An idea......(Annual BFC Traditional)...

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I wanted to address a few points raised by eisman. First, if "donations" were required to participate in the voting process, I'm sure less people would participate in the vote thus making it easier for any one individual to control the final knife configuration. As such, that system defeats the concept of a democratic process and would probably turn more members off to the idea of an annual knife, feeling that their votes didn't "count."

I wouldn't be opposed to a surcharge on the knives for a charity but I think focus would then need to be on keeping production costs down to ensure more people have an opportunity to participate. I think the slow sales this year were due primarily to the price (remember the Congress Jack was a strong runner-up for the 2012 knife so in theory sales should have been on par w/ that knife). It's also important to remember that the 2012 and 2013 knives were basically new designs for GEC so we might have subsidized the tooling costs. Perhaps if we limited the selection to well-established patterns like the #15, #85, #66, etc and a few simple blade and scale choices, we could keep costs under the $100 target. Mike (knifeswapper) has been able to bring his GEC SFO's to market consistently under $100. We could rotate patterns every year to keep things fresh. It's certainly do-able.

Just my $0.01 (I haven't been here as long so my opinion counts less :D:rolleyes:) Thanks for listening.
 
Applaud the idea in theory.
Don't see the relevance to the annual knife .
Already donate to several charities here.
I'm one of those saps who followed the "don't vote if you don't buy rule". I voted I bought. I definitely don't want to pay for voting.
Sorry, but if this goes ahead I'm out and will purchase one of the other new knives that seem to pop up quite regularly over which I'm licking my lips before we've even started the 2014
I don't see the connection.
I would rather simply make a donation to a registered international charity under the name Bladeforums Traditionals.
But as Duncan said are we simply donating to help pay the rent on a flash office over looking the harbour somewhere?
 
What if the coordinator of the knife for the year got to pick the charity the money was donated to(obviously a vetted charity, some fly by night organization)?

It would be a nice way to recognize the hard work that gets put in. I personally like a "pay to vote" functionality. If you have say even 10 polls, as the voting parties are visible, it would be difficult to "control the vote" as it were and there would be a maximum "tax" of $10.00 as mentioned before.

It has LONG annoyed me that people who have no intention of purchasing the finished knife muck up the results by voting.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
For me, charitable giving is a very personal thing. Tying it to the forum knife is a turn off. Count me out.
 
I like the idea, always figured buying the BF knife supported bladeforums but I'm getting lately that it really doesn't, shame, still I like watching it happen and waiting for the knives, getting them...then having to sell them for cash.

be nice if buying them did some good first :)
 
I like the idea of giving to charity, but I don't think it should be "mandatory". Some members are watching every penny, and the forum knife may just be their only purchase of the year. If people wanted to give extra toward a charitable contribution, that's fine, but it should be voluntary.

Glenn
 
Since I am satisfied with my charitable donations for the year, I would rather figure out a way to make the annual knife-deciding process more streamlined, and less stressful. I prefer to not add another level of complication. It has turned into a for-profit effort albeit, supporting BF. But it is still a headache for those doing the behind-the-scenes work.
As a famous Goatherd said, "It is like trying to herd cats!!"
Been there a few times, done that a few times.
I have to admire the way it is done on another Forum group on the internet - The guy who runs the site has a really nice knife made, sells it for a really nice price, and even gives a few away! But he is a traditionalist like the rest of us!
 
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As far as the charitable contributions go, I don't care one way or another. A charitable donation wouldn't dissuade me from buying the forum knife.

As far as voting on the forum knife and then not purchasing: I've voted and not purchased simply because I didn't like the final choice of knife shape and/or blades. I imagine there are many others who feel the same. But I would not pay to cast a vote on the forum knife.

I do like Glenn's idea of not making the donation mandatory. That would give participants a more appropriate freedom of choice. For example, I much prefer to donate to local charities, within my community. But I might make the donation regardless...
 
waynorth said:
Since I am satisfied with my charitable donations for the year, I would rather figure out a way to make the annual knife-deciding process more streamlined, and less stressful. I prefer to not add another level of complication. It has turned into a for-profit effort albeit, supporting BF. But it is still a headache for those doing the behind-the-scenes work.
As a famous Goatherd said, "It is like trying to herd cats!!"
Been there a few times, done that a few times.
I have to admire the way it is done on another Forum group on the internet - The guy who runs the site has a really nice knife made, sells it for a really nice price, and even gives a few away! But he is a traditionalist like the rest of us!
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Quoted because you're bang on the money Charlie. With age comes wisdom! ;) :) :thumbup:

Personally, with the way things have been this year (will it happen, won't it happen), I think the discussion about adding a charitable donation is like having a discussion about the deckchair arrangement on The Titanic!
 
Cisco Kid said:
As far as the charitable contributions go, I don't care one way or another. A charitable donation wouldn't dissuade me from buying the forum knife.

As far as voting on the forum knife and then not purchasing: I've voted and not purchased simply because I didn't like the final choice of knife shape and/or blades. I imagine there are many others who feel the same. But I would not pay to cast a vote on the forum knife.

I do like Glenn's idea of not making the donation mandatory. That would give participants a more appropriate freedom of choice. For example, I much prefer to donate to local charities, within my community. But I might make the donation regardless...
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This, I couldn't have said it better.
 
Regarding the voting and not buying concept - what if your votes are in the minority, and the resulting knife designed by committee isn't something you are interested in owning? Or what if the end result is very similar to a knife you already have and don't want or need another similar to?

I don't know what goes on behind the scenes, but eventually it become a business transaction between the purchasers, and Spark, who is in the business of selling knives. He may be taking a loss, or just covering his costs, or making a profit (which I'm fine with), but in the end he's the one who will have to deal with all of the paypal transactions and keeping track of the contribution to whatever charity is selected.

You could always opt for a check box on the final order form to "add $xx for such-and-such charity" and have it be strictly voluntary. But again, it would be up to Spark whether he wants to deal with the additional hassle. Maybe your best starting point for such a conversation would be him.
 
Great intentions, really bad idea.....K.I.S.S.
I think Spark is a very pragmatic fellow, throw more complications at him and he might just think it's not worth it.
 
Kohai999 said:
It has LONG annoyed me that people who have no intention of purchasing the finished knife muck up the results by voting.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
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I was going to purchase one of the 2013 knives, until I saw the choice of scales. Now, having seen the finished product, I might get one on the secondary market, but it was not my first choice, I'll probably wait for the regular production pattern from GEC.

I'm sure there are a few out there that were inent on getting the 2013 collaboration at first, such as myself. I'm sure there were some with reservations, until they saw what the knife would look like, before the factory order was placed. I don't thiink that asking people to pay for voting rights is a good idea, I can see the theory behind it, but don't agree with it. I think it will actually turn people off of buying any forum knives altogether.

As far as a charity, I think it is a great idea, in theory. However, many may be overextended on the knife itself, and while 2.00 bucks will not make or break anyone, some may just cancel the whole order. There are arguments over the design/steel/scales/size etc, there would be arguments over the charity, even if it was the National Knife Museum or the AKTI. While I think this is a great idea, I don't think that it is right to tie charitable donations into the purchase of a knife, in effect forcing someone to make a donation just to get a knife. Not to say it has never been done in the realm of knives.

As others have said, at what point does Spark just throw his hands up and say "I'm done.". Even if you have the money for the project, once Spark pulls out, it is no longer the BF forum knife. Our MODs have said in this thread it is a hassle, we don't want to burn any bridges.
 
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Kohai999 said:
I personally like a "pay to vote" functionality.

It has LONG annoyed me that people who have no intention of purchasing the finished knife muck up the results by voting.

STeven Garsson
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Really?????? Pay to vote!!!! Heck of an idea. Let's make this as complicated as we can. Just look at the angst this thread is already creating. That alone ought'a be enoug to quash this idea.

Maybe you'd be surprised at how many people moan and groan, vote, moan and groan, vote, and then moan and groan again about the final selection/choice and lo and behold actually buy the current year's forum knife. Gee, I don't know anyone that would do that but I'd bet there's at least one.:rolleyes:

I hope the powers that be put this idea on the cradle just as someone would put their phone on the cradle when they get an unsolicited phone call to donate their money for some touchy-feely cause.
 
The masses have spoken. I will let this thread speak for itself without editorial.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
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