Asking financial advice from members of the ESEE board

DH1

Joined
Nov 8, 2006
Messages
1,481
Yea, I trust you guys that much;)

Let's say someone had to turn about $10,000 in paper dollars into silver coins...what would be the safest way to go about it?

I spent a few days on the net researching this question, but want a "man on the street" opinion if you will. I'd like to walk into a bank or other establishment with a bank check/cash and walk out with coins, but it looks like I'll have to do this over the 'net (in small incriments of course).

Has anyone done something similar?
 
I'd start by asking the crack addict selling magazine subscriptions how to launder money... when it comes out that he's really just a poor college student, devise a mooching software that takes fractions of pennies from every transaction and deposit them into a seperate account.

In reality, I wouldn't have a clue. Been way too long since I've seen Office Space.
 
Why wouldnt a bank give you coins? If you want silver then invest in silver on the market. It will always go up thus making you more money. Then demand your money in silver bars.
 
the best way to do it is to buy silver dollars and lots of online dealers can take care of that, watch the metals market and buy low so you can sell high. most local coin shops could help you as well.

its a good way to hedge your funds and its a growth market, gold is good too for much less bulk.

take it easy
cricket
 
gold is good too for much less bulk.

I cannot comment on Silver but give serious consideration to Gold. 10k would be less than 10oz today. Easily carried in a small neck bag on your person and easy to sell.

Of course being South African I like 1oz Kruger Rands. They are also available in 1/2oz and 1/4oz. They universally recognized and easy to sell at any coin dealer.

In a situation like Katrina where you have to move quickly and light a nice little stash like that can safe your life.
 
I don't think you can turn $10,000 directly into $10,000 of silver dollars because silver dollars are worth more than their face value now because of collectors. However, you could buy silver ingots that are worth $500 and $1000 a piece from the same people that deal in gold and silver coins.

Check out your Yellow Pages and look for coin collecting shops, pawn shops that advertise gold and silver, etc. I know there was one place in town here that I use to watch people buy and sell the ingots of silver at quite a bit. It's where I would go if I wanted to buy/sell silver, and they're just kind of a coin and valuable shop--they sell comic books too.
 
There are plenty of US coins that are worth more in silver than they are as collectors items. There are also companies that mint their own "coins" with weight and purity stamped on them. Pan american silver is one.
 
How long do you plan on holding the investment for? Depending on your answer there may be better options out there unless you are looking at this more of a SHTF world economy collapse hedge...

Also don't forget any carrying costs the coins will have if you are not physically storing them in your residence.

My state offers tax free municipal bonds which have turned out to be a very good investment - as long as our economy doesn't crash, munie bonds are an excellent hedge, especially since now so many states are looking to invest inward to create jobs.

Also, just throwing the obvious out there - if you are sitting on a nice chunk of cash: if you have any bad debt I'd recomebd taking care of that first then investing...

On top of that, I know we are a bunch of smart fellers, but I'd also recommend reaching out to a few different financial advisors - consultations are usually free and you can learn a crapload!

Have fun and good luck!
 
My 2 cents:
Robert Kiyosaki, author of the Rich Dad series of books was on Alex Jones' radio show recently. He is very high on silver and feels it is even undervalued at $25/ounce citing the fact that for the 1st time in history the worlds gold and silver supply are equal, silver is continually being used up in industry. (electronics, cell phones). Robert has $2 million in net income a month not including books.
I would try to find a local dealer to establish a relationship with that is honest and won't do what the couple I've seen at gunshows do that is when silver went down to $15/ounce not too long ago, they were still charging $20/ounce because it was just going to go back up they said. Well if they truly believed that then they should have been mortgaging their homes and selling everything they possibly could to buy silver since it was such a sure thing to go up in their minds.
I would also pick a copy of "Coin World" and find a good dealer that has a low mark-up and operates on volume.
As far as gold vs silver, the 2 lines of thinking I've heard people use are: as has been said gold is more portable but if the economy tanks (the reason both are going up, right?) then it is easier to buy a loaf of bread with a pre-64 dime than break up a 1 ounce gold bar.
I hope this helps.
 
Jack over at The Survival Podcast has a lot of opinions on silver. He buys everything from coins to 10 oz bars. The down side at this point is that the price of gold and silver is through the roof.
 
10K transactions are the threshold for flags to be raised by the bank, FWIW.

Silver is better than gold for non-fiat currency transitions on the average scale (food, basic trade goods, etc.) gold is just too hard to divide for regular use "the currency of kings" as it is said.
 
I was thinking about this too...

10k (if I ever get a lazy 10K) and put it into gold. then whack it in a safety deposit box.
 
They also have fractional Krugerrands in 1/10th Ounce. :D

Gold and Silver has become such a racket now. I have sold some silver in the last few years, including about a month ago, and the people that buy it won't give you spot price for it. When you buy this stuff, you pay a little bit more so the guy can make some money because he is into selling precious metals, seems fair. Now they have to make money either way and they lowball under the spot as well.

So, as far as I can tell, the only real reason to have this stuff would be for a real calamity where you would have to buy safe passage or medicine or something really hard to get ahold of during an extended emergency/crisis.

Oh, and if you purchase fractionals, be they Kregerrands, Maple Leafs, American Eagles, etc., you pay more for the fractionals than you would an ounce. In other words, when you purchase a one ounce gold coin, you will be charged more than it is worth. As I said before, the guy has to make a living. But when you get into the fractionals of an ounce, like the 1/2, 1/4 and 1/10, you pay even more. Same goes for bars/bullions like Engelhard, Credit Suisse, etc. Yet the fractionals are perhaps the best thing to have for an emergency situation so you don't have to break out an entire Oz. for whatever you want to get because that is what you are going to pay for it, the entire ounce.
 
I have used these people numerous times, both buying and selling. Make sure to be aware of the minimum buy and sell amounts.

My favorite piece of advice in todays financial world: "Never invest money that you cannot afford to lose."

http://www.tulving.com/
 
Over the years I've had clients who get scared (y2k,etc) and want to "hold gold/silver coins".... I always tell them to pick a # they are happy with in SHTF scenerio (I can't imagine $ will be worth much for long) and then plan on losing 40-50% of that money when and if they ever turn it back into dollars... or some established market based currency.

Recently the Congress has initiated hearings on these Gold/Silver coin folks...it's yet to be determined how it all comes out.... be cautious...

Think hard about how many of these coins you'd really get a use out of...and just understand it's a personal decision about your values....not a financial decision. (IMHO)
 
I'm not too familiar with all involved in this but there are, I believe, some laws that you need to be aware of. It is illegal to horde money (physical currency) and gold as well, find out what amounts will be trouble. You may need to own your gold/silver in a collectible kind of way for it to be ok with the govt. IMHO such laws are constitutionally illegal, but hey when has that stopped our government!

Also remember when you have a something like gold or silver in your actual possession it is easy to steal. I hate to say this, but I'd strongly recommend not talking about stuff like this, especially in a public forum, there are clever, evil and generally greedy people out there who shouldn't know you're looking into something like this. Find someone who you can trust and knows there stuff. The fewer people know the better.
 
I'm not too familiar with all involved in this but there are, I believe, some laws that you need to be aware of. It is illegal to horde money (physical currency) and gold as well, find out what amounts will be trouble. You may need to own your gold/silver in a collectible kind of way for it to be ok with the govt. IMHO such laws are constitutionally illegal, but hey when has that stopped our government!

Also remember when you have a something like gold or silver in your actual possession it is easy to steal. I hate to say this, but I'd strongly recommend not talking about stuff like this, especially in a public forum, there are clever, evil and generally greedy people out there who shouldn't know you're looking into something like this. Find someone who you can trust and knows there stuff. The fewer people know the better.




Are you referring to the 1933 law? No longer applicable. I am aware of no limit to the amount of gold or silver a person has on hand.

You can buy $500,000 of silver and more off of ebay any day of the week from private sellers.

To the OP--

The safest, best way to do this is to buy from a reputable dealer. Here are some considerations:

1. Some states tax sales of metals. For example, Indiana does. Illinois does not. 7% on $10k is $700, half an ounce of gold and a pretty good chunk. If you are in a state that doesn't tax sales, all the better. If you can travel to another state that doesn't tax metals, do that.

2. Online is a very reputable way to buy from one of the biggies. They also have some of the best prices you are going to find. Monex.com, Apmex.com, etc. You will have to give them a credit card or bank wire so if you are looking for anonymity, forget it.

3. Some people want to buy anonymously. $10k transactions require a 1099. Several transactions in a short period of time that total $10k require a 1099. (It is called "structuring" in IRS parlance--attempting to get around the reporting requirement.

4. Private sales generally have the best prices as the spread between the buy and sell are not as great as a dealer. This can contain a certain amount of risk if you don't know who you are dealing with.

5. Think about your purpose of what you want this for. That will probably determine what kind of precious metal you want. If you want it strictly for investment, then you will pay less of a premium for bigger weights. If you want it because you think that the world will disintegrate and you want to use silver for bartering for ammo and food, then you probably want something easily recognizable that will have a value. pre-65 US coins (referred to as 90% silver or "junk" silver) will probably be your best bet. You could buy bags of these from dealers. If you want to bug out with significant amount of wealth and don't care about dividing it into smaller amounts, a small gold bar or 7 krugerrands or eagles might be your best bet.

6. You will hear this often if you get into this sort of thing: If you don't have it physically in your possession, you don't really own it. People that buy paper gold, eft's, gold that is stored somewhere, etc, may or may not actually have what they think or be able to access it when they need it.

Good luck.
 
The NEW 1099 requirements do not go into effect unil next year from what I can figure out.

<>Section 9006 of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act will amend the Internal Revenue Code to expand the scope of Form 1099. Currently, 1099 forms are used to track and report the miscellaneous income associated with services rendered by independent contractors or self-employed individuals. <>

http://ustimesweekly.net/department/nationalnews/patriotact_printer.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_PATRIOT_Act,_Title_III

http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/Taxes/P69839.asp

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/gold-coin-dealers-decry-tax-law/story?id=11211611

http://www.bullionbullscanada.com/index.php?option=com_kunena&func=view&id=727&catid=6&Itemid=122

http://www.howwealthworks.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=11110

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...-reporting-requirement-on-gold-105997533.html

http://www.numismaster.com/ta/numis/Article.jsp?ad=article&ArticleId=11843
 
Last edited:
Under the USA Patriot Act it is against the law to have more than $10,000 in cash. Here in PA people are stopped all the time on I-81 that have more than that and it is confiscated. I have not been able to get a straight answer if it is 10k per person or could a married couple have 20k combined.

I would like to know under what circumstances "people are stopped all the time" and their money is confiscated. That sounds like drug-running to me and the rest of their stuff is being confiscated because it consists of illegal drugs and firearms. I just don't see Ma and Pa Kettle in their Winnebago getting pulled over for a traffic citation and their motorhome being searched and their cash confiscated.

Added to that, if it is a business owner and they are doing gun shows or whatever kind of shows, it would seem to me that you could not confiscate someone's business money, especially on a weekend when they could not deposit that money. I don't put outright theft past the greedy and corrupt hands of this government even in the best of times, but there seems to be something else at work here.
 
Back
Top