Are we being stupid? (door locks and garage doors and stuff)

mwerner said:
The weakness is the cheesy door-frame, or even the door itself. A couple of healthy pokes with even a small wrecking bar will make short work of most.
Make sure any dead-bolt locks you buy have a long bolt throw, at least 1 1/2".
Good solid wood or heavy-guage steel doors are best, but expensive.


Most people don't know this but the hinge side on most doors is easier to break than the lock side. I have several friends who are firefighters and they have told me when they need to bust down a door they attack the hinge side, Because of the short screws.

That aside there are good steel doors and there a "gooder" steel doors. A steel door in a wood jamb is no better than a cheap entrance door in a wood jamb. There is only 3/4 of an inch of pine behind the deadbolt. There are steel entrance doors that have a steel frame or jamb insert all the way around the door. You won't usually find these at the home center. My brother makes and sells security storm doors and steel entrance doors. He only sells the steel framed doors. They look no different than the regular steel entrance doors. But I have seen them work. I have in the past helped my brother out when he was short of installers and I have replaced these doors where breakins were attempted. They don't often fail. I have seen the door badly damaged and still secure.
Half of the secret to it's strength is that it is held in with about 20 3.5 inch screws. The other half comes from the steel jamb.

The price is about the same as the wood framed steel entrance door of the same style. I helped a friend put one in his back door a while back, the door cost him $180 without locks. It looks like a common six pannel entrance door.


Drew
 
If your going to go through all that to get the doors to stay put, make sure the danged hinge is on the inside of the door. I've seen some doors that are a pure "open out." Crazy! Pop the pin, pry the door out!

The other side of the equation, if you have ground level windows you need an alarm system on those... both breaking and opening sensors. If the alarm is loud enough, and it appears to be a profesional install, it cuts down on the amount of time they can be there to steal!
 
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Gollnick said:
Always rekey or replace locks when moving in, always.

Most builders use "builders locks." These are cheap and only have about ten keys which makes it easy for workers to get into houses during construction... and after. Replace these locks.

Obviously, if you are moving into an existing house, you have no idea how many keys exist and who has them. Rekey or replace depending on the quality of the locks.

Now is a good time to assure that all of your doors have deadbolt locks. Any glass within about five feet of a door should be polycarbonate. And make sure that strike plates are screwed in with long screws that set into solid wood. When I moved into this house, I found the strikes screwed in with 3/4" long screws. They're in with 4 1/2" screws now.



Keylock deadbolts are best. We just bought a 4 yearold home & the seller was to meet me after closing with the keys. Naturally I arrived first since they stopped for a sandwich. Peeved at waiting, I took out my old U.S. Army commo knife ,jimmied the deadbolt and the door in from the garage. Too,some garage doors have an exterior cancel button on the wall switch so the door may be opened from ONLY the inside.
All in all,I still woukd wedge a metal tool in the door lock-slot that everyone removes.
In our area Ace Hardware will re-key your locks for about $3.00 if you purchase a lock from them. Weiser Locks are their store brand which is our most popular lock with the builders.

Uncle [.45 by the bed JIC ] Alan
 
I bought all new locks, good ones. I bought locks with different keys, in case one key gets lost. That way I only replace one lock.
 
Re-keying the whole house really could'nt hurt, but alarms are good deterents also.
And remember to post signs to tell the would-be thief that there are alarms that will go off if a door or window is opened.

I've also heard that it's smart to put large food and water bowls outside the backdoor and maybe a large rawhide chew-bone.
It gives the impression that a large dog resides inside the house--most thieves will not take the chance.

Remember--locks only keep honest people out. A determined thief will always find a way.

Good luck,
Allen.
 
Your garage door got one of those strings with a handle on it hanging down?

Well with a drill or a punch, hell a screwdriver to make a little hole thur the door I can then use a wire with a bend in the end to hook and pull that release.

Or just take the remote from your car if its outside.

As far as locks go,sure buy good ones.But as somebody who has taken down many a door,its almost always the wood jamb that fails.....If your $200 lock goes into 3/4 of pine well you gained nothing but a false sense of security.
 
Moving to Gadgets & Gear. :)
 
Statistically, people with dogs get their homes broken into far less frequently than non-dog owners. If there is one single thing you can do to improve your chances of a thief moving on to the next house instead of yours, it would be to get a dog.
 
This topic definitely applies to me. My house is a bit pathetic. The front door hinges are rotted out and even 4in screws aren't holding firm. I'm not even going to bother putting a deadbolt in because of how bad the hinge side is. The rear door opens OUTWARD (I know, pure genious). I wish I could remove the entire door assembly and remount it inwards, but I don't think thats possible and it might be too much work, especially dealing with the aluminum siding. On top of that, its one of those doors that has the huge window in the top portion of it. So, while I could install hinge bolts (like the UK people have to do) to prevent hinge attacks, anyone could still just break the window and unlock the door. I know that double cylinder deadbolts are one way to help with that, but as mentioned, they are dangerous in a fire or emergency. In addition to the door situations, most of my windows are old single panes that could be defeated with the classic butterknife trick. I'm going to gradually replace these over time. Are there any good window locks?

Long story short, should I even bother putting decent locks on the house? The garage will contain my more valuable items and I figured it would be much more secure than the house since there are no windows but the comments above lead me to believe that no garage doors are secure. :(

Mark
 
Outward opening doors are not necessarily a problem. They just require the use of either pinless- or interlocking-hinges. Interlocking hinges cost very little extra.
 
I've heard that the commonly-used lock brands are all easy to pick. Can anyone recommend brands that will make the job a bit harder for the bad guys? I know there is no absolute security, but I do try to make things as secure as I can reasonably manage.

I already have a metal doors, long screws, a monitored alarm system, and three dogs. Just looking to see what else I can improve. :)

--Bob Q
 
Bob:

I've heard that Medeco locks are probably the best out there. Not available at your local Home Depot. You need to get them from an authorized locksmith. Additionally, the keys are unique in that you can't get them copied at your local hardware store...I've read that you have to order them from Medeco.

FWIW, I've talked to a couple of locksmiths, and if you are going to go with a commercial lock, go with a Schlage (preferably a Grade 1). Run, don't walk, away from Kwikset locks.
 
Medeco locks are excellent, but expensive. The pins have to not only be lifted to the right level, but also turned the correct number of degrees. The key is cut in a special way to do this. Ordinary key-cutting machines can not do this and, in fact, no key machine can duplicate a Medeco key; they have to be cut from the code and only then by a Medeco machine.

Medeco locks have been picked, but it takes a very skilled locksmith hours and hours to do it with special tools. It's really not a practical technique.

Schlage offers a very comperable (at least in terms of security) system called Primus, which is expensive as locks go, but less expensive than Medeco. Primus locks have two rows of pins. It's actually a two-level key. The upper row can be cut on a standard Schlage key machine. But the lower-level can only be cut at the Schlage factory. Schlage assigns each retailer a code on the lower row and only sells blanks with that lower row cut to that dealer.

As far as I know, nobody has yet picked a Primus lock under UL rules.

UL rules? UL as in the people who put those silly tags on hair curling irons reminding us not to insert the iron into bodily orifices? That UL?

Yes, that UL. It stands for Underwriters Laboratories. Underwritter as in insurance. The insurance industry insures the people who make hair curling irons against product liability and also against theft from their factory so they take a keen interest in the tags that go on the irons and the locks that go on the factory doors.

But, picking isn't that important for residential security. Precious few residential breakins are accomplished by picking. Contrary to what you see in the movies, picking even a minimally decent lock takes even a skilled person a few minutes. And residential burglers don't want to stand at your front door picking the lock for several minutes.

Anyway, both Medeco and Primus feature "key control systems." This means two things: First, your key is 100% unique. In most other lock products, there are only maybe a hundred or two key combinations actually used. So, every hundredth house that has that brand of lock has the same key as your house. Second, the keys can only be duplicated by an authorized dealer. In the case of Primus, only at THE authorized dealer. To get keys made, you have to take your proof of ownership documents and ID documents to the dealer and sign the signature card and so forth and they keep track of how many keys exist and so forth. What this means is that if you give your key to someone, you know when you get it back that no copies were made. It means that when you sell your house and give the new owner five keys, he can go to the dealer and they can check the record and assure him that only five exist; so there's no need for the new owner to rekey.

Kaba is another such lock system, but they are dramatically more expensive and considered unpickable.

I think Corbin has a "key control system" product too.

This type of lock is required by insurance companies on certain types of buildings. But, the insurance requirements go beyond just key control and into the physical strength of the lock and so forth. As a result, these "key control system" locks are very good locks. They're also more expensive. You can expect to pay about $150/cylinder for the locks and $10/each for the keys. But, you do get what you pay for. Not only is this good for security, but these are just durable locks that last and last; they are an investment.

Me? I've got Primus on my house.
 
Schlage? *pukes loudly*

Sorry. I've worked as a locksmith for 9 summers. I hate Schlage! Too bloody hard to work with. Give me an LSDA any day- lot easier to work with, easier to repin if you have to, and easier to get new keys for.

However, in the years I've been working, and the 35 years Dad's worked as a locksmith, we've NEVER had a house broken into via picking. It's a lost art, overall. Heck, most locksmiths can't even pick anymore! Dad's a master at it, but why learn how to pick when you can boot the door? If you're that worried about your security, an alarm will do infinitely more for you than buying a superduper pick-proof lock ever will.

My house? LSDA all around. Knob and double-cylinder 2" throw on the back, locking into a reinforced 2x4. Front? Ditto. Garage? Yep. LSDAs are hard to find, and they come in two flavors- Chinese and American. The Chinese ones are cheaper, but the Americans are infinitely better built. Much stronger, better tolerances, all that good stuff. American LSDAs are becoming rare, but if I were doing my house again, I'd do it with those in a second.
 
To be truthful, I once ran with some shadey folks in my youth and I've never known any of them to ever bother picking a lock.

It was more like:
See if anyone was home, see if they had a dog, try to determine if there was an alarm--if the answer was no to all questions, then break a door window and unlock the door or break a room window and climb inside.

Regretfully,
Allen
 
The day you walk into the house, you should change all the locks. Who knows who had keys to it? The neighbour? Whose son has gone bad?

Change all the locks, make sure they're at least 5 lever mortice; do you use window locks in the US? if so, fit those, too. Get a alarm. Get to know your neighbours.

Here, life's a little more laid back. People still leave their doors unlocked (sometimes open).
 
If you want a lock that is very hard to pick get a abloy. I don't know if they are selled there but here in Finland almost every door has abloy lock and I think they aren't very expensive. About picking an abloy I have read that it needs a professional to do it and takes lot of time. I don't really know how abloys are costructed but they aren't pin thumbler locks.
I have just recently getted interested in lockpicking and learned that the basics of picking a pin thumbler lock are very simple, just needs training to learn to pick them.
 
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