Am I the only one?

empty5853

empty5853

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I don't know if this is the proper place to post this or not but here goes.

I've been thinking about this for awhile now and I just want to know if I'm the only one this bothers?

Here's the scenario. you order a custom knife from someone and they don't give you a completion date. Month after month goes by. Still no knife or date or much if any communication. THEN, you see them post knives they've made for sale on here and the other KF. I see this at least 2 or 3 times a month. That piss's me off:mad:
They're to busy to finish MY KNIFE yet they have time to make knives to sell on here:confused:

I understand that you can't work on a knife from "cradle to grave". I understand that there's downtime because of heat treating, ordering material, finishes drying, etc, etc. . When that happens, I would expect them to jump on the next custom knife in line. And when they're at a stop work on that one, go to the next custom, and so on but NOT TO WORK ON SOMETHING TO SELL ON THE FORUMS!!!
That tells me that they have very little regard for their backlogged customers.

Oh yes, the ones that come up for sale here are very nice and at a good price. So the people that buy them are thrilled to death on what a beautiful knife they just snagged. Mean while us "customers" that have put orders in are waiting and waiting with no end in site.

I know a lot of makers here won't agree. They'll accuse me of being insensitive and tell me that they (knifemakers) have a home life with family duties and other obligations. I agree with that guys, I really do and there’s no one that understands about family and health coming first more then I do but my complaint is that if family and other things aren’t enough to interfere with you making knives to sell here and at gun & knife shows, why is it enough to interfere with you completing my custom knife you agreed to do over 16 months ago?

That’s my rant for the month. Just wanted to see if I’m being unreasonable in my expectations or not.

Vr
Mark T.
 
Mark,
Have you communicated your concern with the knifemaker about whom you speak?
Frankly, there are a couple of collectors with whom I have had a less than fun time working with from whom I would not want another order, and one who, because of experiences other makers have had, I don't want to do business with.
Yet is difficult for me to just say, "I don't want your business"....and as I get along fine with the vast majority of customers and dealers I have done business, I tend to think I am not a bad person to so many, therfore why didn't it or would it work, with so very few.
As they say, first time shame on the other person (who treated you unfairly), the second time shame on me....for allowing there to be a 2nd time.
By the way I had a similar experience of being on a makers waiting list for a number of years for a particular knife I wanted. I finally got the message that he really apparently didn't want to make that particular pattern...bought something else from him that I like even better than the original pattern I asked for...and he never could tell me that he just didn't want to make that particular knife....but he apparently didn't....no hard feelings and turned out best anyhow.
A number of makers have a really hard time communicating in any negative manner about maybe the pattern, the material, or a variety of things with a customer. Maybe that is the problem with your maker. Also a number of makers would rather make what they want the try to sell it than take an order for a specific pattern... maybe that is a concern....also anumber of makers pay a year ahead of time to attend shows, and they are expensive to do so you better have knives to sell....
Now that I have mentioned a bunch of "maybes", I don't think I solved anything but maybe gave you some reasons to discuss with the maker in question....Oh and I don't think you are being unreasonable in your expectations for better communications from your knifemaker.
 
I don't know about knifemakers selling knives while you're still waiting for yours...it could be due to all kinds of reasons.
Maybe he was making a knife for someone and just as he completed it, the buyer backed out of the deal.
So then he has a completed knife that he needs to sell.
Who knows?

But I do believe that an experienced knifemaker should be able to give you some kind of timeframe for the completion of a knife.
Not to the very day, or the very week, and maybe not even to the exact month....but he should be able to pin it down within two or three months.

I would never make a deal if the knifemaker could not give me ANY timeframe.
 
If everything you said is true, I'd be pissed to.
Don't worry though, there's LOTS of other knifemakers out there, and I'm sure they could make you something similar.
If you want me to help you out, email the name of this particular maker, and I'll send you a list of makers that already make knives in a simliar style.
I will not mention this maker publically.
Good Luck!
 
I can have any number of knives on the bench at any given time. Some might be orders while others might simply be something that I created on a whim or a creative buzz. While orders are always priority over experimentation, there are some times when sitting to do intricate filework simply isnt as appealing as griding or working with hot steel. I find that my best work comes as a byproduct of motivation. I work on what apsects of the various stages of completion that appeal to me most at the time I am working...i wouldnt want to "push" something like filework just to get a knife done and have quality suffer as a result...

Also, a good knifemaker needs to "stay out there"...it would be easy for a knifemaker with a one year wait time to disappear off the face of the earth and devote 100% of time to orders, but by the time he finished those orders, he might have no more orders coming in since he was invisble to the public all that time.

Keeping knives on the selling block is a maker's advertisement. its an integral part of their business and makers cant necessarily be expected to drop everything they are doing when an order comes in.

I finish orders in the same timeframe that i have planned for knives in my head unless someone specifically wants a knife by a certain date.

Tough to generalize, though....some makers might simply ignore a custom request for whatever reason. Thats bad business. A maker should be able to give you an estime, then a followup estime half way in....if they can't, something is wrong IMHO....
 
I have not gotten a custom knife yet, but have been dabbling with the idea of getting my first for several weeks. Up until today, I considered myself very close to asking someone to make a knife for me. I have done a fair amount of research, reviewed more styles and pics than I could ever remember, and was really trying to narrow things down, and thought I was doing so successfully. But now this thread makes me very reluctant because I don't know who the maker is that the original poster is having an issue with, and I sure don't want to deal with him/her based on the original poster's side of the story. Of course, by not naming the maker, he/she has no opportunity to respond. I understand how it might be a little like complaining to the chef before you order desert, but c'mon folks -- isn't that what this whole sub-forum is about? Name the maker and give him/her the courtesy of being able to explain what is going on.

If I was a knife maker, I would WANT to hear about the criticisms people had of me, my business acumen, and my products, just to name a few things. It would help me to be a better knife-maker. So far, here, this person doesn't even get a chance! And as for the ultimate effect of not naming this person, I'll bet I am not the only person here that this thread will have a chilling effect on. It will impact all custom knife-makers, especially since (if the second post is true) this does not seem like an isolated, once in a lifetime type of occurance.

Can we get a name please?
 
I think you should look for a couple of things, first is the time estimate (and realize this is an estimate). Second, as stated, a lot of makers will dedicate x% of their shop time to other than custom orders (shows, sales to forums, whatever) but they should tell you up front that they make say 1/3 of thier knives for this purpose. These points of information should be easily available to you.

I think that Les Robertson did an article about getting on a waiting list in one of the last couple issues of Blade. His recommendations would be a good one for you to follow when ordering (or selling for that matter), as he comes at the issue from both sides, with how to protect yourself.

Mark, have you talked to the maker yet? Ask him what you asked here. Ask for a date and why these knives are going ahead of your order. Ask him his policy and see where you are.

--Carl
 
I just went through this for the first time. I placed an order with a maker who usually takes 3-4 months, 6 months before I needed it (as a birthday present to myself) so I figured it would definitely be ready on time. It's now been 9 months and it's just about finished. Somebody else ordered the same knife during that time and got it in about a month or so, you can imagine I wasn't too happy about that. I don't know why a maker would make other people's knives first who place their orders later, but I agree that it can be pretty frustrating.
 
not sure how often this happens but i bet some of the knives sold on the forums, etc. are knives that were made for someone else and the customer backed out. of the few customs that i ordered, maybe 1 maker wanted a deposit. this makes it very easy for someone to back out of a custom months down to road because their tastes changed or whatever. thus the maker has a finished knife and nobody to sell it to, so they come here, etc. i highly doubt makers intentionally make you wait...
 
Hi Price,

You made some excellent points. The article that you gave Les credit for writing was actually written by Dan Magrino (current issue of Blade). He did however quote Les in that article. In that same issue Les wrote an article on DB Fraley and was quoted in another article as well. Its easy to get confused.

WWG
President
Arbitrage Custom Knives.
 
Sorry about the mis-attribution, I have read Les say the same things many times and must of gotten it confused in my head. I didn't have the magazine handy at the time.

I personally think that communication is the most valuable asset in this situation. For both the maker and the buyer. Anyway, read the article edge, I think in most situations you will be OK, but following the advice given will help you up your chances.

Thanks again WWG for the correction, I do want to give credit where it is due.

--Carl
 
the fact that smiths sometimes make stuff for shows/etc when they have a long waiting list is nothing new.

i know a smith who shall remain nameless who is so far behind on orders he hasnt taken any since '99 or so yet always has knives at shows, i know this one doesnt need the $$ either, i guess they wanna keep there name out there/keep interest up/provide a few lucky folks with knives.

of course if ya have been waiting for yrs it makes ya wonder "WTF"???
 
I really don't care how many knives a maker makes as long as my knife is delivered somewhere near the estimated delivery date. I would never order a knife from a maker that couldn't/wouldn't give me an estimate of when I would get the knife.

As far as naming the maker, I personally don't think that is necessary. I am not in the least bit concerned that it could be a maker that I am thinking of purchasing a knife from. That is because, as I have already stated, I would never order a knife from a maker that couldn't/wouldn't give me an estimate of when I would get the knife.

Communication is to me the most important part of the deal. I have cancelled orders because makers would not keep me informed about what is going on. There are way too many makers that handle themselves in a professional manner to ever consider dealing with those that don't.
 
on_the_edge said:
I have not gotten a custom knife yet, but have been dabbling with the idea of getting my first for several weeks. Up until today, I considered myself very close to asking someone to make a knife for me. I have done a fair amount of research, reviewed more styles and pics than I could ever remember, and was really trying to narrow things down, and thought I was doing so successfully. But now this thread makes me very reluctant because I don't know who the maker is that the original poster is having an issue with, and I sure don't want to deal with him/her based on the original poster's side of the story. Of course, by not naming the maker, he/she has no opportunity to respond. I understand how it might be a little like complaining to the chef before you order desert, but c'mon folks -- isn't that what this whole sub-forum is about? Name the maker and give him/her the courtesy of being able to explain what is going on.

If I was a knife maker, I would WANT to hear about the criticisms people had of me, my business acumen, and my products, just to name a few things. It would help me to be a better knife-maker. So far, here, this person doesn't even get a chance! And as for the ultimate effect of not naming this person, I'll bet I am not the only person here that this thread will have a chilling effect on. It will impact all custom knife-makers, especially since (if the second post is true) this does not seem like an isolated, once in a lifetime type of occurance.

Can we get a name please?
Click to expand...


No I won't "name names" and here's why.

I'm not looking to sling mud on this knifemaker. He’s not a Steve Corkum or a Dale Chudzinski or any other number of knifemakers that have been mentioned on here that people have had trouble with. As I said he’s sold a number of knives on here and still does. The people that buy them are very happy with the knives and with him. What good would it do to blast him here?
For one, that’s not going to get me my knife any sooner. And it will just cause a flame war with all of the people who have bought his knives and are happy with the deal.
And, at this point, I’m not looking to cause him any problems, especially on a public forum.

As far as “his side of the story”. I’m sure he has a very reasonable side of the story. He’s told me a little of it in the few emails I’ve had in the last year and a half.

On the edge - I understand where you’re coming from. .You don’t want to make any mistakes in ordering a custom knife. None of us do. And believe me I’m not trying to be “coy” or “sly” or “devious” here. But I take it very seriously about a person’s reputation and just because I have an issue with him doesn’t mean that other people do.
If you want some names of custom knifemakers that I have done business with that are fantastic. I’ll be happy to supply you with them.

My point Gentleman and I didn’t state it very well is the frustration in continually seeing him post new knives for sale when mine sits unfinished. I guess I could email him and call him on it but then would that get me my knife any faster? I don’t think so.
I could cancel my order and ask for the money I already sent him but that doesn’t get me my knife either and I’d have to start over with another maker. At this point I’m not out a lot of money just time and aggravation.

Hind sight is always 20/20 right. My fault (and yes, I do have fault here) in this whole story is that I didn’t pin him down on a timeframe. That’s the lesson to be learned from all of this in my book.
It's been said here on the forum, time and time again, by people who are much more knowledgeable about having custom knives made "get the money issue & the time frame upfront before any deal is made".

Thanks everybody for your replies. As always, your incite is invaluable.

Best Regards.

Mark T.
 
empty5853 said:
I guess I could email him and call him on it but then would that get me my knife any faster? I don’t think so.
I could cancel my order and ask for the money I already sent him but that doesn’t get me my knife either and I’d have to start over with another maker. At this point I’m not out a lot of money just time and aggravation.
Click to expand...
Maybe it would get you your knife faster. Maybe your order fell between the cracks, and this guy doesn't know you're alive, or have an order, unless you contact him. It happens.
Call or email and ask. 16 months in...do you think it's going to get you your knife any slower?
 
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