Another newbie question, different style though.

lechatchileh ariber said:
I guess you've translated it for me :)
...Where would be a good place to get like a 4 or 5 by 1 or 2 inch, piece to try out?
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Are you talking about a knife, or just a piece of steel so you can make a knife. Also, where are you located? That will help determine where you will be able to get a knife or steel from.

-Adam
 
Adam Reese said:
Are you talking about a knife, or just a piece of steel so you can make a knife. Also, where are you located? That will help determine where you will be able to get a knife or steel from.

-Adam
Click to expand...

I would rather a knife, thin blade with a straight edge.
I'm in new haven ct.
Thx
 
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For those who aren't familiar with this subject, the shochet ( kosher butcher) uses a shechita ( also shehitah - ritual kosher slaughter) knife called a challif (hallif) to perform kosher slaughter. This is done under the supervision and inspection of a rabbi. The cut must be quick and clean as well as painless as possible. The rules of the slaughter are very strict and any variance or error renders the animal un-usable.

The standard challif today are made by grinding the blade ( stock removal), but some are forged. There are specific rules about smoothness, edge condition, and length. the main rule is that the edge must be flawless...even a microscopic nick will make the slaughtered animal traifa ( un-kosher).

There are several Jewish smiths who specialize in making challif, but any knife that is sharpened and polished to the degree that will pass inspection is allowed. Several makers here in Shop talk make these knives.

Sharpening challif is similar to sharpening Japanese knives. The edge is refined and polished in a continuous succession of grits, ending with a perfect edge. Taking the surface to a grit of 100,000 is not unknown, but most are around 16,000 to 25,000 grit finish.

Shalom -Stacy
 
How about 52100? It will take a very fine edge if properly heat treated, has good toughness, and can be sharpened easier than many high speed / stainless steels. You could also get a knife with a San Mai blade of 52100 and 410 / 416 stainless, so you'd have the attributes of 52100 for the cutting edge and the corrosion resistance of the stainless steel.
 
I would personally put 52100 over 440c for toughness, but a lot depends on the edge / blade geometry and the individual heat treatment of the blade.
 
lechatchileh ariber said:
The only current manufacturers that I know are jewish people;
Some of the names are lublinsky in israel www.lublinsky.co.il
In america there's a guy named moshe yurman, I think he makes them himself. There is also isamar kosherknife.com but I think his steel is a little soft (hones quite quick and dulls just as fast) unless he's improved his quality since I bought mine.
I don't know what steels they use.
Then we have the two 'godfathers' of kosher knives, j.d miller (I believe he made some tools for the us military in WWII), and mr vitkin, who both died with their recipies and techniques (nobody wanted to pay their prices), I've personally never had a knife from either of them.
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Hello lechatchileh ariber, I am a shochet-in-training and was very fortunate to recently acquire 2 JD miller knives and one Vitkin knife, along with two older Lublinsky knives. While learning shechitah I have developed a deeper interest in metals and knife making process in particular. I came across this forum while researching different metals and saw your posts. Did you ever find out what steel was used by JD Miller? i am very curious as those knives are truly superior to the Yurman knife that I also used. Also, in one of your posts you wrote that you had emailed Lublinsky to find out what steel they use, did you get an answer? I would be very interested to learn more. you can email me directly at simonkalen@hotmail.com
Thank you.
 
Shalom Simon,
This thread is over six years old. Not likely to get any response.
The original poster hasn't been here since asking his questions. Frankly, I can't imagine a shochet asking the questions he asked.
I'll leave this thread open, as someone may be interested in the subject of challif and shehita.

When pulling up a thread in searches or just looking around when you first become a member look at the date of the first and last several posts to see if it is a current thread. If it is old, it is best to start a new thread and link the old one.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
Shalom Simon,
This thread is over six years old. Not likely to get any response.
The original poster hasn't been here since asking his questions. Frankly, I can't imagine a shochet asking the questions he asked.
I'll leave this thread open, as someone may be interested in the subject of challif and shehita.

When pulling up a thread in searches or just looking around when you first become a member look at the date of the first and last several posts to see if it is a current thread. If it is old, it is best to start a new thread and link the old one.
Click to expand...

Shalom Stacy, and thank you for responding. From reading your posts from that thread you seem to have some knowledge of challafim and shehita. I am very new to this but would love to learn about the bladesmith art. There seems to be so much info out there and it would be quite easy to get confused, what would you recommend as a starting point to learn about various types of metal, heat-treatment, etc.?
 
Larrin Thomas' new book is a great source of steel and HT info. Larrin is a regular contributor here. Reading his many threads is a great way to get a free course in metallurgy.

https://www.bladehq.com/item--Knife...,kinds of other subjects we knife folks study.

There are a bunch of smiths and knifemakers up you way. Covid has stopped meetings and hammer-ins, but getting with the local knife makers associations will find people near you who can help you learn.

From what I have learned, the challif has to be from an approved source. Not any old knife will be allowed. Most (maybe all) of them are made by known Jewish smiths who follow the kosher rules. What many non-kosher folks don't know is that even the polish and tools used have to meet kosher requirements. I believe that a shochet could make his own challif if he was skilled and had passed all his testing and requirements to be fully approved shochet. I would ask the senior rabbi at the Slaughterhouse for his opinion.

An interesting aside is that when I repaired and rebuilt all the rimonim and other alter things at Temple Israel I had to use specific materials and methods in order for the result to be "kosher" ( not the right term, but you know what I mean). The polish was the most important thing to assure it was kosher.

Just to be clear about who I am, I am not Jewish. I have been a part of that community most of my life and many members of the local synagogues think I am Jewish. I actually was give a bar mitzvah at age 65 in Temple Israel by the rabbi back when I did the repairs. He gave me the seat under the wonderful stained glass window of the seraphim to pray at. This seat is not used normally, as it is on the side of the alter area. He felt an angel with a sword and flames was appropriate. I am the only non-Jewish member of the congregation. Part of the confusion may come from things like my wedding band, which I hand made, and it says אני לדודי ודודי לי .
 
Thank you for your input Stacy. Your story and how you came to be so "Jewish" is fascinating :) I am glad we were able to connect. What part of Virginia are you from? I am looking to move out of NY and am searching for an area with milder winters and with an orthodox jewish community. Virginia sound attractive in terms of climate but I don't know much about Jewish life and communities there.
 
Norfolk, VA
Great weather most of the time (If you don't like it today, it will change tomorrow). You can surf in the morning and drive west to ski this evening.

Reasonable size Jewish community from reform ( lots of those) to conservative, ( a good size group) and some orthodox. I don't know it's current status, but we used to have a Chabad/Lubavich shul.

Plenty of knifemakers around here. Some teach knifemaking to students.

If you are down this way give me a shout and I'll have you over .
 
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