld.

I tried to do it the way my father showed me when i was a teen, by holding the mask.
I was too slow getting it in place and needed both hands on the electrode holder.
After a day of trying i ended up with burned eyes and lots of "stick ons"

Recently I tried to learn again. I have a mask with auto darkening and infinitely variable shade. ( not just fixed at 9, 10, 11, 12... but fully adjustable)
It allows me to pick a setting i can see at and keep both hands on the stick.
Some of the very best money i have ever spent.
 
the miller thunderbolt 225 ac/dc is a very good machine for the money i have had one for about 7 years and have welded everything from pipe to 18 ga. sheet metal try to use reverse dc current as much as possible for most things it's hard to beat a 7018 it welds smooth and is very strong 70,000 psi and if you use it right the flux just pops off or peels back and you just brush it off try to stay away from to 60 series of rods they dont weld that well and are high spatter and deep penetrating except for the 6013 witch is for sheet metal if you want to learn more about rod selection you can go to lincoln electric.com as for hoods a fibre metal pipeliner with a ao safety weld cool lense in a shade 10 it is good for most all applications. just remember that the #1 rule to making a good weld is to be comfortable (i.e.) if you can sit down do it if you can lay down do it etc. take your time and practice all it takes to be a good welder is to want to be and put forth the effort to be. i hope i have helped someone.
 
Stick with the stick machines. Little mig machines are very limited in what they can do.. I use my mig (hobart handler 140 from TSC) alot but I use my Miller maxstar 140 for all of the important stuff.... 7018 all the way.. keep the rods dry BTW.
 
The Lincoln 225 (Red Tombstone Model) has been around for along time.It has kept farmers and shade tree mechanics in business more than any other model out there. I recently bought one for $125 delivered from craigslist With the variety of welding rods both size and purpose, you can do just about anything with it. I would love to have a MIG but this will do almost everything I need done!
 
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