Anyone have any problems with Bark River?

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Jmboz, your statement: "Mike Stewart, likes to blame inexperienced users - his knives could never fail!; Reid Hyken abuses his moderater status on their forums and commonly changes and twists poster's comments, then baits and bans them"
is exactly what i experienced when i said the sheath that came with my Bark River knife was too small. Reid's posts about me were so out-of-line and extreme that i wondered what his underlying problem might be. Normal healthy people don't react in an abusive way to a straightforward and polite inquiry
 
Guys,

I'm not saying that this knife was right. I seem to have managed to rile Kyle up in challenging this in the comments section of his previous video - genuinely not intentional. If posting 'not cool' warrants getting worked up then someone is pretty tightly wound.

For the sake of clarity I'll reitterate what I said;

"Posting that video seems to propogate exactly the sort of stuff that I think can get unreasonable. Especially as there is no mention of the warranty, etc. "

This certainly seems to have become unreasonable. Apparently, I'm an "idiot" for challenging Kyle who posted the video. The whole position of this individual is clearly incredibly biased against BRKT. I buy many different brands of knives, I take a practical view of each knife that I own and use.

My point here is that posting these relatively rare examples given the actual production numbers is not giving any manufacturer involved a fair shout. I've had recent issues with Fallkniven, DPx and whilst I have posted about this I have NEVER sought to extrapolate this into a wider comment about the company's reliability.

Ben


I'm only posting here to have a voice because my unlisted video was posted here without me knowing.. I dont wish to perpetuate anything. I've allready said my piece to Ben about this. he claims he riled me up unintentionally.. I'll just have to accept that and move on.

I have told Ben that I called him an idiot for saying that my video and comment of testing another knife is "potentially slanderous, and petty" I dont feel its idiotic at all to test another knife I own, when 1 fails so badly. I dont feel its slanderous to show that the epoxy(or other) glue bond failed completely, and the ease of dismantling the handle with a few taps was video evidence.

as to the "comedy" and "more brkcrap" title.. I didn't bother to edit the settings because it was an unlisted video. yes.. the video was called moreBRKcrap.. so shoot me.. its the same knife that had a serious edge failure like my friends 12c27's. is it more.. yes.. is it BRK.. yes.. is it crap? certainly is..

Ben mentioned I said 5 of 30 knives failed. I do want to make it quite clear that this is the only time I've had something like this happen with a bark river knife.. if anything like this was happening on a regular basis you'd have seen a video about it. 5 out of 30 knives that had problems.. (not massive failures) most of the failures were simply too thin edges which I correct myself with no issue or complaint in the past. if i wasn't experienced with grinding, or even just plain sharpening, then for many this will lead to a catastrophic edge failure.. only my ability to indentify the problem early on and pre-correct it lead to them being minor issues.
Recently when friends started showing their 12c27 knives chipping and failing terribly i tested a brand new one and got similar bad results..

This entire video was unlisted, and for another forum, and had I wished to vent my spleen with BRK I'd have a good 3 hours of video time to make public..

its not my job to talk about the warranties or anything else.. this video was contextual and someone chose to link it here and make it more public than intended.

I used to have 100 videos on Bark River knives. out of that 100 if I recall there was 1 video that had something mildly negative to say.. you will learn that apparently thats not allowed. Now I dont have any public videos on Bark River. I deleted them all.
Does that make the 100 good videos lies? not at all.. it means I have no interest in promoting their goodside as long as I think their badside is so poor.
Do I have to create an unbiased video when showing a failure and outline their warranty policy to the viewers? I dont think so.. i dont work for them.. and if I "had to" outline their "no questions asked" warranty, then I think I'd need to relate every 1st hand experience related to my by friends and owners who were screwed by that warranty too.. I should also need to mention in the video how any warranty would cost me about $80USD return insured post for them to fix their failures... that would also be nice and unbiased.

Their warranty is worthless in my opinion when you dont live in USA.. the shipping costs which they dont cover doesn't justify the repairs. Is that their fault? not at all.. but better QA to minimize the need of returns is important when selling overseas..

I certainly take huge offense at implications that I'm trying to put Bark River down because I'm a competitor.. I am a software developer.. thats how I pay my rent.. making 50-100 knives a year as a hobby is not competiing with a company that claims 25,000 knives a year or something to that effect. If they, or anyone else even seriously thinks such a thing is the case then BRK must be doing something very wrong indeed.

why did I have a major falling out with them? simple.. when they released a review of their new 3V northstar I asked some basic questions and demonstration in video of the knife, because as an owner of a northstar myself I felt very confused by the label of it being the best bushcraft knife outthere as I found it very uncomfortable to use in certain well used and efficient cutting holds.

I was met with so much avoidance that Southerncross then pulled them up on the ridiculous answers that he felt insulted by as a bushcrafter and customer. This led to the 2 of us being threatened with banishment, and being told that we ruined his sons wedding day with out intentional assaults on their company, and cost them a $50,000 sale or some shit.. All because of their own outlandish replies to a simple request to demonstrate why the knife is claimed to be so good..

There.. now you know the short and curly. They then took my posts and massaged and edited them to suit how they liked and moved on and I never spoke to them again.
 
me2,

A couple of things - firstly, I agree that stuff like this "does happen". I'm not trying to unnecessarily defend BRKT, right now I'm trying to ensure that my comments are represented accurately and fairly (which is proving challenging).

You said about half of them had problems but I think you're referring to a different post. Kyle claims to have issues with "about 5 out of 30" Bark River knives. Still far from an ideal ratio regarding quality control...

True enough. I wasn't specific enough. IIRC, he's had issues with primarily knives in 12c27 steel.

Finally, I'm not sure that I understand what you mean when you say "If it gets that bad, the warranty doesn't mean much, IMO."? The warranty means it'll get put right. Free of charge. I'm not clear how whatever state the knife may or may not be in negates the warranty? Apologies if I'm not interpreting your comments correctly - I just don't quite see the link.

All I'm saying here is that there are some very basic things that I expect to be done when I buy a knife of BRKT's level. One is it should be heat treated correctly, or close. Another is it should be ground for it's intended purpose, plus a little room for error. Finally, it should be assembled properly. No loose or missing screws, blade facing the right way, parts don't hit the edge when closed, and all the steps done for handle assembly, whatever they are.

As you say, it is your opinion and at the end of the day we all have our own opinions. I am not being a 'fan-boy' when I simply as that the number of issues be kept in perspective and I do think that it needs to be pointed out the poster of this video lists the YouTube Category as 'Comedy' and the tag as: 'MoreCrapBRK'. This is not an unbiased point to be starting from. Does it mean the knife was right? - Nope. Am I defending or excusing that? - Nope.

Have the comments on my points on the video lost all perspective on what was actually said? Absolutely...

Ben

I know that some steps in making a knife are quite complicated. Others not so much. Assembling a full tang handle is in the not so much category, for a company that reportedly makes 30,000 knives per year. As another poster pointed out in this thread, it begins to cross the line from warranty service to end user quality control service, especially when one user has a rate of 5 of 30 that need work. It basically comes down to me not having any faith in a warranty if the pins don't get glued in properly or the grinds are off.

rproctor, are the knives you used marketed as flesh/hide only? I don't know which models you used, but with that limitation, I don't see much need for a blade over 1/16" or 3/32" thick at the spine, and it could likely go thinner, like 1mm or even 1/32" if the blade were short enough that flexing weren't a problem.
 
None of my BR blades are marked "for flesh only". I was saying that this is how i use my Hunter pattern knives, strictly for field dressing and even then trying to avoid contact of the blade edge with bone. I carry a stouter blade for general camp chores like cutting sticks, clearing a bit of brush, etc.
Not all the knives i have used are as thinly ground as the Bark River but it makes sense to reserve any hunting blade for flesh only so that it keeps it's ultra sharp edge and therefore the field dressing proceeds with ease and as quickly as possible. One reason for this 'quick as possible' is that there are usually a few bears in the general area and you want to keep the time of maximum vulnerablity while hunched over the carcass, to a minimum.
roland
 
Jmboz, your statement: "Mike Stewart, likes to blame inexperienced users - his knives could never fail!; Reid Hyken abuses his moderater status on their forums and commonly changes and twists poster's comments, then baits and bans them"
is exactly what i experienced when i said the sheath that came with my Bark River knife was too small. Reid's posts about me were so out-of-line and extreme that i wondered what his underlying problem might be. Normal healthy people don't react in an abusive way to a straightforward and polite inquiry

Wow. Could you PM me a synopsis of what he said?

I've heard of them being abusive like that, but I haven't seenr the types of things they say. Makes you wonder what would make a person act like that.
 
Do you know anything about the person who posted that video?


That video was private, and was slated to remain that way until he was bashed you. He made that video for only a select few individuals to see...

Hey CrimsonTideShooter,

Regarding your comments, the video was posted in this thread - not by me(!). I responded in a bid to move to a more balanced perspective.

Do I know Kyley? Not personally no. Does he have a beef with BRKT? Yup, as he has taken the time to explain in this thread.

I joined another forum specifically to clear the air with Kyley directly. I've expressed my views with Kyley and he has expressed and clarified his. I'm happy with that and I think we have a clearer understanding of where we both are coming from. So I guess you're comments are somewhat moot in light of that? Let me know otherwise, but I prefer to address these things directly with the individual(s) involved - which I've done.

Without getting my panties in a wad over it - I've got nothing more to add here (other than to clarify my points when they are misunderstood or misrepresented)...

Ben
 
CrimsonTideShooter, it was in another knife forum about 3(?) years ago and i haven't visited it since. If i can find these posts, i will send you the link. Some of the abusive remarks were in emails but these were discarded long ago. By the time i posted in that forum i had already emailed and phoned BRKT numerous times over a 2 month period but had not received a single reply.
I will add that i was at all times polite and did not react to these vociferous attacks on my character, but stayed on topic of trying to get a replacement sheath. I'm far too old to involve myself in being rude or derogatory towards others. Maybe it's just another sign of declining testosterone levels, but one does mellow with age.
roland
 
Kyley, I see nothing wrong with your video showing how easy it was to tap that knife apart,..Being in the manufacturing field, I will give Bark River the benefit of doubt being it looks like they did put your blade together pretty decent and it looks like an adhesive was used- looks to be inferior but there was an attempt--- being that both of us are knife makers I have no doubt that either one of us could make a blade just simply better than they could produce, but we are on small scale and more time and care can be put into "our" product--- which I believe might be where these problems are rising, and Bark River should slow there production some and make sure quality is number one, rather than trying to be bigger and faster, there production schedule is actually crazy, I'm not saying that there won't be any issues, that's just a given in anything, but very limited is key, if I buy a $250 blade in the U.S. and expect quality, that same damn quality better show up for you half way around the world.
 
I own several Bark Rivers and have only had one problem... a Canadian Special with an unsharpened area right at the base of the blade. I sent it back and it got fixed with no trouble, and they replaced the sheath I had sliced up at no charge. No issues with my several other knives.
 
Kyley, I see nothing wrong with your video showing how easy it was to tap that knife apart,..Being in the manufacturing field, I will give Bark River the benefit of doubt being it looks like they did put your blade together pretty decent and it looks like an adhesive was used- looks to be inferior but there was an attempt--- being that both of us are knife makers I have no doubt that either one of us could make a blade just simply better than they could produce, but we are on small scale and more time and care can be put into "our" product--- which I believe might be where these problems are rising, and Bark River should slow there production some and make sure quality is number one, rather than trying to be bigger and faster, there production schedule is actually crazy, I'm not saying that there won't be any issues, that's just a given in anything, but very limited is key, if I buy a $250 blade in the U.S. and expect quality, that same damn quality better show up for you half way around the world.

I agree. On close inspection, I feel that I can see where the problem lies. one of my viewers told me that he has visited their shop on a grind in, and that they are not using epoxy for everything, and infact are using spray adhesive.. this makes complete sense when I inspect the handle scales.

close inspection shows that they must have been sprayed, and then sitting around in an unclean rushed environment.. there is dust, metal particles, and human hair stuck to the inside surface that should be clean.. all of this junk in there is likely what caused and assisted the glue bond in failing..

now.. guessing that if they are that rushed, then they probably line up a bunch and spray them, there is a good chance not 1, but an entire batch could be faulty for the same reason.

Attached are some images of the stuff in the glue underside.. i dont believe in any situation in any company that this should happen.. maybe once in a blue moon..
handle1.jpghandle2.jpghandle3.jpghandle4.jpg

anyway.. I've said my bit, and i never actually intended to.. it was a quiet displeasure to a few (originally)
 
Those behind Bark River have a long negative history in the cutlery world. Just do search of GB&U for a little taste. After reading a few of the hot threads there, if you buy one of their knives, you are being foolish and if you defend the company or owners, your ethics may be twisted.
 
Just a note and I hope its not a flame out to him.

But Bark River took the blade I got from KH and made it a sharp and usable one.

It came unfinished and that is not my place to do that work.

I own more than a few BRK&T blades and while not a huge fan of all their stuff - I do love most of it.

And that includes a few Blackjack blades that they did ,and I love !.

Sorry KH but that blade you did was sad to say the least,as long as you dish it out = ya gotta take it too.
 
Those behind Bark River have a long negative history in the cutlery world. Just do search of GB&U for a little taste. After reading a few of the hot threads there, if you buy one of their knives, you are being foolish and if you defend the company or owners, your ethics may be twisted.

AND opinions are like buttholes = we all have at least one.

I dont feel the need to pick on a maker IF they back their product.

And so far [ past 7 years ] they have done so for me.
 
it's already ugly once Mike Stewart gets mentioned. Just ask Ethan Becker, Jerry Fisk, Tom Maringer, Bobby Branton, Bob Cargill, Chris Reeve, Steven Youell, Anthony Lombardo and other Blackjack employees, the Murphy Wall State Bank, etc.
 
it's already ugly once Mike Stewart gets mentioned. Just ask Ethan Becker, Jerry Fisk, Tom Maringer, Bobby Branton, Bob Cargill, Chris Reeve, Steven Youell, Anthony Lombardo and other Blackjack employees, the Murphy Wall State Bank, etc.

Nothing like FIRST HAND knowledge of an event or situation.

Since NONE here have that,all you have are the bitter words of those that 'believe' they were wronged by him.

I take NO sides,therefore I let the tools they make speak for themselves.

Having met a few of those you mentioned,all have an axe to grind somewhere.

So let the blades do the talking.

BTW = I own blades by all the makers you mentioned,AND BRK&T.

Funny but all the blades get along in the same box !!.
 
Of course, it's everyone else that has the problem, and some sort of conspiracy where everyone who 'believes' they were wronged got together and made up stories. And got a bank fraud case and bounced checks to employees made up.

Silly me.
 
some may be too thin
I have 5 and had like 8, all have been used, 4-5 tested after talking to Mike Stewart who personally told me, "use them and if they have issues I'll make it good"
fox and northstar have been batonned heavily and one suffered a light "wavy" edge after being struck on a wood knot (15 cm diameter seasoned log...), MIke said strop it on another knife's spine and it'll be fine, done that and it's like new :thumbup:
aurora got stuck while testing, hammered it heavily to take it out, no problems whatsoever, B1 is fine too
only the gunny was fine and I rolled the edge, resharpened it a bit and it held fine for a loooong while, never resharpened it ever since

Mike's and my suggestion would be: change the geometry by resharpening them, they are awesome knives, that you can modify to accomodate your taste and for the desired use
in case, send them back and they'll take care of you

they are fine knives, than hold well even havy use, hold an incredible edge and are easy to maintain, a pity not to use them :thumbup:
Maxx

"If they have issues I'll make it good" sums it up. I have yet to buy a Mike Stewart-made knife that hasn't been given five star treatment whenever it needed it. I pay for shipping and a little extra if I need something extra (beyond repair) and it's all good. Combine this with a massive design selection and fantastic materials and I have absolutely nothing to complain about.
 
Just a note and I hope its not a flame out to him.

But Bark River took the blade I got from KH and made it a sharp and usable one.

It came unfinished and that is not my place to do that work.

I own more than a few BRK&T blades and while not a huge fan of all their stuff - I do love most of it.

And that includes a few Blackjack blades that they did ,and I love !.

Sorry KH but that blade you did was sad to say the least,as long as you dish it out = ya gotta take it too.

Hey.. whatever makes you happy..

but .. I dont recognize your bladeforums name.. so I'd appreciate it if you let me know who your are exactly, and which specific knife you bought and the price you paid for it. Then I can know what you are talking about and respond accordingly.
you can PM me if you want to keep your name anonymous..
 
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