At what point is a knife still NIB/LNIB vs outright used?

ctrsurf

ctrsurf

Joined
Feb 1, 2012
Messages
484
If I purchase a brand new knife directly from the knife maker or dealer, and resell it on the secondary market, at what point do I call the knife outright used?

What if I leave the knife in a box untouched for 5 years in a drawer? Or if, for example, I buy a Grimsmo Norseman or CRK and never carry it in my pocket, never sharpen or cut with it, but I open/close 100x & fondle it on my couch while watching TV, is the knife LNIB, excellent condition, or just plain used? What if utilizing a makers spa services and the knife is returned looking mint? What are the guidelines?

I mean absolutely nothing malicious or shady by my question... I've just not seen this discussed, and I see all sorts of acronyms in ad descriptions. I have been amazed with my transactions here- lots even tell me (unsolicited) that if I'm not stoked on my purchase they're happy to unwind the deal.:thumbup:
 
I say describe what you've done with it and let the buyer decide what condition it's in. Be as descriptive of the use you gave it to the best of your knowledge, using acronyms as a catch-all description can give people wrong ideas about the knife if they have different definitions of them than you.
 
That's sound advice- full, honest disclosure! It's definitely better to have a buyer be pleasantly surprised...
 
My definitions have evolved due to necessity. This is how i see it. And there are exceptions. The biggest of which is just because a knife came from the factory or maker with visible flaws it should be disclosed even if lnib or from the maker.

New- knife purchased direct from dealer or maker

Like new- knife sold via secondary market but in exact condition as received from dealer.

Excellent used condition - knife could have been fondled or manipulated and as such will have a broken in action but otherwise no visual signs it was used or carried. Factory edge intact

Gently Used - varying stages of use visible on close inspection. Damage and wear should be explained in detail. Factory edge may be present but touched up. Knife can be reprofiled if adequately done and shaving.

Used - same as gently used but wear and damage easily seen via naked eye. Edge can vary.

Heavily used/user - clearly shows heavy signs of use. Scratches, drops, worn through coatings all commonplace. Still useful as a tool yet low collectable value unless special circumstances. Factory edge completely gone.

For parts - broken or so heavily used it is dangerous to keep in rotation. Reduced to parts or conversation piece.
 
Agree with all above.

Full disclosure is the best policy. Call it as you see it but supply plenty of background to enable the buyer to decide for themselves.

Haven't seen anyone yet complain about getting too much info or too many pics. ;)


For your examples, I'd say something like ...

"xxx, NIB, untouched for 5 years in a drawer. Includes everything when bought new - box, papers, packing materials."

"Grimsmo Norseman, LNIB, never carry it in my pocket, never sharpen or cut with it, but I open/close 100x & fondle it on my couch while watching TV."

"xxx, Like New in Mint condition, just back from factory spa treatment. Polished and factory resharpened."
 
Excellent communication is the key to avoiding 93.4% of all interpersonal conflict. This is true in marriage, when talking to your HVAC guy about how you want the job done, and when selling knives on Bladeforums. So its not so much that magic words need to be used, but rather that complete and full disclosure is made. What Messrs. King and Travis said.
 
KingMC said:
I say describe what you've done with it and let the buyer decide what condition it's in. Be as descriptive of the use you gave it to the best of your knowledge, using acronyms as a catch-all description can give people wrong ideas about the knife if they have different definitions of them than you.
Click to expand...

That would work, but not everyone knows enough to judge wisely or accurately regarding condition, much less value.
"Chipped out blade? No, no...er...those are serrations, yeah. Serrations, that's the ticket."

New - As it is from the manufacturer. Has not been fondled, sharpened, disassembled, used to make sheathes, templates for scales, or cut anything. You are the absolute first owner.
LNIB - Handled, not resharpened, modified, carried, or used in any way. A knife that is purchased, then carefully admired. Not sharpened, not used, not carried, not damaged, not disassembled, or modified in any way.
Used - A knife that has seen the inside of someone's piocket for more than say a couple minutes. May have been resharpened or as some people love to say "touched up on my sharpmaker, and not it's really sharp..."

Mint is a term that most people should stay away from, it really does not do anyone any favors, especially when it is misused as often as it is.
 
TravisH said:
Agree with all above.

Full disclosure is the best policy. Call it as you see it but supply plenty of background to enable the buyer to decide for themselves.

Haven't seen anyone yet complain about getting too much info or too many pics. ;)


For your examples, I'd say something like ...

"xxx, NIB, untouched for 5 years in a drawer. Includes everything when bought new - box, papers, packing materials."

"Grimsmo Norseman, LNIB, never carry it in my pocket, never sharpen or cut with it, but I open/close 100x & fondle it on my couch while watching TV."

"xxx, Like New in Mint condition, just back from factory spa treatment. Polished and factory resharpened."
Click to expand...

Great examples, and I agree, thanks Travis! This shows that it's not necessary to ramble on, but that accurate disclosure can also be succinct. I've been building my rep on here to a point that I hope shows I can be trusted to sell...now that I'm at 13 @100% (I know, a baby compared to many) I plan on going Gold and selling some of my modest collection. I appreciate all input on this topic!

RevDevil said:
That would work, but not everyone knows enough to judge wisely or accurately regarding condition, much less value.
"Chipped out blade? No, no...er...those are serrations, yeah. Serrations, that's the ticket."

New - As it is from the manufacturer. Has not been fondled, sharpened, disassembled, used to make sheathes, templates for scales, or cut anything. You are the absolute first owner.
LNIB - Handled, not resharpened, modified, carried, or used in any way. A knife that is purchased, then carefully admired. Not sharpened, not used, not carried, not damaged, not disassembled, or modified in any way.
Used - A knife that has seen the inside of someone's piocket for more than say a couple minutes. May have been resharpened or as some people love to say "touched up on my sharpmaker, and not it's really sharp..."

Mint is a term that most people should stay away from, it really does not do anyone any favors, especially when it is misused as often as it is.
Click to expand...

"...serrations!" LOL! It seems that many could benefit from this advice Rev! Maybe some of this info could be sticky'd or linked somewhere in the Exchange...
 
RevDevil said:
That would work, but not everyone knows enough to judge wisely or accurately regarding condition, much less value.
"Chipped out blade? No, no...er...those are serrations, yeah. Serrations, that's the ticket."

New - As it is from the manufacturer. Has not been fondled, sharpened, disassembled, used to make sheathes, templates for scales, or cut anything. You are the absolute first owner.
LNIB - Handled, not resharpened, modified, carried, or used in any way. A knife that is purchased, then carefully admired. Not sharpened, not used, not carried, not damaged, not disassembled, or modified in any way.
Used - A knife that has seen the inside of someone's piocket for more than say a couple minutes. May have been resharpened or as some people love to say "touched up on my sharpmaker, and not it's really sharp..."

Mint is a term that most people should stay away from, it really does not do anyone any favors, especially when it is misused as often as it is.
Click to expand...

In your categories, where would a knife that was taken out twice out of the box. unfolded in the case of a folder in both instances. The first just when received and the second just to take pictures for sale? New or LNIB?
 
"new" means completely unused. Age has nothing to do with it, the knife model and other characteristics will let the buyer know how old the knife is.

"like new" means it could have been very lightly used- maybe it was in your pocket a time or two and maybe you cut open an envelope or sliced a piece of paper. You did not mess with the screws or mess with the edge in any way. The miniscule amount of use did not have any affect on the knife. You can't count on carrying a knife a day or two and not leaving any marks on it but I would suggest that most of the time you could not tell if a knife had been carried a couple of times.

I would recommend that a person NOT carry a knife, or sharpen it, or strop it, or open/close it a lot of times, or touch any of the screws, until you have made the decision to keep the knife and not sell it. Once you decide to keep it and do any of the above to it, it goes into the "used" category. It might be very nearly like new in box but you might have a potential buyer that is very demanding and won't be happy with the knife.
 
As this thread points out, NIB, LNIB, and Used can mean slightly different things to different people. A picture is worth a thousand words. I see no reason to "tell" anyone what kind of condition the item is in. I list everything it comes with, any salient facts in need of disclosure for an honest sale, then let pictures do the talking when it comes to condition. Take quality pics, as many as it takes to get all the angles covered, then be prepared to take more upon request. This leaves little open to interpretation.
 
^^^THIS!! I cannot understand for the life of me why there's so many ads with zero or horrible photos! "Email me for pics..."?!?!👎 It's 2015! Even the average 5 year old cell phone has a 5MP (or so) camera on it and will capture sufficient detail. "Taking lots of quality pics" is emphasized on the short list of instructions sticky'd in the exchange people!
 
I buy a new knife from a dealer, I open the blade and check it out. I will test the sharpness with several cuts on printer paper, and if it 's good, then a few cuts on Yellow Pages to see if it makes the grade. I take pics before selling the folder. (I never carry a knife other than my EDC which is a constant in my pocket...for months or years.)
So, when I go to sell that new knife, I describe the action, the centering, the lockup, and say that I checked sharpness on ptr paper, but have never carried the knife.
I sell this knife ANIB...as New in Box, which seems pretty reasonable.
 
Remember, a knife can be technically LNIB, NIB or even mint but have problems from the factory. These must be disclosed.
 
IMO the moment you see any signifigant blade wear, a "need" to resharpen, or the moment it is resharpened, it officially no longer "like new"...

Like new to me means it still has the factory edge, with unnoticeable or very minimal wear at best... Even if it was resharpened straight from the factory,maybe even a better edge then the factory edge, it still isn't " like new" any more, but to me, it has officially become used...
 
strategy9 said:
IMO the moment you see any signifigant blade wear, a "need" to resharpen, or the moment it is resharpened, it officially no longer "like new"...

Like new to me means it still has the factory edge, with unnoticeable or very minimal wear at best...
Click to expand...

To me that ain't "like new" that's used. It should be sold as "lightly used, no sign of wear, factory edge".

For those who say pictures are all you need, pictures are great but they cannot show everything. You are lying through omission if you don't give full disclosure of how you used the knife and if you bought it second hand to begin with.
 
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What is a knife's condition if you get it NIB take it out, gently lube it to prevent any future oxidation and return it to it's box. It never cut anything, was never flipped, was never carried or sharpened. I would still call it NIB, would you?
B
 
I'd probably say LNIB then explain the oiling.
It's a modification made to the knife after purchase so I don't think it's still NIB at that point.
 
I would say at the point where the seller desides to be 100% honest about it....

NIB to me means that is was bought new BY the seller from a store or maker.
He took it out and fondled it. ('Fondle' means opened and closed, looked it over)
Then he packaged it back up and put it up for sale.

Anything else is LNIB.

My guess would be that the majority of knives listed as NIB are actually LNIB, so the seller may have carried it, cut with it (no noticable trace) etc...

But you most likely will never know the difference on the knife unless it's obvious.
 
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