All the s@#t going on around here

[Cumberland Knives]

That one got your attention didn't it ?

What with all the hoodoo going around about the changes going on to the forum, I think a new perspective is needed.

From where I see it, there are basically 3 different camps

1. your average member, who has no knife business, is not a knife maker, etc.

Most of them don't care about the changes, cause they don't directly affect them.

2. Knife Dealers. They don't generally like the changes, cause it means more work, and more expense for them.

3. Mike & Spark. Who are trying to make a living with different ventures, all the while keeping this site open. They are not doing anything wrong. They are merely trying to turn a profit in the overall scheme of things.

Now I too, being a dealer, don't like more work or expenses than anyone else does. But I have rethought my position on this. All of the changes going on (classifieds, auctions, etc.) only give me more options, and widen my oportunities. I now have the ability to auction,post a classified,have or not have a banner,etc.

I think that the problem to a great extent stems from the misconception that BF is some sort of non-profit organization, and not a fully owned subsidiary of WOW inc, which it is.

I understand that as such, Mike and Spark are walking a tightrope here by having such a large venue for the knife trader / seller /maker, etc. while at the same time owning 1sks. Most of the arguements against Mike and Spark tend to be of the "damn you guys for beig lukewarm" attitude, and not either strictly a community service, or a promotional tool for 1sks.

Now I will say that sometimes, Mike and Spark are a little jaded in their responses, but they have been going through this a long time. Perhaps a little vacation is in order. I don't know. But we all said a lot of things that didn't need to be said, now didn't we.

My .02 cents worth

Mike,Spark : I'm re-uping my banner and already have some auctions running. At this point, I need you more than you need me.




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[Hoodoo]

What exactly do you mean by hoodoo?



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Hoodoo

The low, hoarse purr of the whirling stone—the light-press’d blade,
Diffusing, dropping, sideways-darting, in tiny showers of gold,
Sparkles from the wheel.

Walt Whitman

 

[Cumberland Knives]

see what I mean...now the things took form and got a life of its own, a BF membership and all. I had no idea things had gotten this out of hand.

Ha

 

[Mike Turber]

That is a pretty good anologistic view of things John. I only wish people could sit in my office during one full day and witness all the bull **** we go through with all this stuff. I am just trying to reduce headaches so I can make a damn living

A few people have actually sat in here and watched a few of the things we go through. Eddie McGowan, Will Fennell and some others have seen it first hand.

We get a bunch of email each day from members saying things like, "johnny is being mean to me and I think you should do something about it or I will sue you" or "ho do I post a picture" and "why didn't you answer the email I sent 5 minutes ago" and no I am not joking about the last one

All in all I guess you have to say that we allowed this to happen. Some would call it poor planning on my part, but how in the hell do you predict some of this ****. I mean we get some really stupid **** sometimes and all I can do is laugh but then I must remember that some of these people are actually serious. I am not talking about simple stuff like people not knowing how to do something that may be easy for the technically inclined. I am talking about standard **** your parents should of taught you growing up. I feel like I am a damn baby sitter sometimes.

Although the tone above would suggest I am pissed off, a more accurate description would be that I am tired and I want a solution.

80 hours a week will catch up to you and I have so much going on that my wife is on vacation in the keys right now and guess where I am?

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Mike Turber
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[Cumberland Knives]

hey, I know where you are coming from with that. Been working for nearly 3 years now 80+ hours a week, no holidays off, no weekends off, etc. it does take its toll. I have come to the conclusion that this is going to be a major part of the knife industry, and an opportunity that I had better get behind. Probably, since we are about the same age, we can ride this stuff out and see it from the other end 20-30 years from now, and laugh.

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[Emanym Ton]

I don't know what I should say here..... I started checking out this site November of '99, immediately was hooked, bought some knives, learned more about knives, sold some knives, learned even MORE about knives and have come to enjoy this forum so much it takes up around 3 hours a day for me that I happily give and feel better about each time I log off even when I read posts about people being upset. I never once considered the work or stress involved and assumed everyone was having just as much fun as I was. I humbly apologize for my ignorance and for anything I may have contributed to increase the 'bad' points of this forum for Mike/Spark and the Moderators/everyone else here.

Having said that, I don't know where to go from here. I don't know if sending a fair percentage for the knives I've sold here to Mike/Spark would be of any real help (likely under $50 if I was REALLY generous), I don't know if suggesting things as a fix would help cause they seem to have little affect but perhaps I'm wrong, I don't know how to show my support. From what you say about the hours, Mike, you're getting eaten up by this thing and need some help but that help can only come when you put your foot down and delegate or ask for help. You guys have mentioned negatively about micro-management but I know if I were putting 80+ hours a week I would delegate till it hurt. Seems like at least some of the stress has to be worth it or that you are motivated by something to keep doing this otherwise why do you do it. I don't need to know your justifications, rather just what I can do to minimize the bad stuff for you. I don't remember sending any goofy emails like the ones you mention but admit there may have been some less than intelligent questions at any given time. Couldn't your Moderators help with the 'stupid' emails that come your way like having access to that part of your mailbox while keeping your personal e-address secret or changing it every month (yeah, I know sounds like even more stress but there has to be some solution!) or whatever. John's post just really sums it up.... all the s@#t going on around here. I have never considered only buying knives from Dealers here but all my transactions have been from people I met here or that I was referred to but I understand your concern about the Dealers supporting this site and our patronage. That's the easy part cause truly the prices are relatively close from what I've seen. The problem for me is that I've acquired a healthy taste for knives and now will only be buying 4 or so a year because of the cost. So, I won't be sending any of the Dealers on a Cruise in the near future from my patronage no matter how loyal a customer I am. I guess I fit into the category 1 of John's post but I think I do care. Especially when I can read posts like Mikes and see the stress. I just have no idea what to do about it. Anyone else feel this way or am I an island by myself?
Shawn


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I know I can't hold the hate inside my mind
'Cause what consumes your thoughts controls your life
So I'll just ask a question
What if?

What if your words could be judged like a crime?
-CREED ('What if')

 

[Cumberland Knives]

I tell you what guys, I'll give you an insight into a typical day as a knife dealer.

Mike puts in about the same number of hours that I do, so we probably have similar tales when it comes to being a dealer. He has more pans in the fire, also running this site, and other things, but he has employees as well, and I am all alone, so we are probably about just as busy as each other.

Anyway

1st thing packages are arriving all the time, from UPS,Post Office,Fed EX, etc. Every weekday. They must be unpacked, sorted, checked for defects, etc.

there is always a ton of email waiting every morning too. Orders to be filled, questions to be answered. A lot of people email in to check on their orders, this is no problem, but you would be suprised at how many do so without giving their name,address,phone number,order number, what they ordered, when, or any information which would make it easy to track this info down for them and answer their questions.

You always have stuff being returned for some reason, damaged, refunds, etc. this has to be dealt with.

You are also keeping up with all the latest releases from dozens of manufacturers, keeping your prices current, adding more brands to the catalog, etc.

Then shipments must be gotten out. Got to go to the bank, post office, UPS, etc. sometimes twice a day.

Then there is the phone. It is ringing so much that you think you hear it even when you are driving down the road in your car. HA

Then there is dealing with credit card processing accounts. Bookkeeping (I keep my own books), taxes (I file them myself).

Oh yeah, you have supplies to buy, mailing supplies, printer paper, tape, staples, software, computers(always break down at the most inconvienient times), then the website goes down(at least once per month), etc.

While you are doing all of this, you must eat, sleep sometimes, have family, etc. There are no weekends,no holidays, Even Wal-Mart closes for Christmas, but not us.

And God help you if you ever get sick. I was in the hospital during a week during the Christmas season last year, bought a notebook computer, hired my wife away from her job, and worked right out of the hospital room, and nobody ever knew the difference.

I typically go to bed around 3am.

Now after saying this, I want you to know that I like my job, a lot. And plan on doing this for another 20-30 years.

Mike, Spark, MJS, MPayne,and all the rest of you other dealers : More Power To YA, and if I can ever help, just let me know.

John

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[Hoodoo]

Guys, I realize this forum can be a pain in the a$$. But take it from me, you aren't the only people working long hours and putting up with a lot of guff.

I can tell you I envy your 80 hours per week. As a college professor I easily average that and then some. I normally run on 5 hours of sleep and I've been doing that since I started in grad school. Then try teaching science to a bunch of whiny nonscience majors who's only goal is to "get a good grade" without working for it. And they get to evaluate you anonymously and these anon evaluations play a major role in determing your salary, promotion and tenure. And if it was just teaching, life wouldn't be so bad, but it's grant writing, doing research, and running experiments, often working 'round the clock 24 hours per day sometimes. We also get evaluated for our department and community service as well. There is rarely a day that goes by that I don't have to attend some kind of committee meeting. And of course, there is the endless stream of students knocking on your door day in and day out + email and websites to maintain, collaborators to meet with, scientific meetings to prepare for and attend and campus political battles to deal with (and almost impossible to avoid).

Every semester, I not only get evaluated by 200 students but also by 21 other faculty members, the dean and two other academic committees. Did someone mention pressure?

Ya, you guys got it tough but who doesn't? The best I can do is empathize. I haven't had a vacation in years and I rarely have a day that I can take just to relax. I have to admit that even though my work is endless, I still find it challenging and satisfying. If I didn't, I'd find something else to do.

Cumberland,
Oh yeah, I was just kidding about the hoodoo thing. I thought it was so obvious that I didn't put up a smily face. So relax. Looks to me like you need a vacation. Me too and when I get tenure, I'll take one.


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Hoodoo

The low, hoarse purr of the whirling stone—the light-press’d blade,
Diffusing, dropping, sideways-darting, in tiny showers of gold,
Sparkles from the wheel.

Walt Whitman

 

[Cumberland Knives]

I'm saving the vacation for retirement, 20 or 30 years from now.

------------------
Visit john@cumberlandknives.com

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</A>
for all your knife needs.

 

[Emanym Ton]

Hoodoo,
Your situation sounds like a nightmare on acid after a binger drinking tequila for a week. Thank God we have people like you who can make a difference and if it is any solace whatsoever I back Education with my vote at every opportunity.

John from Cumberland,
The retirement thing sounds great but as my late grandfather can attest (second heart attack killed him at 50 when his heart basically blew apart) you gotta make it there and be in good enough shape to enjoy it.

So, now back to my question. Mike/Sparks situation seems to differ somewhat in that this Forum sounds kinda like a charity gig. Or do I have that wrong.? So, should I waste emotions feeling bad for them and wondering what I can do to make a difference or what? Cause I have enjoyed these forums and if it has been at the expense of someone's life by making it more stressful then that is not right.

I had a buddy who worked like you guys do but the thing with him was that he was far too Type A to let anyone help or do anything for him so his stress was all his own creation and I didn't feel a bit sorry for him after learning this.

Myself, I don't plan on ever retiring cause by the time I get there it will likely be mandatory to work till you're 80. I take vacations now, I call off sick with my kids to take care of them now, I stop and smell the roses today, I take vacation days off without pay this year, I spend time with my wife today, I play with my pets today, I take individual time for myself (even if it is 5 minutes- cause that 5 minutes pays of in years added to your life on the backend!) EVERY day, I make a difference in the job that I do and when I have a problem I ask for help from someone else and if that doesn't work I strive valiantly to correct the problem so someone else doesn't suffer the same fate. Not to say I don't work hard. In fact sometimes I work HARD AND FOR FREE cause I feel my time spent benefits not only my employer but myself as well. I love my job like you guys do and reap the rewards of my effort on a minute by minute basis rather than day by day which is rare and I appreciate it greatly!

I just didn't want to add more stress to someone's life for something that I consider a privelage and don't take all that seriously. I can still buy knives without Bladeforums. I can probably find something a bit more local to participate in. My point is that I like it here and would like to do what I can to keep this open but quite frankly don't know what that 'thing' is or if, in fact, I should even be worrying about it.????
Shawn

 

[Mike Turber]

20 or thirty years? What are you nuts! I am going to crunch this **** down to 5-10 years myself

To put it in the words of the almighty Cartman...

Screw you guys, I am outa here

------------------
Best Regards,
Mike Turber
BladeForums Site Owner and Administrator
Do it! Do it right! Do it right NOW!
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[Cumberland Knives]

great mike, sell me BF when you retire. I'm in here for the long haul. Actually 20-30 years will be a little early, if I make it by then, I'll be doing really really well.

------------------
Visit john@cumberlandknives.com

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</A>
for all your knife needs.

 

[JohnR7]

>> I feel like I am a d*** baby sitter sometimes.

I can relate to the baby sitter part alright. I would buy, sell and trade knives just as a hobby, even if I never managed to make a penny off of it. But I will not check up on people to see if they follow through with what they said they were going to do. If I do not get a payment, I just offer the knife to someone else. There are a lot of really good people out there, who are a pure pleasure to deal with, and they get put on my contact list for when I get hard to find knives. The only thing I usually offer to people with no track record are the easy to find knives, that everyone has and everyone sells, that you can get anywhere.
Thanks, JohnR7

 

[Kkimo]

Mike & Spark,
If you want to make this site pay for itself, do it the way almost every other dot.com does. Go Public. After all, there's maybe a handfull of sites out there that actually make money. An IPO of say $15 a share for the best knife site out there should shoot this operation into the black for years to come. Any time funds are short, offer some more stock. That's how Case made his money. It's not like AOL operates in the black.
Dave

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Sometimes, adequacy can be a sign of genius.

 

[mpayne]

This is beautiful man, the inner child is coming out of us all

LOL......
Yup, can relate to a long day...On the UPS truck delivering everyone else knives in Cordova,TN. Run a total of about 170 stops a day during regular months and maybe 300 a day during Xmas time. But, we still answer emails pretty rapidly, via the wife, thru me, and I took an order the other day while eating Pizza and still managed ship it out the same Day! The man is a Beast ..Aaarrrgghhhhhhhhhh.
I LOVE THIS STUFF....Then, went to the Redbirds Game(our Triple A team) on Friday nite this week and worked a show all day Saturday & Sunday......Shew........what a week. Then fish around the forums until about 2:00AM.....heck....I'm going to bed now..

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Knives & Things
Mike Payne