almar sere miserably fails spine wack

Joined
Aug 16, 2000
Messages
48
This knife so reliably failed the spine wack test it must now be relagated to kitchen duty only. Whoever calls it a tank of a knife.... i say a breadstick of a knife. Expected more for 130$. Even when i first looked it over, wasn't on par with my benchmades. And it's so huge and heavy, what's the point? Won't ever buy a knife from that Al geek again.
 
Send it in to be worked on, its probably out of adjustment and will be covered by the warranty. That knife has gotten too many good reviews here for it to be doing that. Try as they might, not every knife will come out of the factory perfect.

------------------
I may not be the sharpest knife in the drawer... but I've got the sharpest knife in the room.
 
Send it back. They will fix it.
BTW, Al Mar has been dead for a while and was no geek. When he was there, knives were built like tanks. All that remains is the name.

Dave
 
Every maunfacturer will have a lemon get through once in awhile. A reputable company will fix or replace. So, send it back. If not to your satisfaction, sure go call it names and all. As mentioned, AL Mar has passed on. Good thing, as he was anything but a "geek."

sing
AKTI #A000356
 
I have two Al Mar SERE 2000s. I gave a third to my partner as a gift. They all lock up rock solid. I havent tested my partners, but all the spine whack test did on mine was put a lot of dents in my desk. Even the best of manufacturers will turn out a product that isn't up to specs. If possible return the knife and give them a chance to make it right. Also please report what you choose to do and what kind of response you get. It is important for us to know how customer service of different companies is.

------------------
Dennis Bible

mylogosmall.gif
 
Second that you may have gotten a lemon - ever maker screws up now and then, even custom makers. I've had the chance to examine a knife buddy's new SERE 2000 and was very impressed with the solid lockup and am surprised that yours was a disappointment. Hell, I'd probably rate the lock more solid than some of my custom pieces. You could probably take it back to the dealer who sold it to you or send it back to Al Mar for a fix. The Al Mar SERE is a great hard-use knife except for the horrible thumb stud.

Red

------------------
"Praise not the day until evening has come;a sword until it is tried; ice until it has been crossed; beer until it has been drunk" - Viking proverb

[This message has been edited by redvenom (edited 01-17-2001).]
 
I just got off the phone with Gary Fadden and had an opportunity to inform him of the situation. He was very concerned and intends to take care of the matter.

Don't be surprised to see him jump in and address this thread once he gets registered on the forum.

Blues


------------------
Live Free or Die

Blues' Knife Pix
 
BM- don't know if you were kidding, but to call Al Mar a geek is ,IMHO, ridiculous. And to bad-mouth their products without talking to them first and giving them a chance to fix the problem is irresponsible.
frown.gif
 
Gee, pack it up and send it to me. I could always use another one!
smile.gif


------------------
Peter Atwood

email:fountainman@hotmail.com
 
I'm one of the few that thinks the "spine whack" is a ridiculous test anyway and way overrated.

Do you plan on hammering with the spine of your knife? If so, get a fixed blade, or better yet, a hammmer!

I know, I know, it's supposed to test lock strength. But when cutting with a knife, when do you put hammering pressure on the back of the blade? if you do, your probably using it wrong, remember "the right tool for the right job"
smile.gif


A better test is a thrusting/twisting test into wood, clothing, meat, cardboard etc...
I feel that's a little more realistic test.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong!
wink.gif
 
well i think its a good test, since many knives seem to pass it without a problem. I wasn't wacking hard on solid steel, but a softened wood fence. I think the spine wack is actually one of the safer ways to test a knife.

Another thing that peeved me about the sere is that it cut my thumb... not the blade, but the damn thumbstud had a sharp wire sticking out of it. Granted, it only took a wire clipper to fix, but it showed a lack of attention to detail for 130$. Although over the past 5 years many of us have forgotten, that is alot of money to spend on a production knife.

It has been difficult finding a phone number to al mar as their website has no contact info, phone number, or address. I sent them a catalog request and wrote my sob story on the comment section, i havent recieved a reply.

Thanks for everyone's concern
 
Wire sticking out of it? maybe you got the electric version instead of the mechanical one.
smile.gif
I'm sure whatever the problems are, Gary will make it right.

As for spine whack tests, I consider it a good test for *some* folders designed for wilderness use, as the SERE is. During my review I cut through a 2 inch sapling by hammering the spine through. This is something reasonable to expect out of a "survival" folder. The SEREs that I tested held firm and better than most other liner locks I have reviewed.

But calling Al Mar a geek? Maybe there should be a Bladeforum member spine whack test
smile.gif


Jeff

------------------
Randall's Adventure & Training
jeff@jungletraining.com
 
Hi,

I can't imgine that the super thick liner of the SERE 2000 would slip, it one of the thickest I've seen in production folders. It locks with a solid "cloinck" that reminds me of a closing car door of a Volvo
smile.gif


On the other side my first SERE 2000 that I bought from a dealer and payed a good amount of money for had an asymmetrical grind and lots of what appeared to be tiny scratches all over the blade. Also it was way from being the sharpest knife I've bought (fresh from factory).
The asymmetrical part really bugged me !

My $50 Spyderco Moran (old one with leather slip sheath) has to be the sharpest I ever bought.
Also Al Mar should take a look at the Moran as to finish quality of the VG 10 steel the Moran is finished to a mirror finish.

I called Al Mar 3 times from Holland and three (3) times got promissed to get called back and had to give my name and telephone number and Mr.Gary Fadden would be "paged" and would call back and nothing happened so after spending $122.50 for the SERE + $15 telephone costs and not having heard anything I sold it to a friend who didn't mind the asymmetrical grind and scratches (I showed them to him ) He got a good deal I lost a lot of money
frown.gif
.

I now got a second LNIB SERE 2000 that according to this BF member is perfectly ground and has no flaws. We'll see how it looks in a few weeks.

I would never call Mr. Gary Fadden names but still I sould have expected a better follow-up on my problem.

Best scouting wishes from Holland,

Bagheera

------------------
 
Until a few months ago, I was unaware of the spine whack test. I have come to believe it is a valid test to ensure the knife will not accidentally close under "normal" operating circumstances. However, the definition of "normal" operating circumstances has many times been assumed by the user and not often defined by the manufacturer.

From the many knives I've examined recently, I've noted several reasons for a knife failing the spine whack test. One is the presence of excessive lubrication on the edge of the lock and/or locking face of the blade. Another is improper geomentry at the lock/blade interface. This applies to lockbacks as well as liner locks.

The excessive lubrication is usually easily corrected by the user or manufacturer. Improper geometry must be left for the manufacturer to correct.

If the knife has an edge (or other function, such as a bottle opener, fish scaler, etc.) on the side opposite the main sharpened edge, the spine whack test is most important to the user. If no such function exists, the test should be used to check for "accidental" closing.

Now, as far as the terms "normal" and "accidental" are concerned:

I've seen a photo of some fellow securing a liner-lock knife to a stick and preparing to beat the top edge of the open blade with a broomstick. This will not only test for excessive lubrication and improper geometry, it will also check to see if the lock will fold up like an accordian! Destructive tests always find the weakest point, and most folks don't know how much abuse something can take until they actually break it.

If you think you're going to use a folding knife that hard: buy one with a really thick lock, don't complain if the action seems a bit stiff, and ask the manufacturer or maker if the knife was designed to endure such extreme use. Don't buy a VW Beetle and expect it to perform like a M1A tank!

I believe the blade should be tapped against a hard surface using moderate force. If the lock is going to fail due to excessive lubrication or poor geometry, it will fail immediately. (Maybe I should call this the "spine tap" test!)

If you want a knife that won't fail if you slap it full force against a telephone pole, buy a fixed blade. (Some, not all, will pass this test.) Why not a folder? Maybe that folder might hold up to the telephone pole test 99 times and fail on the 100th try - you still lose your fingers!

I agree that the SERE looks like a heavy duty/use knife. Several people have them, use them, and like them. Give the folks at Al Mar a chance to fix the problem with your knife. If they don't, I'll be glad to hear your gripes.

------------------

Tom Anderson
Hand Crafted Knives

[This message has been edited by Tom Anderson (edited 01-17-2001).]
 
For the record, my SERE 2000 also failed the spine whack test very miserably, and very consistently. First folder I've ever owned that failed. I whacked on a rubberized mouse pad (on top of my desk) with only my hand holding the knife.

Sharp edges on thumb stud, sharp edges on liners, blade grind not quite as stout as others reported and a bit unbalanced looking compared to the rather nifty, thick, fat, secure double guard handle...??

I'll take a look at the SERE 2001 or 2002 to see if they remedied things.
 
Every production company can have a bad one slip past them, so I don't think it's fair to jugde Al Mar Knives so harshly. If you just bought it, send it back.
 
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by el cid:
Every production company can have a bad one slip past them, so I don't think it's fair to jugde Al Mar Knives so harshly. If you just bought it, send it back. </font>

El Cid, with this much smoke, you are seeing the makings of fire... you are seeing the makings of a trend here, not a one-off problem.

Test your own SERE 2000. If it passes, you lucked out. Luck isn't what I'm after in QC. Suppose I could go to a show or a knife shop and whack a bunch of SERE's to see which one I wanted to keep?

I have 30+ folders that pass the spine whack. Why tolerate a supposedly overbuild folder that doesn't, and therefore isn't suitable for it's advertised use, that of a heavy duty folder? I have one set of fingers to work with on my right hand... and my patience runs thin with companies like Al Mar who haven't and aren't keeping up.



[This message has been edited by rdangerer (edited 03-12-2001).]
 
Breadstick of a knife! LOL! Is that the sesamseed variety or the plain type?
wink.gif


I have heard a lot recently about the spine whack test failing this knife. Pity it looks very very nice. The size of the liner lock is NO indication of strenght or reliability.

One day the liner lock will be replaced by the frame lock. With a little luck! The Axis, rolling lock er al will still be available, but as Chris Reeve noted about the liner lock, it could be improved upon.

W.A.

W.A.

------------------
"To strive to seek to find and not to yield"
Tennyson
Ranger motto

A few useful details on UK laws and some nice reviews!
http://members.aol.com/knivesuk/
Certified steel snob!
Founding president and member number 1! Wana join?
 
Back
Top