Appalled at number of counterfeit knives on eBay

[Goldenlight]

I was looking at something not at all knife related on eBay, but having done numerous searches for knives, eBay had a bunch of 'suggested items' across the bottom of the screen. One was an interesting and expensive Spyderco. I followed the link, and at the bottom of that screen were some more eBay 'suggestions'. One was the same knife I was looking at, at about 1/3 the price.

It was listed as the Spyderco knife, same exact name, Spyderco name and logo on the blade, everything. But right in the title, it said 'Chinese copy'. So I reported it eBay. In less than a half hour, I found and reported five more Spyderco knives all listed as 'Chinese copy', or 'Chinese clone'.

I can't understand how eBay let's a listing stay that says 'Chinese copy' right in the title. Of course, eBay gets their percentage.

I urge the MANY members of Blade Forums to spend a little time reporting these copyright and trademark infringing listings, My guess is they people who own the listing get their accounts cancelled by eBay. Odds are they will come back, but they will have zero feedback.

I know that we can't find and report all the counterfeit knives on eBay. Bur if several hundred different people start reporting these Chinese copies, eBay may feel forced to do something about them. Like NOT LETTING people list them.

It certainly is worth the small expenditure of time, to put a dent on the profits if these people who are committing fraud, IMHO.

In half an hour, I got six accounts closed. Lets get rid of a LOT of these accounts of these people selling Chinese counterfeit knives on eBay.

 

[Lapedog]

Unfortunately it seems to be like trying to mop up a tidal wave with one sheet of paper towel...and it's not even Bounty.

 

[Goldenlight]

Unfortunately it seems to be like trying to mop up a tidal wave with one sheet of paper towel...and it's not even Bounty.

With an attitude like yours, it makes it that much easier for the people committing fraud.

It is EXACTLY the same as NOT reporting the crack house down the street, because 'they will just get another crack house going somewhere else'.

If you won't even TRY, the bad guys win. Automatically.

You become part of the problem, instead of part of the solution. I don't know about you, but I have to live with myself.

 

[Lapedog]

I wouldn't report a crackhouse down the street. Not unless they were stealing from the neighbours or somehow else causing harm. Thay's just me though. I would rather just tell these hypothetical crackheads myself. This is because I know how jail and a criminal record can ruin someone's life, probably just as bad as crack use can. Inwouldn't be able to live with

As to people with my attitude causing the problem to he exacerbated; many people have tried. I am not saying you or anyone else shouldn't, just that it has been tried many times. Nothing seems to really work. The better way to combat the problem seems to be educating buyers so they know how to avoid buying fakes. Also reporting the fakes to the companies being knocked off seems to help somewhat and be appreciated.

That's just my opinion though.

 

[Pomsbz]

With an attitude like yours, it makes it that much easier for the people committing fraud.

It is EXACTLY the same as NOT reporting the crack house down the street, because 'they will just get another crack house going somewhere else'.

If you won't even TRY, the bad guys win. Automatically.

You become part of the problem, instead of part of the solution. I don't know about you, but I have to live with myself.

You don't need to be offensive. Your exaggerated comparison does not begin to do justice to the reality. You're welcome to your crusade but don't berate others for having better things to do with their time. Spyderco are big boys. They can deal with their own problems.

 

[trevitrace]

Maybe they're "homage" pieces...

Oh, and here's the blah blah, "there's nothing wrong with it because it's our law not theirs and it doesn't apply to whoever else is making it wherever else" argument before that gets used by someone to validate the scumminess.

 

[JupiterPaladin]

Maybe they're "homage" pieces...

I'm assuming he's going after the real counterfeits that say they are the real deal. A new thing they say is OEM like to make people think they are the direct manufacturer. It's sad that it works on some people...

 

[91bravo]

People have tried and tried, I know I have, to report these counterfeit pieces, but it seems that flea bay doesn't really care. As stated above, they always get their cut, real item or not. There will always be counterfeiters out there. Yeah, it sucks, but it is what it is.... All we can do is support reputable dealers to ensure that we don't end up purchasing one of these counterfeits.

 

[BitingSarcasm]

Sorry Goldenlight, but stamping out the clones by posse is impossible while eBay is both the one holding the banhammer and getting a percentage of the sale. Until they decide to get serious about it, nothing is going to happen. It is going to have to hurt their bottom line worse to do nothing than it is to remove the counterfeits. You might try going to change.org and getting a petition drive started--the more the merrier when it comes to trying to teach morality to a corporation.

 

[znapschatz]

Unfortunately it seems to be like trying to mop up a tidal wave with one sheet of paper towel...and it's not even Bounty.

With an attitude like yours, it makes it that much easier for the people committing fraud.

It is EXACTLY the same as NOT reporting the crack house down the street, because 'they will just get another crack house going somewhere else'.

If you won't even TRY, the bad guys win. Automatically.

You become part of the problem, instead of part of the solution. I don't know about you, but I have to live with myself.

You don't need to be offensive. Your exaggerated comparison does not begin to do justice to the reality. You're welcome to your crusade but don't berate others for having better things to do with their time. Spyderco are big boys. They can deal with their own problems.

(snip) As to people with my attitude causing the problem to he exacerbated; many people have tried. I am not saying you or anyone else shouldn't, just that it has been tried many times. Nothing seems to really work. The better way to combat the problem seems to be educating buyers so they know how to avoid buying fakes. Also reporting the fakes to the companies being knocked off seems to help somewhat and be appreciated. That's just my opinion though.

Lapedog is right. Problem is, there is nothing ebay, Spyderco or anybody else can do about it. Report to the posting site, the counterfeit Spyderco gets removed, and within minutes, the same thing gets posted on another site. China has no laws to prevent “cloning” of name brand products from other countries. Unless the products are trademarked in China, the maker has no recourse. Frustrating, but that’s the way it is.

 

[oregon]

Rip them a new one Goldenlight!

http://www.bladeforums.com/threads/...-buck-knives-americans-who-sell-them.1249369/. The point is two years into this linked to personal campaign fake buck knives do no exist on the big bay full stop.

Ignore the faker/knockoff/synchophants/defeatist/criminal enablers/do nothing crack whore gashs (you know who you are) that will not get off their axes for a righteous American rule of law under any circumstances.

A couple of years ago I could look at 200 Buck knives listed on the big bay and 100 would be counterfeit. Fakes are rare now. Individual effort made this country great. Rock on GL. You are righteous.

 

[not2sharp]

Ebay supports fraud. If that bothers you, then stop patronizing them.

On the other hand, I do not have a problem with it. It would be far more intrusive to demand that someone police this garbage. Who is to say what is ultimately real or fake? Are we going to demand radio-carbon dating on everything listed as an "antique" or mandate certification from each manufacturer before you can list one of their products?

The only practical way to deal with this is to educate the consumer. Any product may be real, faked or misidentified under any purchasing setting. Either, take the time to learn about what you are buying, don't worry about it, or accept and suffer the consequences.

n2s

 

[Mo2]

i stopped buying junk from ebay in general because of this. if enough people stop buying ebay because of this, and voicing there concerns to ebay... then ebay will see a drop in sales and change for the better. but ... lol that wont happen.

 

[Hackenslash]

The problem lies in that these knives are available direct from China or Pakistan or wherever for much cheaper than they usually sell on the Bay. Shutting them down on the Bay only impacts a small percentage of their sales. I'm all for reporting them at every opportunity, but as someone already said there's something fundamentally wrong when the policing entity (eBay) is also the profiting entity (eBay).

Best strategy is to support legit vendors and encourage others to do so also.

 

[robgmn]

If nothing else, at least the people who buy an item listed as a "Chinese copy" know that they are getting a Chinese copy.
It's when the copy is sold as genuine that the real problems begin.

 

[Lapedog]

I don't appreciate being called defeatist, criminal enabling or a do nothing crack whore gash. Thisnissue has been raised many times and the conclusions drawn are that the best way to protect against this kind of thing is customer education. Those customers that do not care will just buy it anyway. If eBay stops listing the clones then those who do not care will simply go to alibaba.

Be careful declaring your side the righteous one. This often leads to people being hurt. The average German in WW2 considered their side righteous. Many today believe they would never participate in those atrocities. History shows otherwise.

 

[Phixt]

The problem lies in that these knives are available direct from China or Pakistan or wherever for much cheaper than they usually sell on the Bay. Shutting them down on the Bay only impacts a small percentage of their sales. I'm all for reporting them at every opportunity, but as someone already said there's something fundamentally wrong when the policing entity (eBay) is also the profiting entity (eBay).

Best strategy is to support legit vendors and encourage others to do so also.

Yes.

If nothing else, at least the people who buy an item listed as a "Chinese copy" know that they are getting a Chinese copy.
It's when the copy is sold as genuine that the real problems begin.

This.

I've seen this discussion a number of times here at the forums. It comes up because we're all knife folks, and when we see that stuff at the bay it rightfully sets us off. Remember, it has to do with the culture at the bay and a few bad seeds, not the culture in the general knife community.

I collect a wide variety of things, and I can assure you the fraudulent procedures found at places like the bay and the amazon jungle aren't knife-specific. Not only are there Chinese knock-offs and sophistic sellers, but there's the asking price as well. Without getting into too much detail I can assure you I own items (let's say, a leather bound journal book) that I spent a couple dozen or couple hundred dollars on, and I head over to the amazon jungle to find one or two sellers are asking $5,700 for the exact same item. What really floors me is that these sellers have hundreds or thousands of sells under their belts and they have 99+% seller ratings - that's a lot of misinformed (by seller descriptions) buyers happily getting ripped off. What a sham/e.

Ya know what else grinds my gears? These sellers acting ignorant with their silver plated items, rolled gold wannabes and replicas.

 

[PURPLEDC]

Maybe they're "homage" pieces...

Oh, and here's the blah blah, "there's nothing wrong with it because it's our law not theirs and it doesn't apply to whoever else is making it wherever else" argument before that gets used by someone to validate the scumminess.

Even I wouldnt use that excuse in this case. Cloning a design is one thing. But ripping off logos and serial numbers right down to the initials of the owners? Not even I can defend that. Of course when its a company like microtech im less inclined to give a rip seeing they rip people off all the time. But like lapedog eluded to. Fighting a battle on the ebay level makes such a small difference its almost not even worth the time. They just open a new account as fast as the old is taken down. But no, imho anything with a lifted logo is not an homage or clone. I know you dont make any distinctions though.

 

[Phixt]

Be careful declaring your side the righteous one...The average German in WW2 considered their side righteous. Many today believe they would never participate in those atrocities. History shows otherwise.

LOL WOW!!!! I don't even know what to say about this one! I'll just say you can replace the word 'History' with Current Events', and leave it at that!

 

[Lapedog]

I was using hyperbole to make a point. Not drawing an equivalence. I do see enough of it happening in current events though. Let's not get into a political discussion on an issue anyone with perceptive skills and the ability to think for themselves can see.