Andrew Demko's lock tests

Kwon Kwang

Kwon Kwang

Joined
Jul 7, 2013
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2,807
What do you guys think of Andrew Demko's lock tests?

[video=youtube;6eFuENF5c08]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6eFuENF5c08[/video]

I love my much-carried PM2, so I was pretty salty over the results. Still, the test appears genuine and fair; I don't know what to say about it other than that.
 
These tests are so infuriating. I have used knives for years, and literally never had an actual spine whack happen accidentally. You are testing the knife against something it will never experience unless you are dangerously incompetent.
 
I'm happy someone is doing testing. I'm happier to see in more recent vids Mr. Demko started giving the results in inch pounds. I would be happier still if both knives involved were tested to failure and I would find the spine whacking bit much more interesting if they used something like a modified Charpy tester to give hard numbers on what kind of impact it took to break the locks as well as how much weight they could hold.
 
To be honest with you, I carry and use nothing but lightweight folders for lightweight needs. So Andrew Demko's lock tests are meaningless to me. Having said that, the Spyderco PM2 is a knife I'd be willing to carry except for one fatal flaw that has nothing to do with its lock strength. It's too wide. I like low profile knives (e.g., Spyderco Southard and Spyderco Centofante Memory . . . just to name a couple of Spydercos I do carry). Most Spydercos including the PM2 don't fall into that category due to the real estate required to incorporate the Spyderhole.
 
dkb45 said:
These tests are so infuriating. I have used knives for years, and literally never had an actual spine whack happen accidentally. You are testing the knife against something it will never experience unless you are dangerously incompetent.
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The tests show strengths and weaknesses of knives relative to each other. In that sense, they are valuable to those people who care that a linerlock or a framelock are weak sh1t compared to the Tri-Ad lock or the Axis lock.

Of course very very few people will ever use their folders in such a way that it matters. My most used folder is a Spyderco Military, and it wouldn't last 10 seconds in Demko's tests. I know this, and it doesn't change my opinion of this knife. At the same time, I love my Cold Steels for their ruggedness and (relative) indestructability.
So it's all good. I have a Spyderco Pacific Salt with a weak back lock. But it's more than sufficient for whatever I ask of it. I don't think less of the knife because it wouldn't stand up to any of the abuse Demko puts all those knives thru. But I also like some folders to be tanks. That's when I use or buy a Cold Steel or a Benchmade.
 
philwar said:
Of course very very few people will ever use their folders in such a way that it matters.
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Exactly. :thumbup: And I'd argue that the people who don't use their folders that way are just fine with a liner lock or a framelock or a compression lock or a ball lock or an Axis-lock or a button lock or a lockback or . . . perish the thought . . . no lock at all. To my way of thinking, the Tri-Ad lock is a solution in search of a problem that really doesn't exist.
 
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philwar said:
The tests show strengths and weaknesses of knives relative to each other. In that sense, they are valuable to those people who care that a linerlock or a framelock are weak sh1t compared to the Tri-Ad lock or the Axis lock.

Of course very very few people will ever use their folders in such a way that it matters. My most used folder is a Spyderco Military, and it wouldn't last 10 seconds in Demko's tests. I know this, and it doesn't change my opinion of this knife. At the same time, I love my Cold Steels for their ruggedness and (relative) indestructability.
So it's all good. I have a Spyderco Pacific Salt with a weak back lock. But it's more than sufficient for whatever I ask of it. I don't think less of the knife because it wouldn't stand up to any of the abuse Demko puts all those knives thru. But I also like some folders to be tanks. That's when I use or buy a Cold Steel or a Benchmade.
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I like this post a lot. Puts things into perspective in a great way. Thanks!:thumbup:

bld522 said:
To be honest with you, I carry and use nothing but lightweight folders for lightweight needs. So Andrew Demko's lock tests are meaningless to me. Having said that, the Spyderco PM2 is a knife I'd be willing to carry except for one fatal flaw that has nothing to do with its lock strength. It's too wide. I like low profile knives (e.g., Spyderco Southard and Spyderco Centofante Memory . . . just to name a couple of Spydercos I do carry). Most Spydercos including the PM2 don't fall into that category due to the real estate required to incorporate the Spyderhole.
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Well, I like your taste. I hope to get my hands on a Memory myself before they're all gone.
I think it makes sense for Cold Steel to focus so much on lock strength since their target market is LEOs, military and martial artists far more than regular EDC Joe.
 
Yep. Better hurry if you want one. I don't think the Memory was ever a very popular model and I'd be surprised if dealers have many of them in inventory. They are, however, one of Spyderco's underappreciated models in my view. They might have sold better if Spyderco had used M390 instead of VG-10. ;)
 
bld522 said:
Exactly. :thumbup: And I'd argue that the people who don't use their folders that way are just fine with a liner lock or a framelock or a compression lock or a ball lock or an Axis-lock or a button lock or a lockback or . . . perish the thought . . . no lock at all. To my way of thinking, the Tri-Ad lock is a solution in search of a problem that really doesn't exist.
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I don't agree with that last sentence. I accept that you and many others don't use any folder in a way that a peanut couldn't take. But there are plenty of people who will use a folder for tasks perhaps more suitable for a fixed blade... if they think that folder can take it. I've never understood the insistence that there is no need for an overbuilt reliable folder like a Recon 1 or even a 4 Max. I don't own any slip joints but do most other lock types. Don't really have a favorite one. There is a place for all of them. I'd never limit myself in my choices if there wasn't a very compelling reason for it. And the Tri-Ad lock has enriched the world of folding knives, just like the Axis lock before it, and the RIL before that.
 
I've yet to encounter anyone who claimed that, had it not been for the strength of their Tri-Ad lock, they would surely have injured themselves with their folder during actual use. But if you say so . . .
 
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bld522 said:
I've yet to encounter anyone who claimed that, had it not been for the strength of their Tri-Ad lock, they would surely have injured themselves with their folder during actual use. But if you say so . . .
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If I say so what?
 
I enjoy watching those test just to see the results. I once had my manix 2 close on me due to what was pretty much a mild spine whack during use. The situation was reaching into a tight area that I had limited visibility causing the back of the blade to thump against an unyielding surface. The knife closed on my fingers cutting two (index enough to bleed middle just lightly scored) . After getting cut I lightly spine whacked the knife onto the rubber sole of my shoe ,it indeed closed again and almost got me again!
I took the knife apart cleaned and oiled it ,now it does not close like this anymore and I have no idea what caused it. I carry my manix2 nearly every day and now trust it completely but only after testing it because of the incident.
 
I don't pay much attention to these sorts of tests. There is much more to a knife than its lock. Lock needs to be adequate with some buffer against abnormal failure, but good companies like Spyderco know how to do that. Steel needs to be good for cutting and edge durability, grind needs to be suitable for desired tasks, and heat treat need to be good, etc. I have no problem with CS doing the tests, nor with CS quality, but I sure don't buy their knives just because of lock strength.
 
I think it would be interesting to run a poll to see where lock strength scores among the attributes you just mentioned. I'd throw in a couple of more attributes like ergos and aesthetics. Then you'd have a pretty complete list, I think. You could title the poll something like, "what's the most important attribute of a folding knife to you?" Sounds like fun, doesn't it? :)
 
If by that you're referring to comparative lock strength tests, I'd have to agree.
 
bld522 said:
If you say the Tri-Ad lock has enriched the world of folding knives, for you it has. :)
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Yes, for me and judging by the sales, hundreds of thousands of others. How can anyone dispute that more options is better?
 
bld522 said:
I think it would be interesting to run a poll to see where lock strength scores among the attributes you just mentioned. I'd throw in a couple of more attributes like ergos and aesthetics. Then you'd have a pretty complete list, I think. You could title the poll something like, "what's the most important attribute of a folding knife to you?" Sounds like fun, doesn't it? :)
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I think that's a good idea. And as you may have gathered from my posts in this thread, lock strength is not the top priority in my knife buying decision. But now Cold Steel offers knives that are good cutters, have good ergos, premium steel AND the strongest most reliable lock. Now it really all just comes down to aesthetics... i.e. taste, something there's no arguing about.
 
So is it safe to say that Cold Steel has climbed to the pinnacle of cutlery perfection for you . . . with the possible exception of aesthetics, of course?
 
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