Alpha Dorado 154CM or 12C27 - Best buy?

L

lupus55

Joined
Nov 21, 2009
Messages
28
I've just had the postie drop off my latest Buck. I ordered a Alpha Dorado in 154CM and the normally 100% merchant had sent me a Dorado in 12C27 Sandvik. I am not fussed enough to bother bitching about it, and left him good feedback on eBay. I did let him know in an email. Just in case the people packing the orders sent a 420 blade out to some poor devil who had paid for a 154CM.
My question is : Should I consider it a downgrade or an upgrade?
My only other blade in 12C27 seems really nice, and that is without the BOS heat treat.
 
You got one from them too? I sent a blunt message back to them about it being different than advertised, but let it slide. I did ping them on the inaccuracy of their sale in feedback, but gave positive overall. It's a gift for a recent grad so I was not too concerned about the misstep, but made sure I mentioned it. They didn't have one to send me in 154CM anyway.

My personal Alpha Dorado is the 154CM. I bought one with the 12C27 Sandvik but sent it back to buck due to a non-centered blade and weak liner lock. They told me they fixed it and "ugraded" the blade to 154CM. Sure enough, it came back from Buck with 154CM. I personally like the 154CM a bit better. Like you, I think the 12C27 is nice as well.
 
The 12C27 is a good steel and DOES get the BOS heat treat......however it is not a premium steel and not as good as the 154CM. It's pretty much the same level as 420HC.

You have a legitimate gripe and should have gotten a 20% discount from the seller to give good feedback.

I'm quite sure this is not a mistake and the seller knows what he's doing, so he shouldn't get any slack on this.
 
Both are great steels but I prefer the extra edge retention of 154CM however 12c27 has a pretty good reputation as being a very pure corrosion resistant steel that happens to be pretty tough and easy to sharpen.
 
Same thing happened to me with an Alpha Hunter from Sportsmans Warehouse. Wanted/ordered the 154CM and got the 12C27. Guess you could still consider it an upgrade from 420HC and so far it seems to be a very nice steel. Just would rather have had what I ordered.
 
hope you don't mind if I tag on a Alpha steel question. I have an 06 Bass Pro, only marking is 270 sideways T, what steel is it?
 
If the steel is not stated on the blade or box it is 420 with a few exceptions. DM
 
I have the Alhpa Dorado in both 154cm and 12c27 and prefer the latter. The 12c27 is noticeably sharper and has kept an good edge. Both steels are upgrades to 420HC IMHO.
 
guess i'm the only one here. a big downgrade. like like 12c27, but not as much as 154cm properly heat treated which i have to assume buck does it right. i've never owned a buck in 154cm, but every other buck in other steels i've owned they've done it right. so i assume this attention to quality translates right over to 154cm as well.

to me 12c27 is a good steel, but not a premium and even though the exotics are all over the place now..i still consider 154cm one of the upgrade stainless steels out there, and the manufacturers do as well as they charge a premium for it over steels like 12c27. i would complain and ask for a difference back from the price you paid vs. the market value of what you got.
 
You're not the only one.

Lots of us have spit out the Sandvik Kool-Aid. I notice that nobody is including the "M" on the end of 12C27 anymore. As far as I know it should be there. As I recall, it means "dishwasher safe." Not exactly a feature I need in a steel.

It's a good (and quite ordinary) steel like 420HC. It benefits from the BOS heat treat (like 420HC).

It ain't much different from 420HC.
 
BG42EDGE said:
You're not the only one.

Lots of us have spit out the Sandvik Kool-Aid. I notice that nobody is including the "M" on the end of 12C27 anymore. As far as I know it should be there. As I recall, it means "dishwasher safe." Not exactly a feature I need in a steel.

It's a good (and quite ordinary) steel like 420HC. It benefits from the BOS heat treat (like 420HC).

It ain't much different from 420HC.
Click to expand...

good info thanks for the follow up, Sir.

question on topic, but off slightly. in your last post before this one i am replying to, what do you mean by...." the marketing ploy is clearly working"? forgive me i'll admit i am slow sometimes. i am sure it's obvious in it's meaning, but i am missing the obvious.
 
I mean that many people are buying the notion that the 12C27 (M) is an upgrade from 420HC and some even seem to think it may be a premium steel.

Several mentions in the threads available from search here.

Not sure why this happens, maybe it's just the psychology of employing a bunch of numbers in an odd configuration. Perhaps if it really sounds exotic, some people will always think it's better than the "old" steel.
 
Sandvik produces 2 versions of 12C27. The 'M' designation applies to only one of those, which is intended for "kitchen tools", by their own description ('12C27M' has lower carbon content, higher Chromium than the standard '12C27'). Need to be careful, in assuming all '12C27' is the same. Sort of like assuming 420HC is the same as anything else designated '420'. I think most of us know better than that, right? ;)

See the site below, for comparisons of Sandvik knife steels:

http://www.sandvik.com/sandvik/0140...5b39570e82e6fe0fc12576f0002e2259?opendocument

Curiously, BOTH of the Sandvik 12C27 variants are higher in both carbon (hardenability & edge-holding) and chromium (corrosion resistance) than 420HC.

Is it an upgrade? You be the judge:

420HC (data from site: http://zknives.com/knives/steels/steelchart.php ):
Carbon = 0.46 %
Chromium = 13.0 %

12C27M (data from Sandvik site, linked above):
Carbon = 0.52 %
Chromium = 14.5 %

12C27 (data from Sandvik site, linked above):
Carbon = 0.60 %
Chromium = 13.5 %
 
Last edited:
BG42EDGE said:
I mean that many people are buying the notion that the 12C27 (M) is an upgrade from 420HC and some even seem to think it may be a premium steel.

Several mentions in the threads available from search here.

Not sure why this happens, maybe it's just the psychology of employing a bunch of numbers in an odd configuration. Perhaps if it really sounds exotic, some people will always think it's better than the "old" steel.
Click to expand...

Ahhh. Gotcha now. Makes sense. Thank you for the follow up.
 
Obsessed with Edges said:
Sandvik produces 2 versions of 12C27. The 'M' designation applies to only one of those, which is intended for "kitchen tools", by their own description ('12C27M' has lower carbon content, higher Chromium than the standard '12C27'). Need to be careful, in assuming all '12C27' is the same. Sort of like assuming 420HC is the same as anything else designated '420'. I think most of us know better than that, right? ;)

See the site below, for comparisons of Sandvik knife steels:

http://www.sandvik.com/sandvik/0140...5b39570e82e6fe0fc12576f0002e2259?opendocument

Curiously, BOTH of the Sandvik 12C27 variants are higher in both carbon (hardenability & edge-holding) and chromium (corrosion resistance) than 420HC.

Is it an upgrade? You be the judge:

420HC (data from site: http://zknives.com/knives/steels/steelchart.php ):
Carbon = 0.46 %
Chromium = 13.0 %

12C27M (data from Sandvik site, linked above):
Carbon = 0.52 %
Chromium = 14.5 %

12C27 (data from Sandvik site, linked above):
Carbon = 0.60 %
Chromium = 13.5 %
Click to expand...

Not enough difference in the numbers to make a difference.

One actual difference is that the finer-grained structure of the Sandvik is such that it may take a slightly finer edge (although that difference would be short-lived in real-world use).

The Sandvik also lends itself better to use in thinner blades, so it may have a slight advantage over 420HC in the lighter, thinner, slicer type of blade.

Otherwise, there's hardly any real difference as far as I can see.

Buck has been pretty quiet about the 12C27M, but I doubt that they are terribly unhappy if people have somehow gotten the notion that the 12C27M is an upgrade steel, though. That's good for business because they can charge more for it and get away with it.

For some, at least, there's a certain magic in cramming a whole bunch of letters and numbers together in a steel name.
 
I'll have to agree with BG on this one. While I found it takes a very keen edge, it performed pretty much identical to the 420 through hard use,ie cutting sod and wood , it dulls about as fast as 420. Sharpens about the same, and seems to be about as malleable. Not even in the same ballpark as the 154cm !
 
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