anvil purchase dilemna

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HSC ///

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I have a chance to buy a new, unused Peddinghaus #12 275 lb and it's local to me
The anvil is from 2007 sitting unused for 10 years, face on this is 12" x 5 1/4"
the only thing I didn't like is the seller seemed shady....

or

a 155 lb sawyer's anvil, rectangular face of 9x5, clean face, the feet/base is a London pattern style, comes from a knowledgeable seller

both are within $100 of each other, 150# is all I need in terms of anvil weights.
I don't "need" the horn,

thoughts? opinions? both can be seen on eBay
 
john april said:
why do you think the seller is shady ? do you think maybe its stolen goods ?
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no, it's not stolen
he just wasn't forthcoming with information and up front and just wasn't straight with me
He only showed me the receipt after I pressed him on it.

He's a younger guy that wanted to hide behind "text only"
You just know when something is not right and shady :)
 
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The Peddinghaus is a much better value, and more easily resale-able. I had a 300+ lb Fisher Saw anvil, and I sold it favor of my 250lb standard London Pattern Fisher.

Both of the anvils are bigger than you need. A 100lb anvil is all any bladesmith not utilizing a striker can really utilize, if it's immovably secured to a good stand, that's securely fastened to the floor/ground. A 500lb anvil on a stump wobbling around, won't do half the work of the 100lber that's properly anchored. Large anvils were meant to be utilized by teams of strikers, wielding 20lb sledges. Anytime you see an old anvil with a saddled face, it's because it was over-used by strikers, for it's size. A single hammer wielding smith can't utilize the larger size, but as long as it's not physically big enough to get in your way, there's no disadvantage to the larger size, other than the seeming propensity to think it's big enough to not need anchoring down.

If your anvil moves noticeably at all, when any sized hammer hits it, you're fucking up, and wasting the mass of it.

Ok, end of rant, sorry.


On the issue of which anvil; Yes on paper all a bladesmith *needs* is a flat face. On the other hand, the larger size of the peddinhaus makes up for the loss centerline mass of the horn and heel, plus adds versatility and convenience. However *MORE* importantly, is that the saw anvil likely has no hardy hole. Top and bottom tooling are essential for efficient forging, something often neglected by modern smiths, who seem to favor idealistic stubborn persistence, over working smart. There is also more real-estate to give yourself difference corner radiuses, and the horn is very useful for bending, and drawing in certain ways.



Yeah the seller sounds like a PITA, but go look at it, if it's as nice as described, take it home, and never talk to him again.
 
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HSC /// said:
no, it's not stolen
he just wasn't forthcoming with information and up front and just wasn't straight with me
He only showed me the receipt after I pressed him on it.

He's a younger guy that wanted to hide behind "text only"
You just know when something is not right and shady :)
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My experience with semi shady Craigslist sellers is to bring your biggest, burliest, very good chance he has a concealed weapon friends along with you to "help you get it in the truck"
 
Greenberg Woods said:
My experience with semi shady Craigslist sellers is to bring your biggest, burliest, very good chance he has a concealed weapon friends along with you to "help you get it in the truck"
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I've run into a lot of these "only want to text", avoid actual calls, sort of flippant people chasing down tools on craigslist. I think it's really just a symptom of the social disconnect of younger people that are excessively immersed in the non-voice features of their phone.

Usually, they're fine in person. They just have no social grace, because they text constantly, and have limited actual human interaction that's not filtered through an app.
 
I would get the Peddinghaus.

As javand said, he is more likely a jerk that shady. You only have to see him once, so don't let his personality bother you.

The #12 is running around $1800 new right now, so if it is only $100 more than a used 155# sawyers anvil it sounds like a great deal. I wuld not sit on this decision long, as it will soon be gone.
 
yeah I think the Peddinhaus is the way to go, good point Javan about the hardy hole,
I guess I forgot about that...
sometimes just typing out the thoughts and a little conversation brings a lot of clarity :)
 
If you can....buy both, then sell the one you choose not to keep, to offset the cost
of the one you keep.

Either one should be easy to re-sell.
 
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I hear a lot on here that we blad smiths don't need a horn. I love my horn and use it all the time. It's very efficient in drawing out billets or shaping guards and other random things. I am very glad I have my horn. Do we have to have then, no but we also don't have to forge we could grind blade from bar stock.
 
Russ Andrews said:
If you can....buy both, then sell the one you choose not to keep, to offset the cost
of the one you keep.

Either one should be easy to re-sell.
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He never said what thy where priced at, thy could be $1000 and $1100. I'm becoming more and more comfortable with the price of new anvils as the used price is just getting to high.
 
JTknives said:
He never said what thy where priced at, thy could be $1000 and $1100. I'm becoming more and more comfortable with the price of new anvils as the used price is just getting to high.
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they are about $1300-$1400 each....
 
The sawmakers anvil would be completely out of the question then for me, that's crazy for a 155LB anvil. Especially considering it does not have the "collector" value of a standard anvil.
 
JTknives said:
The sawmakers anvil would be completely out of the question then for me, that's crazy for a 155LB anvil. Especially considering it does not have the "collector" value of a standard anvil.
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I think it's crazy too, but it's a well known guy who has a lot of anvils and people seem to be paying, he sells regularly at $10 per lb
 
You can buy new for way less then $10 a pound. New nimbas are what $5.75 a pound (450lb for $2,575). These things are tools why pay more for an old used tool then a new one.
 
Yeah, once you get over $5 a lb, lots of options start opening up. Including, having something shipped. When I bought my 250lb Fisher, and the big Fisher Saw anvil, I got them from a collector selling his whole collection (which was F-ing impressive btw, including one 300ish lb Double Heel Anvil, with two hardies and pritchels, no horns, which I would have bought if I could have), and actually had a guy deliver the two anvils from PA, down to a town about an hour away, because he worked for the guy, and was coming to visit family. I'd have had them freighted if necessary though.

You can get nearly anything that can be put on a pallet, shipped anywhere in the CONUS for $200-400.

No way I'd buy that saw anvil at that price, they don't command near the price of a london or german pattern typically, they're uncommon comparatively, but only of value to us bladesmiths. The price of the peddinghaus isn't *great*, but if that's the anvil you'd buy new anyway, I'd jump on it. It's not horrible.

Still, a few options very close in price range for an actually new anvil. Fontanini (Rathole) 250lber, Big Blu 265lber, a few options from Old World Anvils, that are as cheap or cheaper. Also, don't forget Jymm Hoffman's anvils, which the two smaller ones are really nice, and the colonial style would be a great style for a bladesmith, most of the mass is center. It's like $8 a lb, but still quite a bit cheaper than the anvils you mention, and plenty to do any kind of bladesmithing, honestly, I'll buy one eventually.
 
javand said:
Also, don't forget Jymm Hoffman's anvils, which the two smaller ones are really nice, and the colonial style would be a great style for a bladesmith, most of the mass is center. It's like $8 a lb, but still quite a bit cheaper than the anvils you mention, and plenty to do any kind of bladesmithing, honestly, I'll buy one eventually.
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thanks Javan, I had not heard of Jymm Hoffman... the smaller colonial does look very suitable
 
FWIW if you wanted to pick the best steel to make an Anvil out of, it's probably H-13. Overkill? Definitely, but you'll never have to worry about spot detempering.

The lack of a real heel on that anvil is particularly appealing to me as a bladesmith. I figure it's easily got the overall centerline mass of a 150-200lb anvil, and it'll be *very* comfortable to get up close on the heel and work the way a non-farrier smith *should* be working, parallel waist to his work, instead of standing in front of the side of an anvil plinking away like a limp wristed dork, swinging a baby hammer like he's worried about a sprain. ;D That's why I prefer a london pattern anvil, and why they have square heels, so you can get your pelvis right up to the heel, and be over your work at the waist of the anvil, parallel to the work, with your hammer at 90 degrees opposed, so your blows near, and far half-hammer face, and full on center, don't twist or distort the work, and allow maximum forging efficiency.

The whole standing parallel to the anvil, facing the side, comes from farriers, who admittedly, brought smithing basically back from the brink of death, but it's become forgotten by most, that there's a reason in their work, why they stand that way, and why, the rest of us, usually, shouldn't.


LOL, two rants in one thread, I'm on a roll? ;)
 
Just looked at that colonial pattern anvil, I really like the look of that. I've already got a nice London pattern and I'm seriously considering one of those.
 
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