are bushcraft knives over built?

[RescueRiley]

Not trying to start a fracass? just a conversation...I recently got to have a good gander at some beautiful bushcraft knives.... They are really pieces of functional art, but I was amazed by how thick they where when compared to the puukkos from which they evolved.
and I got to thinking in what ways a "bushcraft knife" (by this term I am reffering to the generic scandi woodlore clone style) differs from a survival knife..now mind you allot of this is my subjective musing...
But it seems to me that the primary functions of a bushcraft knife are slicing, cutting, and carving.... these are fairly specialized niches for a fairly specialized tool, and that the kit of the average crafter has other specialized tools for specialized niches... maybe a saw, a hatchet, a Golok, multitool....you get the idea
when such is the case is the need for a bombproof design necessary?
When I look at pictures of Nordic and lappi hunters from way back when there belt knives where often stick or hidden tang fairly thin scandis.
These are folks who carved there survival from the frozen Northern Forests. ...But than again there belt knives where specialized tools that functioned as part of a unit which also consisted of a leuku and an axe
Many knive of the early Americas as well where thin stock with a stick or hidden tang.
A survival knife in my opinion is a knife that should function as a stand alone tool.. One that can fill many niches thou ne of them perfectly,,thisis a horse of a different color I think as this is a beast that might be pressed into the rigors of axe work, or detail work....although adequate for the bush,,,these blade are often not what is considered when the term "bushcraft knife" is used...
so back to my original thought... does a tool that is designed to be fill a specialized niche need to be built beyond that niche? can it sometimes come at a cost? I don't know... What;s your thoughts?

 

[j williams]

I think its in our nature to overbuild things.....Also I believe a stick/hidden tang is alot tougher then people give credit for.

I like to have a sense of security in my primary woods blade. I like a bit of overbuilding for my personal comfort level. Ive been hard on stuff since I was a kid...lol

 

[practicalsurvivor]

I just picked up one of Rod Garcia's skookum bush tools. It does feel like a totally different blade than the Mora I have. Nice blade.

 

[RescueRiley]

Good Points J thanks for sharing

 

[WILLIAM.M]

I think its in our nature to overbuild things.....Also I believe a stick/hidden tang is alot tougher then people give credit for.

I like to have a sense of security in my primary woods blade. I like a bit of overbuilding for my personal comfort level. Ive been hard on stuff since I was a kid...lol

I agree 110%

Americans like things Bigger(From meals -to Hummers-to Knives)

But in this regard--I would rather have a knife that is overbuilt than one that might be damaged from harduse.

It makes me Feel better knowing the knives I carry can take a lot more abuse than I will most likely ever have to need...

 

[skab8541]

I hear what your saying, I have several not so over built knives that I love to use for bushcraft on a regular basis, a couple Old hickorys, a Green River Sheath knife, and even a Paula Dean paring knife. I know they all can do what I demand of them as far as bushcraft but, if I ever need alittle more out of them I am leary to push their limits.

That being said I leave those blades at home or in pack if I know I'm going to be batoning some hard stuff with a bunch of knots in it. I guess you can say I don't trust them when push comes to shove.

 

[Incahiker]

I have plenty of knives that I think would be just fine if I was to have to survive in the woods for some bizarre, odd reason. But, if given the choice, I would take my Busse boss street, I have full confidence this would survive most anything I could ever imagine doing to a knife, I wouldn't hesitate to pry with it or use it as a step. Though I would never normally even think of doing so, I have full confidence in that knife.

 

[x39]

I don't see my knife as a tool to do all things, but rather as a tool that can make other tools. For example, I would never consider using my knife as a digging tool, instead I would use it to make a digging stick. In this school of thought, the knife as an efficient cutting tool trumps all other considerations.

 

[chopchop]

It's one of those things... if you only have one blade, and your life depends on it, of course you want something ridiculously over-engineered. I want to be able to drive a few into concrete and drive my truck up a wall, lol.


Seriously, tho, I saw a review of the Hultafors hvk (basically a plastic handled mora), where the guy drove it into logs & stood on it, batoned through 3" hardwood, & more, & it was just fine.


It's unlikely I will ever *need* anything more than a simple stick tang puukko, but man do I *want* something fancier.

 

[SouthernCross]

G'day RR

.....What's your thoughts?

I reckon a lot has to do with the nature of the wood you are working and whether or not an axe is being used along with the knife.

For example, I can see a real advantage to a thin bladed scandi with a zero grind when you are only going to be working with softwoods.

Start working the same knife with seasoned, twisted grain & knotty hardwoods and see how long the edge lasts

Axe use also seems to be on the way out. No doubt early Americans had an axe handy for the tough work, so they could afford to use thinner stock knives. With less people using axes, the knife is being called on to do more of the tough work than before. This has probably led to the user wanting a "stronger knife".

Also consider the role lifetime warranties have had on the need to reduce breakages and claims from users who may not have that much experience with a knife. Overbuilding it would be one way to reduce the cost to the manufacturer of warranty claims



Kind regards
Mick

 

[CoyotePhysics]

I think the concept of 'overbuilt' has to be taken in context with intended use. I think a lot of frontiersmen would cringe at some of the things that the Rat Pack does with their ESEE blades. If you handed one of these modern knives to a mountain man who had used a green-river blade for years with no problem, yes the modern knife would be overbuilt. At the same time he probably wouldn't use a knife the same way that modern bushcrafters do.

On a completely different track, do you think there has been a change in mentality from, "I must not break my knife" to "My knife must not break?" If so, this may be part of the increased structural integrity of blades.

 

[pitdog]

We have enough to worry about in life so if we can buy a knife that we don't need to worry about then why not, JMO !

 

[ohski]

But in this regard--I would rather have a knife that is overbuilt than one that might be damaged from harduse.

It makes me Feel better knowing the knives I carry can take a lot more abuse than I will most likely ever have to need...

Bingo... I feel the same way... I will say that my Ray Laconico Unscandi Bushcrafter is only 1/8" and that seems to be plenty... I beat the crap out of it this weekend and it did everything very well. Yes, I do baton my knives...

Ski

 

[Jeff H]

For me personally, yeah, a LOT of them are overbuilt and cumbersome to use for Bushcraft-type tasks, but then maybe I'm just doing it wrong.

My favorite BC-type knives have been 3/32" to 1/8" thick (depending on the grind), 3/4" to 1" in height and have under a 4" blade, typically weighing 2.5 to 5 ounces and few of them have actually looked anything like the Wood Lore or SBT. To be perfectly honest, it's hard to find a more comfortable knife to use for such tasks than a plain old Mora 510, which happens to be my "backup" knife in my kits because I know it will do what I need it to do.

 

[Fonly]

I think its the things people do with knives now.

I only started doing most of what I do with knives know because Ive seen what people have done here and wanted to try it. lol\

With that said, the Lapp knives were used in conjunction with an axe. And realistically, I really don't care what people say, a mora and a hatchet can cover anything that needs to be done in the woods, even just a mora if your a little careful.

But I like everyone else have taste's in knives, like certain styles and sometimes feel the need for a hunk of sharpened steel.

Bad thing? No.
Needed? No.
Wanted? Yes. Because of personal preference.

 

[Jeff H]

.....Wanted? Yes. Because of personal preference.

Nothing worng with that either. I gave up on rationalizing why I "needed" certain things a long time ago, like loading 160 grain bullets for my 6.5x55s. Nothing around here to shoot them at but paper, but I like them. I guess my pet load is "overbuilt" but I like it.

 

[TheGame]

Sure, they may be overbuilt. But they are overbuilt because we like them that way. We also may need to depend on them at some point. And better overbuilt then underbuilt.

 

[Fonly]

Nothing worng with that either. I gave up on rationalizing why I "needed" certain things a long time ago, like loading 160 grain bullets for my 6.5x55s. Nothing around here to shoot them at but paper, but I like them. I guess my pet load is "overbuilt" but I like it.

Exactly:thumbup:

 

[KuRUpTD]

And better overbuilt then underbuilt.

I agree 100% :thumbup:

 

[Mistwalker]

I get that in "traditional" bushcraft the belt knife is but one member of a team of somewhat specialized cutting tools; knife, axe, saw. Under those circumstances all cutting needs are met. However I always consider being down to whats on my belt so I still evaluate most cutting tools for value as a stand alone tool. I would not like to find myself down to a Mora so I just don't own one. Personally I prefer my "bushcraft" knife over-built by a lot of people's standards, and I prefer for my "chopping tools" to have usable points.