Almost any knife, within reason, can be used as a bushcraft/survival knife—do you agree?

[BJE]

Not neccessarily.....
5000 year old EDC bushcraft survival knife...

Cro-MagnonCut the original MagnaCut.

 

[dmattaponi]

I agree with many of the comments here. Just about any modern knife is better than what real survivalists were using in the not too distant past. That’s not to say that certain knives aren’t better suited for certain tasks than others, but Internet, “influencers”, forums are the driving force behind this topic today. People have always overcome their natural environment and the dangerous critters living in it, using their big brains, not so much their brawn.

 

[Murphy Slaw]

Never go out in the middle of nowhere without something on your belt you can jam deep into anything that requires that sort of attention.

Bingo.

 

[Culprit99]

I just came across this thread and only quickly scanned these 7 pages, so I apologize if this has already been covered or is dis-jointed with the conversation.

The original hypothesis/statement/question:

Almost any knife, within reason, can be used as a bushcraft/survival knife—do you agree?​

My approach is to define bushcraft/survival knife with a list of requirements expected of such a knife, and then, any knife that can meet those requirements fits the bill, regardless of traditional use, marketing, etc.

My understanding of bushcraft/survival is a knife that:

- Has a (high) carbon steel that is hard enough to spark when struck with flint and can be sharpened on a smooth river rock and stropped on your leather belt if it comes to that - the idea is that the knife can be maintained indefinitely with no extra gear. Any knife capable of this can also spark a fero rod, but in my experience the term bushcraft is usually used by folks who would prefer to carry a traditional piece of flint into the bush - or find one if their local geology supports that.

- Can handle fire building. Yes, some batoning is usually needed for making fireboards, kindling, etc. so usually a fixed blade.

- The "bushcraft" element usually means you will be in the woods long enough (voluntarily or otherwise) to have a desire or need to make utensils and furniture (crafting things in the bush) - so a knife that has a blade shape conducive to carving spoons, and making wooden joinery such as mortises and tenons for stools, tables, shelters, toggles and notches for setting snares/traps, etc. That usually means a somewhat fine point for square through-holes, but not too fine that it may break while batoning. Consequently straight spines, mild spear and drop points are popular. Severe clip points are usually out.

- Can field dress and prepare game animals and fish (what knife can't?).

- Can be used for defense from wild critters. Any knife capable of the above list fits here - but this is also where dudes pull up their bushcrafted stool around their flint and steel fire and debate finger guards until the coffee or ginger root tea runs out. This is usually where the bushcrafters part ways with the survival crowd, usually because the survival crowd adds the requirement for knife-fighting other humans or a grizly bear. And that's usually where I stir the pot by bringing up Gene Moe and his Buck 110 without a finger-guard. But it did have finger grooves, so throw another log on the fire and pour me another cup of ginger root tea - we're gonna be here a while, and the night is still young.

- Has a secure sheath allowing for quick, one-handed access and re-sheathing. My impression of the thought here is that in a situation where you are working to survive in the woods (again, voluntarily or otherwise) you never want to set your tools down anywhere and risk losing them or accidentally getting hurt by them. A knife belongs in your hand or in it's sheath - never anywhere else. Consequently, when you are working to make a fireboard or a stool or something, you will be picking up and putting down your knife repetitively so a sheath that is easy to use, will be used. If the sheath is a pain to draw and re-sheath, folks are more likely to set the knife down and lose it, get hurt by it, etc.


So, anyhow, there's my two pennies' worth. That's what I think of when I think of a bushcraft/survival knife. Personally, I would add the requirement to be a full tang fixed blade knife, but there are many thin-tang knives and folders that perform all the above requirements wonderfully, so I won't add my preferences to what I believe is the generally and traditionally accepted definition of a bushcraft/survival knife.

 

[J. Doyle]

The whole concept of a "bushcraft knife" that has to be able to "perform bushcraft tasks" has to be at the top of the list of utter nonsense in the entire knife universe.

To be succinct: yes, (almost) any knife can be used for (almost) any chore that someone (arbitrarily) deems "bushcraft".

A longer answer and different perspective:

One of the biggest continual drivers, if not the origin, of the so-called "bushcraft knives" fad is a bunch of guys that didn't regularly spend time in the outdoors decided they were missing something in their lives and wanted to get back to their ancestral roots.

So they took to the woods and did fun little "bushcraft-y" stuff. But it wasn't quite fulfilling enough so for a more ultimate experience, they decided making their own "bushcraft" knife was the way.

So they researched backyard knifemaking and discovered that good ol' 1095 was cheap and available everywhere and it was super easy to heat treat at home with just a torch to get it cherry red and some used motor oil to dunk it in. Easy-peasy.

But then they discovered that being a real knifemaker is hard, especially when it comes to actually grinding blade bevels, which the HUGE majority can't do well at all.

So they turned to grinding jigs for consistency and repeatability and symmetrical blade grinds but discovered that almost all grinding jigs were limited to only producing short scandi grinds on 3"-4" blades max, otherwise the grinds get real weird, real fast due to the limitations of the jig.

So what we ended up with, was a whole bunch of wannabe knifemakers that couldn't really do it well, turning out a bunch of poorly heat-treated, scandi ground 1095 blades with super round, super fat handles with awkward contours.

And they knew they weren't that great, but rather than admit that knifemaking isn't for everyone, they made up excuses for their short comings and continued to justify them.

"Carbon steel is better because it throws sparks", "1095 is best because it's so tough", "spear points drill holes so much better" and let's not forget the biggie....."scandi grinds are SO much better for wood carving".

And sadly, a whole bunch of the general public bought into it. I guess they were much better at marketing than making knives.

Like it or not, that's a huge part of why "bushcraft" knives exist in today's knife culture.

 

[Maximumbob54]

The whole concept of a "bushcraft knife" that has to be able to "perform bushcraft tasks" has to be at the top of the list of utter nonsense in the entire knife universe.

So "IF" you were to join in on the shenanigans what would you make?

 

[Drop bear]

So "IF" you were to join in on the shenanigans what would you make?

There is a concept called a weasel words, which I think he is getting to.

It is what politicians and advertisers do to make a claim that sounds like it means something. But is so vague it means nothing.

Bushcraft is one of those words.

So to ask someone to make a Bushcraft knife becomes kind of impossible.

Like asking them to make a knife that mothers recommend.

 

[David Mary]

"Almost any knife, within reason, can be used as a bushcraft/survival knife—do you agree?"

Of course.

"Almost any knife can be used as a bushcraft/survival knife—do you agree?"

Of course not.


Just pointing out that "within reason" can make any statement true, at least until it is defined.

 

[Maximumbob54]

There is a concept called a weasel words, which I think he is getting to.

100% not my intent. He seems to be a person in the know so I would just like his input. I appreciate any input from someone that seems to know more than I do.

 

[Arathol]

One of the biggest continual drivers, if not the origin, of the so-called "bushcraft knives" fad is a bunch of guys that didn't regularly spend time in the outdoors decided they were missing something in their lives and wanted to get back to their ancestral roots.

So they took to the woods and did fun little "bushcraft-y" stuff. But it wasn't quite fulfilling enough so for a more ultimate experience, they decided making their own "bushcraft" knife was the way.

So they researched backyard knifemaking and discovered that good ol' 1095 was cheap and available everywhere and it was super easy to heat treat at home with just a torch to get it cherry red and some used motor oil to dunk it in. Easy-peasy.

But then they discovered that being a real knifemaker is hard, especially when it comes to actually grinding blade bevels, which the HUGE majority can't do well at all.

So they turned to grinding jigs for consistency and repeatability and symmetrical blade grinds but discovered that almost all grinding jigs were limited to only producing short scandi grinds on 3"-4" blades max, otherwise the grinds get real weird, real fast due to the limitations of the jig.

So what we ended up with, was a whole bunch of wannabe knifemakers that couldn't really do it well, turning out a bunch of poorly heat-treated, scandi ground 1095 blades with super round, super fat handles with awkward contours.

For those unfamiliar with this, Mors Kochanski and Ray Mears pretty much invented this silliness. Kochanski defined the "bushcraft knife" term in one of his early publications, and Mears "invented" what we now know as the bushcraft knife when he designed the Woodlore (Made by Alan Wood) in the early 1990s. Those had a 4mm thick blade with a 24° bevel more or less.

 

[Sidehill Gouger]

For those unfamiliar with this, Mors Kochanski and Ray Mears pretty much invented this silliness. Kochanski defined the "bushcraft knife" term in one of his early publications, and Mears "invented" what we now know as the bushcraft knife when he designed the Woodlore (Made by Alan Wood) in the early 1990s. Those had a 4mm thick blade with a 24° bevel more or less.

Totally agree with the Ray Mears part. "Bushcraft" as a modern sport really started in England with Ray's BBC followers. And Ray was originally a big fan of Finnish Puukkos. The Woodlore just kind of evolved out of that.

 

[Drop bear]

100% not my intent. He seems to be a person in the know so I would just like his input. I appreciate any input from someone that seems to know more than I do.

I am not suggesting anyone is doing anything to anyone.

I am highlighting a concept that gets used in conversation that people may not have considered.

And what happens is you start having two different conversations without realising it.

Bushcraft, survival, self defence.

In terms of knives. Those terms are meaningless and you cannot make a knife to fill those functions.

Splitting wood, escaping an aircraft, killing a zombie.

Are terms you could make a knife to do.

 

[J. Doyle]

So "IF" you were to join in on the shenanigans what would you make?

I wouldn't ever "join in" as far as ever calling anything a "bushcraft" knife or making a knife that I marketed specifically towards that trend. Mostly because almost all knives can be used for those things.

I make a knife I like. Someone buys it. They use it (or not) for whatever they want. If that's to whittle sticks, prepare a fire or dress game or fish, so be it.

Me personally, I've made a life in the woods with small fixed blades, usually with narrow-ish drop or clip point blades, folding pocket knives of similar blades to medium "bowie" style belt knives to, currently, a large folder with a cutlass/cleaver/k-tip style blade.

I've never once wished I had a spear point scandi grind blade instead of whatever I was carrying at the time.

 

[MolokaiRider]

The whole concept of a "bushcraft knife" that has to be able to "perform bushcraft tasks" has to be at the top of the list of utter nonsense in the entire knife universe.

To be succinct: yes, (almost) any knife can be used for (almost) any chore that someone (arbitrarily) deems "bushcraft".

A longer answer and different perspective:

One of the biggest continual drivers, if not the origin, of the so-called "bushcraft knives" fad is a bunch of guys that didn't regularly spend time in the outdoors decided they were missing something in their lives and wanted to get back to their ancestral roots.

So they took to the woods and did fun little "bushcraft-y" stuff. But it wasn't quite fulfilling enough so for a more ultimate experience, they decided making their own "bushcraft" knife was the way.

So they researched backyard knifemaking and discovered that good ol' 1095 was cheap and available everywhere and it was super easy to heat treat at home with just a torch to get it cherry red and some used motor oil to dunk it in. Easy-peasy.

But then they discovered that being a real knifemaker is hard, especially when it comes to actually grinding blade bevels, which the HUGE majority can't do well at all.

So they turned to grinding jigs for consistency and repeatability and symmetrical blade grinds but discovered that almost all grinding jigs were limited to only producing short scandi grinds on 3"-4" blades max, otherwise the grinds get real weird, real fast due to the limitations of the jig.

So what we ended up with, was a whole bunch of wannabe knifemakers that couldn't really do it well, turning out a bunch of poorly heat-treated, scandi ground 1095 blades with super round, super fat handles with awkward contours.

And they knew they weren't that great, but rather than admit that knifemaking isn't for everyone, they made up excuses for their short comings and continued to justify them.

"Carbon steel is better because it throws sparks", "1095 is best because it's so tough", "spear points drill holes so much better" and let's not forget the biggie....."scandi grinds are SO much better for wood carving".

And sadly, a whole bunch of the general public bought into it. I guess they were much better at marketing than making knives.

Like it or not, that's a huge part of why "bushcraft" knives exist in today's knife culture.

I'm with you on scandi grinds. I have tried repeatedly to use them and find a benefit, and I just don't see it.

Especially on thick stock.

 

[DangerZone98]

"Almost any knife, within reason, can be used as a bushcraft/survival knife—do you agree?"

Of course.

"Almost any knife can be used as a bushcraft/survival knife—do you agree?"

Of course not.


Just pointing out that "within reason" can make any statement true, at least until it is defined.

Almost any cat, within reason, won’t destroy your furniture. Do you agree?

Back on topic, the “within reason” part I had for the title was mostly referring to specialized knives. Fish knives, deboning knives, rectangular butcher knives, butter knives.

Today’s bushcraft knife for me is the Cold Steel mini leatherneck lol.

 

[DangerZone98]

I'm with you on scandi grinds. I have tried repeatedly to use them and find a benefit, and I just don't see it.

Especially on thick stock.

I’ve found scandi knives to be just okay. But to be honest, if my Moras had a simple full flat grind, I’d like them waaaaay more.

 

[David Mary]

Almost any cat, within reason, won’t destroy your furniture. Do you agree?

You just destroyed my argument.

 

[catspa]

My cat goes easy on the furniture, because she prefers to claw ME.

Parker

 

[itsafire]

While I would agree that whatever knife sits on your person the moment you find yourself out of doors (in the bush) automatically gets a field promotion to bushcraft knife,
I would wager that knife enthusiasts might weigh their chances of finding themselves in a bushcraft situation beforehand and if they found the likeliness high enough, would choose to carry a different knife than they might pack for a day in an urban environment.

One requirement for my EDC knife is to sit well in my pocket, because being honest, that's what it does more than 90% of my day.
One requirement for a bushcraft knife would be how well It takes the abuse of servicing as a pry tool, or to be batoned through wood .... among other outdoorsy things one does when bushcrafting but almost never when driving to the office.

A knife in a bushcraft situation can have a prominent space on my belt while having a large'ish knife dangling from there is something that is not considered best practice in an office.
My chair has arm rests and the knife could get caught there when I sit down or stand up.

 

[Cementite]

Considering that humans successfully did "bushcraft®" for millions of years with no more than napped flint or chert, I'm thinking any steel object should be a vast improvement.